fred johnson

I like to remember that MBs are part of a larger advancement program. Everything works together to accomplish scouting's goals. That can only happen if scouts keep doing merit badges and continue to pursue advancement.

Plus, I like to remember every scout is different. A shy 11 year old working on citizen of the nation will "discuss" at a different level than a 17 year old that has submitted his college applications. One might barely utter a sentence. The other could keep going on and on and on based on more years in school.

#1 Key. Do not add or subtract from the requirements. Scout completes the badge when requirements are met. But ... REQUIREMENTS ARE STILL SUBJECTIVE.

#2 Be supportive and compassionate.

#3 "try" to find a way to give the scout a good experience.

#4 Feel free to add your own unique experience or perspectives. This is valuable to the scout.

#5 Use your judgement and common sense.

I'm okay signing off a scout as long as I can justify that the scout met the requirements and that it has been a learning / growing experience. Unfortunately, this does mean a different level of quality and quantity of output between an 11 year old scout on his 1st badge and a 17 year old scout on his 80th badge.

To be honest, I'm okay with that as long as the scout grew toward the scouting goals. Especially, if I inspired him to do more merit badges, pursue advancement and/or learn more about the subject.

I tend to be of a different view. Leadership instability. Seven scouts. Unless you have several (not one, two or three ... four or more) adults willing to be leaders who are really driven to make this work and triple the size of the pack, I'd cut your losses and get your sons into a healthy pack. Then just sit back, help if asked, but let your scouts have a healthy scout experience.

Does anybody know anything about the "Day of Service" at the Jambo?

 

I saw a Facebook posting from a young man who wasn't overly thrilled about the bus ride for the DoS.

 

It struck me that if every scout at the Jambo is to participate if DoS, over ten days, thats 3000 scouts per day! Is there enough work available to keep 3000 kids occupied every day? What type(s) of service are they doing? It seems like a logistical nightmare.

 

I view this as totally different than the adult leaders that pay $800+ to volunteer for Jambo. They know it. It's part of how it works for Jamboree leaders.

Wow. I was amazed at the article. A well meaning group is effectively white washing history. The Holocost WAS started as and continued primarily as an anti-semitic action. It WAS the "final solution" to the European Jewish problem. Nazis then used it to include the unwanted and those who opposed them including millions of Russion POWs.

 

It's insulting to even think of a Holocost memorial that does not include Jewish symbols. I'm proudly Catholic and have no offense to seeing those Jewish symbols used in such a setting.

 

It's not about the government endorsing a specific religion.

 

It's about telling the truth thru art and creating something meaningful that lasts.

http://www.britannica.com/holocaust/article-215485

Plus your numbers are also debatable and use the high end for other groups. Your Romani number is high. Many other sites puts the number closer to 250,000. I found it interesting that some sites categorizes the "ethnic poles" as "Polish Catholics". But that could be essentially because Poland was/is a Catholic nation.

This is my 10th year doing scout recruitment and my 10th year getting stuck in the middle of politics. Now, BSA has a brand new, inconsistent and wimpy new policy statement guaranteed to make no one happy. I just dread recruitment this fall. Doubt we will have a back to school night table. Doubt we can do in-school flyers.

I hope BSA fixes the policy statement before scouting dies.

Wow. I was amazed at the article. A well meaning group is effectively white washing history. The Holocost WAS started as and continued primarily as an anti-semitic action. It WAS the "final solution" to the European Jewish problem. Nazis then used it to include the unwanted and those who opposed them including millions of Russion POWs.

It's insulting to even think of a Holocost memorial that does not include Jewish symbols. I'm proudly Catholic and have no offense to seeing those Jewish symbols used in such a setting.

It's not about the government endorsing a specific religion.

It's about telling the truth thru art and creating something meaningful that lasts.

I think there is value in the paper triplicate blue card. Slows things down. Gets kids off the computer. Give then a pen and a blue card. It's up to them to fill it out, keep it, get it completed and hand it to his scoutmaster. Scouting is about face-to-face relationships and learning to deal with people. I think the BC does that.

DeanRx & dadof3ealges wrote very good comments. Though I'd put it in a "Parent Guide", calling it By Laws is little harm. The key is that it's stuff that is special to the unit. Money handling. Meeting spots. Committee using Roberts Rules (if necessary).

Perhaps taking the opposite is useful. Here is what I would **** NOT **** put in a Parent Guide or By Laws and actually scares me.

---- The advancement process.

---- Process and procedure flow diagrams and checklists

---- Anything beyond summary level introductions to BSA topics like advancement, ranks, uniforming, leadership, etc. Guides are useful to get parents up to speed, but the scout should use the Boy Scout Handbook and not face any contradictions created by documenting excessive processes and procedures.

I think units have By Laws that often include these because until the last ten years, you could not easily find all that info online. Now you can get online copies of the GTA, G2SS and many other documents easily. You don't need to re-document them so that the scout and their families know the detail.

Dear Sasha: Troops that do not need bylaws are fortunate. When I took over as committee chairman several years ago, the committee had serious problems with endless bickering and being unable to make decisions. (Perhaps this is because our troop is located in the Washington, DC, area, where pointless debate is sort of the local pastime!) We had a set of bylaws to which was appended a "parents' guide," which was a mishmash of rules and advice. The bylaws were too aspirational to be useful.

 

We are sponsored by the Catholic Church, which has its own rules and procedures, especially on youth protection, so we had a raft of issues to deal with and were not progressing well at all.

 

The first thing I did was impose Robert's Rules of Order, which is actually a wonderful thing if you understand the basics. Essentially, everyone gets his or her say but the will of the majority prevails. This avoids the vague "consensus" in which most people actually feel they have not in fact been heard. Decisions should be clear to all concerned. Only a majority vote gives you that clarity.

 

Then we reformed the bylaws to set up clear rules about committee operations. The committee has run smoothly ever since. We have an extremely successful troop with excellent fundraising, high-adventure activities, many Eagles, etc. (The troop had over 70 Scouts during my time and now has almost 100.) I won't say that solving the bylaws problem was key to this, but it avoided the time often wasted by unproductive meetings. Our biggest asset is an excellent Scoutmaster, and during my term as chairman (which lasted six years), I felt my biggest job was to support what he was doing and to keep the committee moving in that direction. With many lawyers, business people, and bureaucrats around the table, I felt that a firm structure was essential. You might not need it, but in cases of conflict and serious disagreement, bylaws come in very handy.

 

 

 

The only time you need bylaws, is after an event that you wish you had them for.... most often has to do with money or discipline. My 2 cents is that for the most part, by-laws are a waste of time and energy. The EXCEPTION to this rule is when $$ or discipline is involved. We had out cub pack chartered as a "frineds or..." for 3 years, no problem. Then the committee decided it would be a good idea to have ISA (individual scout accounts) - i.e. accounts with funds earmarked for a specific scout based on a % of their fundraising $ brought it. Ok cool. So, what can the scout use his ISA dollars for? What can he NOT (if anything) use ISA dollars for? What if he quits / drops out of scouts and still has money in his ISA? Can an older brother transfer ISA dollars to a younger brother when he quits or ages out of the program? All those are GREAT things to have a by-law to set the rule. That way, the committee is not making a decision on the fly when a scout or parent comes forward wanting a check cut for Johnny's left over ISA account because we're moving out of state and after all he EARNED the money.... best to have your ducks in a row before you get to that issue. Maybe have a by-law on how to handle a scout who is deliquent on dues... does he still get to go on the campout / activity?

 

The second area for by-laws is in discipline. I'm not talking a boy gets out of line on a campout and needs to be talked to. I'm talking a youth has a history of disrupting / fighting / etc... or does something that is not "illegal" but might be grounds for kicking him out of the unit (i.e. shows up at campout with porn). So, WHO and HOW is the decision made on what level of discipline to take? I've seen this be handled by the SPL, ASPL, and PLC (not a good idea IMHO as kids tend to be WAAAAY harder on their peers than adults). Is it left to the unit committee? The Key Three of CC, SM, COR? Or is it handled by the SM unilaterally, or by a panel of the SM and ASM's? If the kid involved has a parent in any one of the previously mentioned adult leader positions, do they or do they not have a say in the process? Again, hope you never have to cross that bridge, but best to have some rules of the road BEFORE the roadtrip commences. You don't want to be making up policy on the fly on something like that.

 

As for meeting times / locations / dues / etc... I figure all that can be determined by the folks on the committee at the time.

 

Dean

My guess is Mr. Rowe would be more impressed with MBs like Automotive Maintenance, Farm Mechanics, Welding, Plumbing, Electricity, Woodwork and Metalwork. Maybe Truck Transportation, Drafting, Painting and Animal Science. I suspect 4H and FFA are better positioned to deal with the skills gap that Mr. Rowe discusses.

Ya know ... "I THINK" that some program content is more appropriate for an older age. At younger ages, wo are teaching very basics about decorum and it's harder to get scouts back in control. Songs such as "announcements" are .... IMHO ... a bit much for younger kids. I am not sure at 6 years old kids can safely distinguish between being playful with rudeness and real rudeness. Similar to the bird song. Cubs know the 1st versus, but we save the shotgun shooting the bird and it decomposing versus for boy scouts.

As a former CM, with a son beginning again in Tigers this year, and a current ASM for a troop in which my older son is beginning his 2nd year (almost done with 1st class)... I'm living boht sides of this issue...

 

If I was king of BSA for a day, I would make the following changes: 1) get rid of Lions, 1st grade is soon enough to start. 2) Make Webelos 1 year instead of 2, and make itthe beginning part of Boy Scouts instead of the end of Cub Scouts.

 

The big change this would bring is that Boy Scouts is a "go at your own pace" program, unlike Cubbies that is a "do it all together in the same year" program. Let the older kids advance at their own speed and do their own things. It would also reduce the amount of years spent in Cubland, and thus decrease leader burnout with the younger kids.

Relax let the boy enjoy his scouting.......Absolutely everything he does in life doesn't have to be counted for something......

 

By-Laws? Oh puh-leez. These are Boy Scout Troops, not multi-level corporations.

If you want RULES, put 'em in your Parent Guide, and make very FEW rules. The fewer, the better. For example, "No sheath knives are allowed on Troop activities." That's a health and safety RULE. It is inflexible, and cannot be broken.

 

Then there are POLICIES. These are the things "the way we have always done them". Example: "Dues are due and payable on the first meeting night of every month." The difference between a RULE and a POLICY? A rule is something that is ironclad, not negotiable, cannot be broken without consequences. A policy is that which can be adapted to different situations/conditions over time.

 

Anything not covered in your rules and policies can be easily found in the Scout Oath, Law, and various BSA literature.

 

As for adult behavior, refer to the Scoutmaster Handbook, and the Troop Committee Guidebook. If it ain't there, you don't need it.

K.I.S.S. (Keep It Simple, Stupid!)

 

Throw that By-Law business in the trash!

It's funny though about knives. We just got back from summer camp. One of our scouts was carrying a belt mounted sheathed knife. He was responsible and took good care of it. It was not huge, but it was between 4" and 5" long ... I think. I just remember looking at it thinking it was a reasonable size knife. Anyway ... our toop always had the rule no sheathed knives. But we've all heard fixed blade knives are safer than pocket knives. So, we let him keep it and wear it. He was responsible and used it responsibly. Our unit rule is knives need to be reasonable and smaller than the size of the palm of your hand. His knife pushed that size, but it was reasonable.

qwazse ... Good point. I did not know that venturing encourages By-Laws. Interesting. I'm not sure that really changes things that much as it's establishing the orientation and structure of a venturing crew. Crews can specialize significantly, scuba vs hiking vs service projects vs ....

 

As for packs and troops, By-Laws are not for the scouts. By-Laws are for the adults and the adult leaders. I've been in units with By-Laws. The only people who read them are adults when they are arguing with each other or trying to nit pick. Scouts don't need By-Laws. They have their Boy Scout Handbook. The rest is noise unless it's written by BSA.

 

And specifically, I would NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT want adults to give feedback with the SPL or any youth in the room. Adults give feedback to the committee chair and/or scoutmaster. The SM & committee chair roles are to shield the youth and youth leaders from the whims of adults.

 

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My only other comment is why would you ever cringe that adults are reading BSA published documents. Your unit By-Laws should be consistent with the BSA policies and procedures or you are doing a disservice to your youth. You want your adults to learn as much as possible.

As for unit examples such as your uniforming suggestions, on the youth level, that's a word of mouth activity. For new / potential adults, it's in a new parent guide. Similar for scout accounts. Put what ya do in a parent guide documenting what's been agreed on. Same for dues etc. I just don't think By-Laws are needed. Mainly because it indicates a unit that really doesn't talk and needs formal procedures established beyond what BSA has already established.

qwazse ... Good point. I did not know that venturing encourages By-Laws. Interesting. I'm not sure that really changes things that much as it's establishing the orientation and structure of a venturing crew. Crews can specialize significantly, scuba vs hiking vs service projects vs ....

As for packs and troops, By-Laws are not for the scouts. By-Laws are for the adults and the adult leaders. I've been in units with By-Laws. The only people who read them are adults when they are arguing with each other or trying to nit pick. Scouts don't need By-Laws. They have their Boy Scout Handbook. The rest is noise unless it's written by BSA.

And specifically, I would NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT want adults to give feedback with the SPL or any youth in the room. Adults give feedback to the committee chair and/or scoutmaster. The SM & committee chair roles are to shield the youth and youth leaders from the whims of adults.

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My only other comment is why would you ever cringe that adults are reading BSA published documents. Your unit By-Laws should be consistent with the BSA policies and procedures or you are doing a disservice to your youth. You want your adults to learn as much as possible.

Yes, all children with gay parents will be stigmatized regardless of BSA's policy.

I know a friend who had sensitivity because he was adopted and never knew his "real" parents. He searched for them and found them. He viewed the people who raised him as his parents too, but it was very different. One set was blood and the other was a paternal friendship. With gay parents, you ALWAYS have at least one who is not blood related and sometimes two. It is a big difference. Adoption is a wonderful gift and an incredible service. But there is still a difference.

It's not about stigmatizing. There is a difference.

As for religion, many religions for centuries to come will teach that it is wrong. I have many close friends who are gay and they know I am Catholic and that I cherish my faith. We work together. We help each other. We care each other. But they know not to ask me to approve their lifestyle. We co-exist. That's America.

Twocubdad had a very good point. If you need By-Laws, it's about the charter org, not the unit. The Charter Org is not a BSA structure and for all practical purposes can be a church, a school, a group of parents or a gas station. Once you get into the unit, all voting rules etc are taken care of by BSA policies and procedures and BSA job definitions of who reports to who, etc.

Yes, all children with gay parents will be stigmatized regardless of BSA's policy.

BY-LAWS are not needed and are dangerous.

IMHO, they actually hurt because they create contradictions. It's really difficult to define unit specific "LAWS" that are new, important and consistent with currently existing BSA policies and procedures. BSA has published ALOT of detail and units and leaders are required to follow them.

Keeping everyone on the same page is important. Instead of BY-LAWS, re-create it as a parent guide. Document the ...

---- annual dues, budget, fundraiser, costs

---- meeting times and dates

---- expectations for "active" and positions of responsibility

---- Where to look for more detail

-------- BSA guide to advancement, GTA

-------- BSA insignia guide

-------- BSA guide to safe scouting, G2SS

-------- BSA handbooks (scout, scoutmaster, etc)

Actually, this already exists. If 2 units have the same CO, they can share a committee.

Integrate K-12... you can solve this. I have problems with GSUSA's program, but their structure is informative:

 

My wife is a Girl Scout Troop leader, in their program, they have two general "options."

 

Option 1: Single Level Troop, you take your daughter and her friends, and year after year you bridge to the next level, think a Cub Scout Tiger Den walking through Eagle generally with the same leaders. These Troops don't acquire gear or any permanence, but they have fun, and they use Council/Service Unit gear/events. Their service unit offers a "Mall Campout" and a "Movie Theatre Lock In" and other stuff... all the things we arrange at the Pack level for Cubs is done via the Service Unit, since most Troops are glorified Dens. The two leaders run their program, not Pack leadership exhaustion. All you need is the few meeting leaders, and you're off and running.

 

Option 2: Multi-level Troop: whatever levels you want, you register. The girls work on their appropriate level achievements (hopefully with leaders for each). This gives you some permanence, because you're recruiting new Kindergarten Daisies each year. You can meet your levels separately or together, whatever you want, total flexibility.

 

In my District, nearly every active Pack we have has a related Troop through the CO (there might be a few Elementary School PTA affiliated ones, but I think even they have a troop that meets at the Elementary school as well). We nod at Round Table about letting the boys explore different troops, and there is SOME people switching, but as a rule, the Boys migrate from Pack to Troop. The well run Troops have their grizzled experienced leaders help out in the Pack and make sure it's feeding good Scouts in.

 

I'm generalizing, apologize if it appears sexist, occaisionally the genders flip, but this seems the general trend:

Pack Leadership is one to two dads with a few boys running campouts.

Den Leadership is the moms running the den activities.

The Pack Leadership moves on to the troop when their boys cross over, the Den leadership is tired and burnt out.

 

This isn't how my pack functions, BTW, just my observation from Round Table.

 

Our Pack Committees are all a joke, our Troop Committees might be better, not sure, mostly because people spend more time there. Once their oldest son hits Troop, parent moves their attention there (why worry about the pack when your younger sons will be in the troop soon anyway), so the Troops have way more volunteers.

 

I'd replace our named Unit Level Committees with a Charter Org: Scouting Committee (obviously you could run two or three committees if you want). The Committee Chair would be responsible for Scouting, K-20. I'd allow flexibility in finances, the Committee can set policies for how to allocate funds between Scout Accounts, Den Budgets, Pack Budgets, Patrol Budgets, Troop Budgets. Create positions for Pack Subcommittee Chair, Webelos Subcommittee Chair, Troop Subcommittee Chair, Venture Subcommittee Chair that Units can use if they want. Basically, unify the paperwork.

 

I'd Split: Cub Pack: Lions, Tigers, Wolves, Bears: Create a special badge you wear on the Webelos/Boy Scout Uniform that shows you Cub Ranks earned like we do for Arrow of Light, replace the Tiger "Elective Beads" with Arrow heads, make Lions a SIMPLE program, they just get a bead every week, no 10 Electives = bead nonsense, too advanced for young kids.

Webelos Patrols: Autonomous, with a Patrol Master, transitioning between them. Get rid of Bobcat from Webelos, start learning the stuff you need for your Scout Rank. You can wear the Cub Belt Loops, because why not. For Webelos, I would create a GTSS that explains when they do things with the Pack (leadership at Pack Meetings), when they do things with the Troop (Den Campouts), but start moving them towards Troop, but an Adult Led Patrol. Maybe Webelos is one year only, but I think rising 5th graders might be young for Boy Scout Camp... Maybe a junior Scout Webelos Camp where they start working on Scout Skills in a more age appropriate manner. Not sure here.

Troop/Patrols: more or less as is, but focus on it as a three to four year core program. This should be a boys to manhood program that we acknowledge they age out of. Down here, most Eagles were active in middle school, in high school they get involved in other things and go to an occasional camp out, and maybe Scout Camp to wrap up their merit badges, then come back for their Eagle project at 16 or 17. Instead of the senior scout real leadership, use makeshift leadership to give middle schoolers a taste of it.

Venturers/Sea Scouts: integrate more. Troops should evolve into them. High Schoolers don't want to hang out with Middle Schoolers, let along fifth graders. Make this a more appropriate program for high school scouts who aren't going to make time for Scout craft but can hone leadership and really grow.

 

Sorry, I wrote a book, but in summary:

One Committee: let the parents unify efforts, let me run one set of books for all programs even if the levels have bank accounts, let that be our choice. Simply the administrative paperwork.

Cub Scouts: Lower Elementary School, K to 3

Webelos Patrol: Upper Elementary School (4-5)

Scout Troop: Middle School (6-8)

Venturer Crew: High School (9-12)

 

For reference, GSUSA Levels:

Daisy (K-1)

Brownies (2-3)

Juniors (4-5)

Cadettes (6-8)

Seniors (9-10)

Ambassadors (11-12)

 

While Seniors/Ambassadors have different activities, as far as we can tell, in my wife's service unit, they are all either single grade units so they just swap books/uniforms, or a multi-age Troop that is Seniors/Ambassadors, but that might be because the weird Ambassador level is only 5 years old.

 

I think this is an effort by GSUSA to sell more stuff, since girls won't outgrow uniforms like boys and can use the same one from 6 to 12, so first they switch the levels, then the switch the vest/sash, but we'll see.

 

Either way, they let you organize how you wish (a K-12 multi-age Troop could have a single Bank Account, Treasurer, Budget, etc), and set your own Camping Rules (could do a Family Camp for Brownies/Juniors, and a Patrol Camp for Cadettes/Seniors/Ambassadors if you want). They don't really do "ranks" like we do anymore, but are totally flexible and have age based stuff to do.

 

But I think that Cubs is burning out your leaders because Den Leader is really intense, and almost none of us, on the ground, have separate Pack Committees from Den Leadership. Letting us join forces with the Troop would let us focus on our Dens, and would let the Troop parents focus on making sure we're feeding them good Scouts. In Practice here, since most Webelos->Troop Transitions are in the CO (my SE told me to focus on relationship with our Troop since that's where we want the boys to go), having us run two or three parent committees simply requires more adult leadership than we can muster.

 

Added Benefit, Cub Parents would SEE what is going on at the Troop more if they were encouraged to interact more, and they'd understand that once their boys leave Cubs for Webelos, their involvement lessons, and after that to Troop, the boys are on their own.

".... #1 & #2 ... you have the person who raised the money choosing how to use it and being the first to benefit and often the only to benefit because of wear and tear. "

 

No, my troop benefits first because if the boy is prepared, we don't have to interrupt program to fish around for an old uniform or treat for hypothermia or buy the kid boots (if there were no spares in the troop store from previous stewardly purchases via ISA's).

 

"Plus, if I donate my son's shirt after four years, I don't get to write off the full price of a new shirt. You get the garage sale price / value. Anything else is fraud. "

 

- Nobody's making you use your son's ISA to by that uniform. If the boy uses his ISA, it's the troop's uniform, not his. So when he hands it down, it's not a donation, it's mere stewardship of troop resources.

- You're certainly welcome to abstain from the troop's coffers and roll the dice on some organization wanting that ratty shirt after four years so you gain a write-off. Hope your boy respects his uni enough to make it worth your while.

 

In fact, we don't make a boy use his ISA for anything at all. He can opt for it all to go back to the troop's coffers.

 

Importantly, note the lack of boy-led in the statement "if I donate my son's shirt after four years, I don't get to". Isn't it your boy who would be applying for the write-off? Because really, if we compensated him for popcorn sales in the true sense, wouldn't the 1099 be in his name?

Your reasoning is the same that football parents would use to deduct the cost of their son's football uniform and summer camp costs.

You want to reach a conclusion that is a bit more aggressive than I could sign up to following.

I can't get this page to scroll and lock-on, so am starting a new reply. There is a big diff between cash and credits: actual cash comes out of the Scout's wallet, while credits are a paper entry in the overall troop account -- the Scout never actually sees this as money, but just sees a bookkeeping entry. An example: 3 weeks of summer camp is going to cost $300. The Scout is told it is going to cost 300 credits.He has 200 credits in his ISA, so has to come up with $100 in cash.

 

King Dong: bake sales are exempt because everyone is supposed to understand the baked goods are baked in homes by amateurs, and you take your chances

 

So, if we stop valuing ISA in dollars, and switch to credits, even though there is a one to one correspondence, and everyone understands the ISA has to be spent within the troop (camping fees, uniforms, Scout Shop training kits, patches & badges, etc) many of the problems should be resolved

"Most" of what you described is probably okay, but defends different specific situation than originally discussed. Fine. Nonprofits can use funds as they decide to benefit their target audience. Buying clothes for specific homeless people is a classic example. You do not need to spread funds evenly. You can have scholarships. Fine. Nonprofits can allocate funds to serve their purpose. It's the whole idea.

And you are right ... it's key that ISA "credits" not be based solely on fundraiser performance.

But it's a very dangerous game. The issue is when private benefit creeps in.

EXAMPLE - A troop crosses that boundary with a policy of pay $100 annual dues or sell $250 in popcorn or work 10 hours selling popcorn. There the profit from the $250 in popcorn sales earned by the non-profit is being targetted directly to one individual in exchange for having earned sold that popcorn. Same with working 10 hours. The scout is avoiding paying his $100 annual dues. It's using non-profit status to benefit a private individual.

We've done scout scholarships because of need, but I don't want our troop having a committee deciding who gets how much. Especially as it's mostly the parents of the kids in the troop.

I also don't want a shopping list of how to earn credits or a treasurer having to keep track of it.

.... $ 2 ISA credit(s) = 1 hour working on volunteer servic project

.... $ 10 ISA credit(s) = 1 month as PL

.... $ 15 ISA credit(s) = 1 month as ASPL or QM

.... $ 20 ISA credit(s) = 1 month as SPL

.... $ 1 ISA credit(s) = Attend one meeting

.... $ 20 ISA credit(s) = Attend a weekend camp out

.... $100 ISA credit(s) = Attend a week long summer camp

It would be different if the troop said we have $1000 allocated to reduce scout costs. Let's allocate the money back out based on various criteria. It would also be different if the money is a small amount of the total raised.

It's just not a simple topic and very case by case specific.

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QWAZSE ... you walk a fine line still.

.... #1 & #2 ... you have the person who raised the money choosing how to use it and being the first to benefit and often the only to benefit because of wear and tear. Plus, if I donate my sons shirt after four years, I don't get to write off the full price of a new shirt. You get the garage sale price / value. Anything else is fraud.

.... #3 & #4 ... beyond questionable. Especially as any camp attendee can claim they are doing service or representing their troop. To do this, IRS would need to treat all youth scouting costs as tax deductible. But, they aren't. Youth may be doing service / representing their units, but they are 1st and foremost "enjoying the activity."

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Everyone wants to define their own view point. That's not how it works. The IRS and the courts require you to use their terms and their interpretations. Guess who wins. It's moot though as most scouting $$$ are just too small to get attention.

But just because we are too small to get corrected does not make you right.

And I do fear it as our troop has $25,000 easily going thru the checking account each year. Most of it passes thru with popcorn, wreath and camping costs. But it does pass thru.