Eagle92

'Train 'em. Trust 'em. LET THEM LEAD!" If youth, or 18-20 y.o. Scouters for that matter, have the knowledge, skills, and abilities to teach IOLS, let them.

No where in the syllabus I have says the folks on staff have to have TtT for IOLS, or have taken the course previously for that matter. When I recruited for IOLS staff, I looked for the folks who I knew were the best in whatever skills they would be teaching. In two cases, the staffers also completed the course.

And again, that includes youth. Last time I ran IOLS, I used 2 youth Arrowmen on staff who I knew very well and knew they could do the job of teaching. And both did great jobs. It made an impression on a few folks that you can really let youth run things, and that the Patrol Method does indeed work.

Unfortunately one of those Arrowman just became an adult, and the district training chair is making him take IOLS as a student, even though he worked with him on the IOLS course I ran, and 1 he ran. Rationale for that one is that is, " I don't want anyone thinking I'm just signing off for my son."

LeCastor,

Great story. A certain crotchety retired Marine we both knew would have liked that story. Only time I've ever see him come close to crying was when he was working with some Cubs and flag etiquette.

Now, summer camp staff, well, he would have tore us a new one!

'99,

I'm not surprised. When I was a Scout, I shopped the thrift stores for uniforms. Patches were mine to keep, and shiirts, and pants if I found them, were sold to help pay some of my expenses.

Jumpy,

National Supply and Reason?!?!?!?!?! YOU FUNNY!

Seriously though, let me give you a little history on the Tricolors, at least from 1984 onwards.

When I was a Cub in '84, tricolors were mandatory, instead of a den # patch, you had a den numeral pin that was worn on the colors with the W.A.B.s That was the first year Webelos had the option to wear either the blue CS uniform, or the BS uniform with Cub Scout modifications ( American flag over right pocket being one of them ) Patrol Medallions were NOT (emphasis) authorized at that time.

Some time later, I want to say 1989 since a lot of changes occurred that year, national did away with the tricolors,with the W.A.B.s being worn on a Webelos hat that had a "barrier" between the head and the hat fabric the pins went on. national authorized the use of the den numeral patch OR patrol medallion, and did completely away with the den numeral pins. They also made the W.A.B.s colorful instead of all brass, and also expanded them from 15 pins to 20.

WWWWEEEEELLLLLLL, some folks complained about the loss of the Webelos Tricolors, how the pins kept popping off the hats, etc, so national brought back the tricolors, But not the numeral pins.

Biggest problem I see with placing the Tricolors beneath a patrol medallion is that the colors will be so low, they will hang beneath the elbow.

In regards to contacting Supply, sending a private message to their Facebook account may help.

Don't know about "marching cadense" songs, but my lodge has the singers up a cliff out of the way. We only sing when the candiates are coming to the ring. And we use one of the songs in our repertoire.

We have used a powwow drum from Crazy Crow Trading Post, either the 24" x 14" or the 28" x 14". And CCTP has a program for a scout discount if you register.

I agree not enough information on who is to blame for it folding.

I know of one troop, one of the oldest in my council in fact, that folded not because the adults and youth didn't try and keep it growing, but rather because the CO didn't want the troop any longer. The CO didn't do their part in keeping the pack up and running, so it eventually died. And that eliminated the #1 source of new Scouts for the troop. I personally think it was a testament to the adults, particualary the SM, and the Scouts in the troop to keep it it going 12 years after the pack died.

Hard one. I would have your sons look around.

I know when my son looked at the troop chartered by the pack's CO, the camp out was a Charlie Foxtrot, that I had to walk away from the campsite multiple times to control myself, and several parents had concerns after me talking to them about the differences between Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts. you can probably find some of my posts on the unit and the frustration i've had with them, even to this day. Adult-led, don't camp, etc.

And I do mean to this day I am frustrated with the troop. They cancelled out 22 hours before council camporee's gates opened. Out of the 8 Cubs that went to themin December, 1 has quit already, 1 is borderline on quitting, 2 are considering transferring, and 3 I have not hears or seen. Only 1 I know is committed to the troop, and that's because older brother is in it and dad is a leader.

And trust me, you will be frustrated when you offer advice and help, and a re completely ignored. And I helped train the SM!

One of the former scouters in my district did the Walking Woodbadge at Philmont when it was offered. I can try and contact him if you want.

I do have a copy of the old BA22 course with notes all through it. I can send it to you if you want.

My library growing up had the My Hike book and I was inspired by it. Wish I had a copy of it today. Just don't have the money for it.

$40 to $60 a pair ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Maybe I should sell a few of mine

JumpyG,

Nope, the Inspection sheet is not lacking. The Webelos "Den Emblem," which is a patrol medallion, is either not worn, or worn underneath the tricolors as they were called in my day.

Here is the Guide to Insignia link on the matter, and check out page 19 of the actual book.

As others have stated, they are the 'Cobra Den" not patrol.

I think national is trying to standardize the UoS program so that a standard list of courses that cna be offered, and a standard number of courses and work can be done to get the degrees.

While the degree portion of UoS is a bit silly, some of the courses I took were very good, and I got positive feedback form the one course I taught: How to Keep and Retain Older Scouts.

But someone may have complained when I said that maybe another troop or Venturing crew may serve the needs of the Scout better, so it's better to offer that option and keep the Scout in Scouting, than lose his interest altogether. I say that because that course was not offered this year, despite the feedback.

Base,

Believe it or not I am doing my best to stay away from the situation. I've handed over commissioner responsibilities to the DC, and have washed my hands of the situation.

But it's hard at times. Mom of one Scout has a younger son in my den, and I get told what's going on. So it's hard on that front.

In the second instance, it came up at the district committee meeting. Trying to recruit someone for a district position, and one person's name came up. DE stated that he was already asked and declined. I then said it would probably be better to leave him be since he's with that unit, and I think he's the best hope for getting the unit fixed. Found out that the son is losing interest with Scouting.

Torch,

Challenge is in today's fast paced world, time is a valuable commodity. Why take a class to learn something you already know? Best example I can give is the Camping, Backpacking, Hiking and Cooking MBC who is an Eagle, worked summer camp staff, and has 3 beads, but was "untrained" because he had not taken IOLS. Between the troop, crew, and OA, he was already IMHO over-committed to Scouting and needed to spend time withthe family as a family.Only got "trained" when he was hired to teach IOLS to SMs while on summer camp staff again.

My personal favorite though is the the scouter who has been to Philmont 3 times. He showed up late to IOLS training b/c of his job the first time we got him to staff it, and the second time he was suppose to staff it, had to bail out at the last minute b/c he was still dealing with work issues after 18 hours on the job.

UPDATE:

We has SM Specific this past weekend, and 6 adults from the troop attended. I think all but 1 are actually registered as committee members, and i heard 1 leader talking about the IOLS Test Out that the district is doing. I hope they can turn it around.

Try this link:

https://www.ncsbsa.org/resources/daycamp/

Now I'm a Star Wars fanatic, so I named the different areas after places in the Star Wars universe. Some of the activities we did was water rockets, space ship wooden kits, Droideka targets (they are not living creatures ) Astronomy Belt Loop, some stuff from this website http://www.nasa.gov/offices/education/about/.

oh and Weird Al Yankovich's Yoda,

and Star Wars Cantina

HMM I think I found our Cub Scout Day Camp drinking song this year. Evertime Cantina is mentioned, they drink fromt heir waterbottles.

Peri,

I hold too many positions. I have been a DL with the CO's pack for 5 years now, and the den that just crossed over to the troop was my old den. My oldest son decided to join another troop based upon his experiences camping with the troop, so I am also a troop committee member with another CO's troop.

Up until the end if February, I was also the CO's acting UC since our UC passed away. I am the CSRT commissioner so the pack is a natural choice, and I have a long history with the troop, stemming from when the troop was founded and I trained the original group of leaders.

But I had to make it clear that I could no longer do the UC position. It was getting too frustrating, I've posted about the troop, and my interactions with their SM. Here are a few links to threads about the unit in question.

http://www.scouter.com/forum/open-discussion-program/400980-an-interesting-weekend

http://www.scouter.com/forum/open-discussion-program/402103-coming-to-terms-with-my-son-s-troop-choice

http://www.scouter.com/forum/open-discussion-program/403876-no-win-situation-loyalty-to-the-scouts-or-the-co-s-troop

I've talked briefly to one mom about my son's troop and sent her some info.

I sent a message to my friend with my son's troop info. I know he saw it, but no response.

Within the past 4 days i found out some more bad news about my CO's troop. Two of my former Cubs who were so into Scouting are now frustrated with the program. One, who all he wanted for Christmas was camping gear, which he got, hasn't gone on a single camp out and it seriously thinking about quitting altogether. The other, also gung ho about the program, and whose dad I was hoping would eventually take over, has essentially decided to quit.

Very frustrated at the moment.

Stosh beat me to it

The September 2012 version of The Guide to Safe Scouting is found here:

http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/HealthandSafety/GSS.aspx

It gets updates regularly, I bevel someone said every 3 months or so, but the last one update was May 2013. and the updates can be found here:

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/HealthSafety/pdf/34416_update.pdf

FSU,

Thanks for posting the link.

AK,

Yep, no liquid fuels for lighting fires for adults or youth. Heck I had one leader try and tell me liquid fuel stoves were now verboten. Luckily BSA allows you to still use liquid fuels if you use a manufactured device approved for the fuel to use, no more homemade tuna can stoves

But my MSR Whisperlight International stove, designed to burn keroseen, gasoline, JP fuel, ad nasueum Is still OK .

If they are the Sports and Academic pins that Cubs earn after getting their belt loop, they go on a yellow C that is worn on the red vest. If some has an older Insignia Guide, like 1980s or 90s, I think the letter could also go on the red jacket as well, just like the Varsity/Venture Letter.

Hate to say it, but your pack is doing advancement incorrectly. This isn't old school Boy Scouts where they don't receive the advancement except 4 times a year at the Court of Honor. This is Cub Scouts where they get their rank at the next pack meeting. Heck Most Boy Scout troops I know no longer make the scouts wait for a COH to get their rank, it's as soon as the troop gets teh rank badge, preferably at the next troop meeting.

As for the flaming neckerchief, it's no longer allowed in G2SS, as well as the Flaming AOL. Saw those once and the pyro in my was thinking "AWESOME!" But alas, national says no more.

I'm old school, so here's my $.02.

1. Tigers do not cross over, only those Webelos moving up to Boy Scouts Cross over.

2. I hate to say it, but the Tigers didn't complete the badge yet, so they shouldn't be getting it. They still have plenty of time.

2a. Tigers, Wolves, and Bears do not move up to the next level until June 1st.

2b. AND Tigers, Wolves, and Bears have the option to either 1) finish up any requirements and electives over the summer Until September 1st if memory serves, OR 2)Begin working on their new rank effective June 1st.

3) No one should begin working on the next rank at this point.

The Guide to Advancement, http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/33088.pdf has this to say.

page 20 Tiger Cub rank is for boys who have completed kindergarten or are 7 years old

Once a boy has earned his Tiger Cub badge, he can earn “Tiger Track†beads. These spark interest in new hobbies, activities, or skills. The fl at, yellow beads are added to the Immediate Recognition emblem. One is awarded for every 10 electives finished. The elective activities appear in the youth handbook. There is no limit to the number of Tiger Track beads a boy can earn, and he can repeat electives at the discretion of the den leader and adult partner. A boy can work on them at the same time as achievements, but he does not receive beads until he has earned the Tiger Cub badge.

The Wolf rank is for boys who have completed first grade or are 8 years old

The Bear rank is for boys who have completed second grade or are 9 years old.

4.1.1.6 Arrow Points

A newly recognized Wolf or Bear Cub Scout then turns his attention to Arrow Points. Arrow Points develop interests and teach skills, many of which are useful in Boy Scouting. One is awarded for every 10 electives: a Gold Arrow for the first 10, and Silver for every 10 thereafter. There is no limit to the number of Silver Arrows that can be awarded, but they must be completed before a boy moves to the next rank’s program.

You've got to be joking me.

DO.. NOT...GET...ME...STARTED! This topic is a major pet peeve of mine, and I have ticked off a lot of folks because I have had people tell me CS are not earning advancement, and I reply the paperwork isn't getting recorded at the council office.

Qwazse,

With all do respect, you are incorrect. While CS advancement does not have the same stringent factors involved due to Eagle, it is just as important.

1) Unit JTE stats are based on what council has records of

2) District and Council JTE stats are based upon what is recorded.

3) While at this time records are only kept by the local councils, I'm betting that at some point in the future, those records will move around, as it was supposed to have happened 15 years ago.

Good Dog,

To play Devil's Advocate, is your council actually recording the CS advancement reports? I know for a fact that my council has not been recording the ARs because I have personally submitted those forms to purchase advancement, but when I finally got SCOUTNET access 2 years later, the Cubs are still not showing up as having earned the advancement, I beleive part of that is the concept that becasue the AOL does not get the review scrutiny as Eagle, Quartermaster, and the current Silver Award, the reports don't need to be entered into the system.