Eamonn

Basementdweller A few years back when I was District Chair. Someone in the Service Center was making a fuss about having a budget for each and every District Activity. (I have another good war tale about this, which I might post later.) I sat down with the DE, ordered a pizza, opened a bottle of wine and we started going over all the budgets. After a while I noticed that we didn't have a budget for the Cub Scout Olympics. I thought this was a little odd. The DE said that she would check it out and get back to me. A few days past and she called to tell me that there was no budget for the event. I remembered that a few weeks earlier my Mother-In-Law had been clearing out some of the stuff from back when she was a Den Mother and that there had been something about the Olympics in the pile. I'd filed it and was even able to find it!! It was the rules and list of events for the first Olympics back in the 1960's. Reading over it it soon became clear it was the brain child of one guy. A really wonderful Scouter Old Pete Rice. Pete and his side-kick Ben had organized the event, but had made it a Pack event, inviting other Packs to participate. Sadly by the time I read this Pete was no longer with us, but Ben was and still is. I called Ben who has twin boys about my age and the three of us back in the day were very close. I asked Ben what the deal was with the Olympics? He explained that when the event started several hundred Cubs participated. They wanted to ensure that every Cub Scout got a shirt and that the medals and the stuff they gave to the little fellows was not junk. Pete had thought that if the District got involved that the Council would see all the money and want a cut! So the event was never a District event even though it was called the District Cub Scout Olympics. Ben went on to say that over the years a committee had managed the money, buying the equipment that was needed and that by doing things this way they had not had to go back and ask anyone for what they needed. When I put the phone down from talking with Ben. I felt like Tom from the Tom and Jerry cartoons. I had a little Angel on one shoulder and a little Devil on the other. The Angel was telling me that I needed to change things and bring the event under the District. The Devil was saying if it's not broke, don't fix it. I went with the Devil. My point is that a Pack can organize an event and invite other Packs to participate. I don't know what sort or type of events you want for the little fellows in your area? There are some that do need the OK from the powers that be, but not very many. I'll bet my last dollar that when a District Activities Committee sees that something is happening and they are not involved? They will want a piece of the action. When they do? Or what they do? I don't know. But it's great fun to find out!! (There goes that little Devil again!!) Eamonn.

"if FOS was boycotted National would have to supply that lost revenue." The person who looks after the accounts runs into the SE's office " Hey George you know we don't have enough money to cover payroll this month?" SE: "Don't worry Brenda I'll call the bank and use the line of credit". Time passes. Council President says to SE " Do you know that we have used $100,000 line of credit at the bank?" SE: "Yes we ran out of money due to no money coming from FOS,but don't worry we'll just sell the camp" Each and every Council is a corporation and there is no way that National is ever going to come in with and money to save a Council. (Of course I'm betting that you knew that!) Ea.

Basementdweller, If you have questions about this merger, which it seems that you do have. Avoid talking to the professionals. At the end of the day they are only doing what the Board has instructed them to do and there is a very good chance that anything you have to say will never get to the people who matter. Volunteers should as much and as far as possible talk with other volunteers. You might want to check how the Executive Board in your Council is set up. If there is a vice-president for District Operations? He is the man you need to talk with. If not the Council President is the guy. Chances are that the President (Or VP) is not going to get involved with "House Keeping" issues such as where the R/T will meet. But he or she should be able to give some guidance as to the selection of the District Chairman and District Members at Large. The Council Commissioner should appoint the District Commissioner for the new District. He or She will select R/T Commissioners and they will decide when and where the R/T will meet. I'm guessing as things are now that each District has its own people taking care of things like Advancement, Training, Camping and all the rest of the Committees that go into making a District Committee? In a perfect world everyone would work with the new District Chairman (Who might for this year be appointed by the Council Executive Committee, or might be nominated and voted in at a special District Meeting where the COR and the District Members at Large vote.) They should all be able to check their egos at the door before they meet and be able to go about getting what needs to be done? Done! But as we know this isn't a perfect world. The Council I serve went from five Districts down to four about fifteen years ago and there are still people who are unhappy. Some people are now saying that we need to go down to two as a way of saving money (Cutting two DE's.) With our falling membership and falling income, my feeling is that it is now a matter of when not a matter of if. The District we more than lightly will merge with has a lot of mule-headed wonderful Scouter's and the District I'm in has just as many wonderful mule-headed Scouter's. Of course not everyone or everybody is going to get what they want or even what they think is best. Who knows? Maybe some deals might be done under cover of night, is smoke filled rooms? Sadly, some people will allow their feeling to get hurt and may even allow themselves to become upset. As for what I might do? I've always said that I do this for fun. I sure as heck am not going to allow myself to get upset or allow my feeling to get hurt. I love work! If someone wants my job? I'm happy to watch them while I wish them all the best. Ea.

I'd really like to see less empathize on advancement and more on participation. Eamonn

Chug, Are you talking about world Scouting? I see a lot of merit in what emb021 posted and given the chance would love o sit down and chat with him about it. But being as you are tucked away in that fair land (Man I'm now singing ELP songs!) across the sea. Maybe you might want too explain what you are really asking? Eamonn.

Come on BadenP! You know as I know FOS money doesn't go to National. So holding it back only harms the kids in the area where you live. Eamonn. (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

Wow!! With West Virgina just down the road (Part of our Council covers Fayette county) Just imagine all the trouble I can get into? Eamonn

"There is nothing wrong with teasing." Yes Ed you might be right? Still I'm trying hard to see how teasing goes hand in hand with "A Scout is kind." My point about the word Hazing was that for me and maybe it's just me? Hazing goes beyond teasing. I'm not sure where the line is? But I do know it when I'm confronted with it. How we react to being teased? Is really in the hands of the person who is on the receiving end and maybe is dependent on who is doing the teasing? I have many good friends who when they bring up my less than smart deeds, do so in a way that really intends no harm. But were someone else to bring up the same deeds and try to make out I was really stupid and really dumb things might change. Eamonn.

How very sad. My thoughts and prayers are for the young camp staffer, his family and friends. Along with the Scouts in that area. Eamonn

I'm with shortridge. It's not about the dues, it's more about the way things are being managed. Boys and some really dumb adults can find a reason to tease just about anyone about just about anything. It's the teasing (Hazing? Seems like a strong word??) that is wrong. Eamonn

I'm not into any of the magazines like People Magazine or the National Enquirer. Truth is that last time I picked up a People Magazine while waiting in the Doc's waiting room, I didn't know who about 75% of the People were. I do when it comes out, at times look at the Forbes lists of rich and richest people, billionaires and the like. Wrong as it might be I took some comfort last year when my investments were taking a hit, seeing that guys like Buffet were in the same boat. I wouldn't have had any idea what Mr. Mazucca earned or got paid if it hadn't been posted here. Now that I've seen it? I think it seems like a lot of money. Not bad for a guy with the education that he has. I have never taken the time to see how the BSA is set up. I know that on the advise of my accountants and lawyers, when I was setting up my businesses I set up several different companies, which while all linked and all owned by me, were set up so as to avoid liability and ease my tax burden. I'm guessing that within the BSA there are a few different corporations. I'm guessing that LFL is separate? Same goes for supply, Magazines and so on. I'm not ever going to take the time. Why? Because I really don't care. I'm far more worried and concerned about what is happening in my area and my community than I am about what Mr. Mazucca is being paid. Eamonn. (I was upset when People Magazine didn't list me as being the most sexy man in the USA. I'm thinking that I might need more than just sexy knees? )

While maybe there isn't a voice that stands out here in the USA. When you look around the world at different Scouting Organizations and Associations there are within that country people who are the voice of Scouting. Carl Gustaf king of Sweden is very active in both Swedish and world Scouting. The Brits, who when I was a Lad over there seemed to have made owning a castle, wearing a kilt along with a nice title a requirement for Chief Scout seem now to have gone for TV personalities. The new fellow they have is controversial television survivalist Bear Grylls. His accomplishments transcend mere showmanship (he did climb Everest at the age of 23.) Piet Kroonenberg is the Historical Consultant to the European Scout Committee, and was awarded the Bronze Wolf in 1996 for his outstanding contribution to International Scouting. Piet writes with the authority of having been active in Scouting since before the Dutch World Jamboree in 1937. In a lot of countries the monarch, president or head of state is active in Scouts and Scouting in that country. While of course everyone has heard of BP. The same can't be said about many of the people who are seen as icons of American (BSA) Scouting. I'd never heard of James E. West or Bill Hillcourt when I was Scouting in the UK. Sad as it might be. We only have to look at our own Councils to see that Council Presidents and Council Executive Board Members are now selected from the business community, with a good many (Not all!!) knowing very little about what I might call grass roots Scouting. When I was selected as District Chairman, it had more to do with my owning a local business than anything to do with any knowledge of Scouts and Scouting that I might have had. Eamonn

Not sure what the normal way this is managed is? A Scout in our Council did make an appeal. National send all the paperwork back to the SE. He was asked to sort things out. He in his infinite wisdom passed it along to me. It turned out that a District BOR had messed up, so the situation you describe isn't/wasn't the same. I don't have OJ's Eagle Scout stuff close at hand. But I seem to remember that the Eagle Scout Rank is awarded by the National Council and is signed by the Honorary President (The President of the USA.) The President of the BSA at the time and the Chief Scout Executive who is in office at the time. Refusing to present the award might by some be seen as going against the wishes of these three gentlemen? The Scout receiving the award can choose who he wants to do the presentation. Being as he can ask, I suppose the person asked has every right to refuse. Some Scouts back in 2001 had their awards presented by the then Chief Scout Executive at the Jamboree. What a Troop decides to do is up to the Troop/CO. I kinda think if the Scout wins his appeal and is still a member of the Troop? He ought to receive the same treatment as any other Eagle Scout. He is when all is said and done an Eagle Scout. Eamonn.

I wasn't thinking about DE's! While the adults that are new to Scouting do tend to look up to any DE. (A new one or one that has been around for a while.) Some people unfair as it might be judge a new DE on how good a job the last guy did. This puts the new DE between a rock and a hard place. If the last DE did a great job, it's a hard act to follow. If he did a lousy job? Then at times the new guy gets painted with the same brush! We in the Council I serve have been very fortunate that DE's as a rule have tended to stay in the Council for a long time. Being as we are a small Council with only four Districts, I think the professionals feel safe once they get to know the volunteers and find out who can do what and is willing to do it. In the District I'm in. We had a really outstanding DE, who did a great job and was liked and admired by just about all the volunteers. The guy who followed her was really bad. At the same time a lot of things were going on! The FD was arrested for doing something naughty to his son's girl friend! So we never seen him again! The Council finances went bad and the SE read the writing on the wall and moved on, before he was asked to move out. So this new DE didn't have anyone to take him under their wing, or train him. He choose to fall into some bad habits -Not returning calls, or emails and being really hard to get a hold of. He only lasted two years and when he went, no one was sad too see him go. I think a big part of he problem was that the volunteers were taking the running of the District a lot more to heart than he was. His replacement is while not as outgoing and friendly as the female DE that was in the District for nearly ten years, is doing a far better job. He has looked for people who will get the District moving in the right direction and who do get the job done. At times what might seem as this "Clubiness" is more to do with people feeling over protective about what they are doing and they fear that someone new will come in and mess things up! This isn't always a bad thing, but when they are not doing a good job?? Then at times there can be problems and finding a tactful way of moving them is needed. I in the past have given people some great sounding titles ( Boy's Life Coordinator, District Procurement Officer!) as a kinder way of moving them aside to make room for someone else. Eamonn.

You might want to meet with the members you have now and come up with a plan of things that the Crew is going to try and do over the next year. We try for one event a month. Some events are not that exciting, like over Christmas they just meet at a local Pizza Hut and eat (Seems that these guys are always eating!) All night bowling always seems like a big hit. While they enjoy this sort of thing, the main reason for us having them is to keep everyone in contact with each other. They enjoy seeing each other and finding out what everyone is up too. Depending on where you live? Some fun events can be put on a calender. Our guys have a ski day planned, but I'll bet that when the time comes they will want to go tubing instead. It is far easier to invite people to something that is planned than invite them to come and then ask them what they want to do. Once they are in, then they can start coming up with ideas and planning events that they want to do. Ea.

I didn't get up to visit our Council Summer camp this year. OJ was working as the Camp Nurse for part of the time. He had a great time, many of the guys who had been officers in the OA when he was an officer seemed to have found a way of making their way back. This little gang were a super group when they were Scouts and I kinda think that most of them are going to be around for a very long time to come and will in time become the guys who are the movers and groover's in the Council. I owe the Reservation Director a dinner, so in the next few weeks, I'll have him and his wife over for dinner and I'm sure that he will fill me in on how things went. Before camp we had dinner and he said that they were expecting about 1,100 Scouts this year, about the same number as last year. Over the years summer camp has gone from lasting eight weeks down to now only being open for six. I have heard it said that if it wasn't for the Troops coming from out of Council that it might have to be cut back even more. A lot of time and a lot of money goes into the camp. Every year it seems that I hear about a new camp truck or a new tractor. Equipment like tents and canoes are always being replaced. Keeping the food service areas safe and up to code seems to entail a lot of maintenance and costly repairs. Camp was over this past Saturday, some of the Staff went off to NOAC. Leaving those that were left to tear down, in the next few weeks there will be an OA weekend and the Lodge will finalize stowing everything where it is supposed to be. I'm not sure what else is going to go on at camp. I think before camp opened there was a NYLT course, if enough people sign up there could be a religious retreat. In October there will be the last OA weekend of the year. Then it really is done until next spring. The camp is open for Troops to use for Troop camping. But being as it's up in the mountains once the snow comes it can be at times impossible to get in or out of. There is a couple of really nice building that could be used for winter activities but the cost of renting the buildings has got so high that many of the smaller Troops just don't have the numbers to make renting the building within their reach. I have always thought that having all of this equipment and only using it for summer camp is not a very good return on our investment. While of course having a fully staffed summer camp up and running when no one is around would be silly. I think leaving a few sites up and maybe leaving the Cub Scout camp up, so that units or Patrols could make use of it would seem like a good idea. I feel sure we could find a few willing volunteers that have the qualifications that would be willing to open the pool and the ranges.. Even the kitchen and dinning hall could go into more of a snack bar type operation, serving hot-dogs and burgers for people who just want to come up for the day. Over the past few weeks in the forum there has been a lot of talk about Training. From now until the snow comes I feel sure we could gather a few willing trainers who could offer what could be called Clinics on outdoor skills, inviting people up to come and learn or brush up on skills. As far as I'm concerned having a wonderful resource that is only used for a few weeks a year? Just seems silly. I know that having summer camp done and safely packed away until next year is what we have always done and I can hear some people saying that having parts of it open will mean that some Scouts are not going to want to come up for the week. Still next time I'm thinking about my FOS donation.... Eamonn.

In the past Councils and Regions wouldn't issue Tour Permits for units wanting to camp within a set limit around the Jamboree site. I think it was 50 Miles? But please don't quote me, as I'm not 100% on that one. I haven't seen the rules for 2010, but I'm guessing they will be the same. Eamonn.

Many Councils through their LFL, do get into schools and do an interest survey. You might want to ask if your Council has done one and ask to see it. To be very honest, I have never had much joy when it comes to mailings. They have never worked for me. Some things you might want to try. Ask the DE to get you a list of all the Boy Scouts who are over 14 who didn't recharter this year. A phone call to these Lads sometimes works. See what youth are involved with your CO. The Ship I'm connected with keeps a news board in the entrance of the club telling what the Ship has done recently. Many of the members who have daughters didn't know that girls could be in the BSA. Talk with local churches and youth groups. Talk with local SM's. They at times have older Scouts who are still on the charter but might do better in a Crew. Keep as many of the youth that you have on this years Charter. They do come home! Many still want a place to hang out with when they do come home and look for things that will get them out of the house. In our area more and more kids are going to community colleges and colleges that are close to home. It is still possible to plan and have events, without having to have weekly meetings. Eamonn.

"Maybe you live in a unique microcosm of everything is rosy," Been wondering if this is a long winded way of saying that a Scout is cheerful? Maybe when it comes to this "clubiness"? I really am guilty of living in this so called microcosm of everything is rosy? Truth is that in the many years I've been around Scouts and Scouting I have yet to see anything that might be taken for "clubiness". If anything the exact opposite. As a group Scouter's at least the many thousands I've met seem very willing to accept and help new faces. Of course it's a two way street, if someone acts like a real twit,people will in turn treat him like a real twit. Eamonn

http://www.omaha.com/article/20090801/NEWS01/708019939 Eamonn

"It is indeed a sad commentary on our texting and twittering society today where "ME" is the only thing of importance." Everything I have read points to the exact opposite. It seems that more and more people especially young people are in fact volunteering. But.. I suppose before I can ask people to volunteer I need to have some idea what I want? To do this I need to do my best to try and see what the youth want. Truth is I don't think the expectations of the youth we serve today are that much different than what I expected as a Lad. I wanted to have fun I wanted to hang out with my pals. I wanted to do stuff away from the watchful eye of my parents. I wanted to be accepted for who and what I was. I wanted to do new things, go to new places. Once I was in I found that: I enjoyed the rough games. I enjoyed the adults who didn't make me sit down and listen. (I'd done that all day at school.) I enjoyed the fact that the adults and other members of the Troop were willing to trust me. I enjoyed being recognized. When I was very young I imagined myself as being all sorts of hero type people exploring new and dangerous new territory. One day I might be Daniel Boone, the next BP in Africa and so on, in time I kinda outgrew this, but when confronted with a nuclear isotope and a chance to save the world? I was your man. So with this in mind what do I expect from a volunteer who signs on to work with our Scouts. I want a person who likes kids,all kids not just the ones that live in his or her house. I want someone who likes to have fun and looks for ways of having fun. I want someone who really cares for kids and will keep them safe and do everything possible to prevent them from getting hurt. While I believe that we all have faults and that no one is perfect, I would hope that the person is a good person who sets a good example for the Scouts, both inside and outside of Scouting. Just as I would expect a soccer coach to know about soccer, I would hope that the person has the skills to know about what Scouts do: Outdoor type stuff. I like and respect our good pal SR540Beaver. While I'm not mad about talking about religion. He posted: "We don't just go out looking for people that came from a family with a Christian background and recruit them into our church. We reach out to anyone and everyone and teach them what being a Christian is about and how to live their lives accordingly." While I'm very happy being a Roman Catholic with no intend on ever changing. I think that were I to join the church that he is a member of, my transition wouldn't be as hard for me as it would be for a guy who had been brought up as a Jainism Digambar monk. But just as important if not more so would be my intent. Some years back OJ informed me that he was thinking of becoming a Methodist! When I asked him why? He said that he liked the way that they sat down for most of their services and that he didn't like kneeling! If my only reason for joining Beavers church was because I'd heard that they have a wonderful Fellowship Breakfast a couple of times of month. I might want to take a long hard look at my reasoning. Is this not also true when it comes to signing on as a Scouter. Eamonn.

"Sympathetic replies are welcome, but not necessary. " Not sure how sympathetic I am. After years of trying to update our District Merit Badge list. The District Committee found that it was just too big a job. Some people on the list had died, some had moved, some no longer wanted to do the badge that they were listed to do. The problem was that no one had managed the list or updated it in a very long time. So the District Committee gave notice that everyone on the list was being removed and a new list was being made. If anyone wanted to be on the list they needed to apply to the District Advancement Committee, who would discuss and look at their application and then pass the information on to the Dean of Merit Badges. One of my great hopes while we were doing this was to find ways to make the District list more Scout friendly. Scouts are supposed to be the ones who choose the MBC. Not the unit or the SM. I also hoped that we could maybe put a stop to Troops doing everything "In House". While there are of course some MB's that are maybe best dealt with close to home? To me it seemed more and more that Troops were opting to select enough adults so that Scouts in the Troop never had a need to look outside of the Troop. This also to from what I was seeing was a cause of Troops offering MB classes, where the requirements of the MB were being replaced with just the attendance at the MB Class, which was replacing the traditional Troop meeting. When we replaced the list with the new list, it was made clear that just like any other Scouting position the MBC ran for a term of 12 months. The names of MBC appeared on the District Charter (Many of the people listed were of course multiples) The Dean of MB and the District Advancement Chair. Were tasked with contacting everyone on the list each and every year to see if they wanted to remain on the list. People who didn't or were unable to be contacted were promptly removed from the list. This was done to ensure that when a Scout got the list it would be a tool that was in good working order, not a big head-ache as it had been in the past. I'm a little unsure why a unit leader would want to take on the task of recruiting and training MBC? Clearly this goes beyond his realm of responsibilities and is something that the District needs to be taking care of. Problems with MBC and the MB list should be taken to the District Advancement Chairman or via the COR to the District Committee. Most District Committees I know of would just love to see more involvement from the COR's. Unit Leaders going to the Council Registrar,are not doing the right thing and only serve to make things more complicated. When it comes to MBC the Scoutmaster really plays no part in this what so ever. Eamonn.

OK I know that cotton kills! But the truth is that as a parent, I'm not going to send my kid out to play around in clothes that cost more than anything else he owns. I was OK with the $38.00 shorts, shorts are shorts and as a rule don't come to much harm. But when it came to doing stuff, like caving, climbing trees, or other "Boy Type" stuff. He wore a t-shirt and a pair of jeans. Jeans that cost under $20.00 and less if they were on sale. When I walk around our Council Summer Camp during the day, I don't see Scouts in any type of shirt other than a t-shirt. In winter, when Scouts have a coat on, it's hard to know what they have on under their coat. This talk of an activity uniform is lost on me. Unless of course we can come up with something that doesn't cost an arm and a leg (Under $30.00 for the complete uniform?) Still I think most parents are going to send their kid out to "Play" in clothes that they see as "Play Clothes". Mr. SM, might be able to send the message that for some activities some clothes are not the best of ideas. But... Even trying to get parents to send kids with the right footwear is an uphill struggle. Many years back the UK Scout uniform went to a Dress Uniform, looked great in the Scout Hall, but wasn't much use for anything else. I t was a real pain to look after at camp. So they came up with an activity uniform. Green shorts and a green short sleeved shirt. They gave this outfit to the guys who worked for the Scout Association at the time. A good pal of mine got a couple of sets that he refused to wear, so he gave them to me. I wore them when I came over here the first time. I looked like a little green pixie. But something must have worked! The outfit highlighted my sexy knees, HWMBO must have been impressed as she fell for me and ended up marrying me! Eamonn. (I still have the shirt - 32 years later!)

Just for the heck of it, I looked at the charter of the Troop that had gone to camp with all the adults. I know that a lot has gone on since the camp. As I posted the then SM is no longer SM. I feel sad about that. His wife was a truly wonderful person, who was for a while one of my Assistant District Commissioners. She had a long and brave fight against cancer. Both her and her husband are deeply religious and found great strength in their faith. When we found out that HWMBO had cancer, she was a great source of strength for HWMBO and myself. She was very worried that when she was no longer around that her husband would step down and had asked that I try and stop him. He has of course stepped down and the truth is that there was no way I could prevent it from happening. They had three sons all are Eagle Scouts. This SM, who while I didn't always agree with what he did or the way he went about doing it! (As OJ was a Scout in the Troop, I very often had at times to take plenty of no notice!) Was/ is a nice guy. He had been recognized with a Silver Beaver and had been SM for the Jambo a couple of times back in the 1990's. The Troop is now down to 15 Scouts. Looking at the ages it seems that six are little fellows who crossed over this year, about six are older guys who have been around for a while, a couple are Scouts who went to the 2005 Jamboree with me, the rest are a mixed bag. The adults listed on the charter are many. It seems that anyone and everyone who has ever been in the Troop is listed. The old SM's three sons are listed, one lives in Washington DC and one in Montana. I don't know what has happened or why the Troop is in such hot water or what has gone wrong? The parents I seen at that summer camp, were parents of younger Lads. Our local School District moves kids from Elementary, too Junior High and then on to High School all the schools are in different buildings /locations. Of course when they get to the HS there is a lot of after-school activities. OJ was hard pressed to keep up and he wasn't involved in any of the activities that eat up a lot of time, I'm thinking of football and band. In the last strategic plan that National put out, they talked about one million new volunteers. While this sounds great. There is no way local Councils can manage to train that number of people. Talking with a very nice Lady from our local United Way. She tells me that the new trend for volunteers is for them to come in take on one specific job and then move on out. One codgers like myself who hang around forever are not the norm! In fact the local U/W does each year gather up a willing band of volunteers who spend a day or two doing stuff for the Council, mainly painting and work like that. If the million volunteers that National talks of are people who are willing to come in for a couple of days that is one thing. But if we are going to invest the time of volunteers teaching and training people who are not going to be around for very long? We need to take a long hard look at what we are training them in and for. Eamonn.

What a wonderful idea. At last something that the youth might want to wear. I'm kinda like the SM SR540Beaver talks about. I have not bought the new style uniform, because I have way too many of the old style and I don't very often wear a uniform. Being as I'm a thin little fellow I don't think the shirt would be a problem, just not sure how well it would go with the white hair? Ea.