goodkidsmom 10 Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 For those following my posts, my son finally had his BOR tonight. The committee didn't advance him, saying he isn't mature enough (their rationale - his father goes on most campouts and other events and he doesn't go alone (he HAS done JLT camp and OA ordeals alone) and isn't loyal or trustworthy (their rationale - he didn't go on a January campout he had planned to go on, and backed out of summer camp). Re maturity - it isn't a requirement, and since when is a father's involvement a problem? Without Dads AND Moms, there wouldn't be scouting. Re loyal or trustworthy - recall from my earlier post that he couldn't go on the January one b/c of a great deal of stress re illness and missed schoolwork, leading to a major problem with depression. SM doesn't respect our decision that he couldn't go or our statement that he was ill, and apparently CC doesn't either. Also, we wouldn't let him go to summer camp b/c of friction with SM...SM had refused to sign off on SM Conf b/c SM said he wasn't assertive enough (in addition to doing too much with Dad and not going to January camp), and when the boy called SM to say assertive wasn't required, SM blasted him and said they'd talk about it further at camp. Plus, SM had engineered a situation for my son to work with two other boys - both of whom SM called "chronic liars" - on a setup to see if one did tasks or lied about them. We didn't want our son in this kind of position. (More details in my long posts below.) Tomorrow we'll talk to the DE again, and probably other people in the district and council. I expect that we'll have to file an appeal. Any comments, suggestions, words of wisdom, etc? Thanks, GKM Link to post Share on other sites
EagleInKY 14 Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 GKM - Sorry to hear about that. It sounds like an appeal is in order. You're absolutely correct in the inaccurate rationale they used. It sounds like you'll be looking for a new troop soon. Link to post Share on other sites
Twocubdad 665 Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 From the info in this and the previous thread, it seems you've given the troop leadership every opportunity to do the right thing -- they just don't have the sense to do it. I would absolutely appeal to the advancement committee immediately and request a quick resolution of the matter. I would stick with the current troop long enough to receive the badge at a Court of Honor with the old troop and to shake the SM's hand. Then I would immediately transfer to another troop. Link to post Share on other sites
boleta 10 Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 I agree completely with Twocubdad. The same thing happened to my son with an Eagle Gold Palm. He was awarded the Palm from the Council Advancement Committee, got it at a Troop Court of Honor, but is now inactive in this troop and a Venturer. He learned to fight for what he had earned. The Troop learned the criteria for the Palm. The committee has written him a formal apology for the misunderstanding which originated from an unreasonable Scoutmaster. (the SM never apologized). Link to post Share on other sites
JimmyD 10 Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 I would move to a different troop. I've ben reading your posts and i would've move don a long time ago. Link to post Share on other sites
eagle90 125 Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 RUN, RUN QUICKLY. There seems to be a lot of vindictiveness showing its ugly head now. I would get out at the earliest possible moment! Link to post Share on other sites
Mike F 10 Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 I gotta agree with some of the last posters - this water hole is poisoned - time to leave, while reporting it's condition so others might be warned away. Don't sweat the move. People change jobs every few years (on average) - it's time to learn another life lesson/skill. Don't dwell on "the way they did things back in the old troop" - just quietly enjoy the fresh air. Link to post Share on other sites
goodkidsmom 10 Posted July 14, 2004 Author Share Posted July 14, 2004 Yes, I agree, it's time to move on. But we're still going to appeal the current BOR's decision, so he can be awarded the rank he earned in that troop. I hope that'll work out. When he switches troops, we'll be sure to write a letter to the Chartered Org documenting why. Thursday we meet with the DE, DC, and CAC (hope I got the alphabet soup right!) GKM Link to post Share on other sites
hotdesk 10 Posted July 14, 2004 Share Posted July 14, 2004 My dad is the Scoutmaster of the troop I'm in. However, if we were in your troop, and they used the same guidelines for everyone, I would never be able to advance. I for one find that to be nothing but holding your son back just because he is who he is. I hope that your town has other scout troops that don't have leaders who are a bunch of not nice people and that your son has friends in one of these troops. If their is a troop like that go there. You, your husband, and most importantly your son do not need this and do not deserve it. (This message has been edited by a staff member.) Link to post Share on other sites
goodkidsmom 10 Posted July 15, 2004 Author Share Posted July 15, 2004 Thanks for your post. I like your analysis that they're holding him back because of who he is. You're exactly right. Luckily, there are several other good troops in the area. GKM Link to post Share on other sites
goodkidsmom 10 Posted July 22, 2004 Author Share Posted July 22, 2004 Not much of an update. My husband met with the Council Advancement Chair, District Commissioner, District Executive, and District Chairman a week ago. There isn't room on the Advancement Committee's agenda for the appeal until September, so two of the men were going to talk to the SM and CC to try to deal with it informally. We haven't heard from them, so either they didn't meet yet or didn't get anywhere. Meanwhile, my supposedly immature non-active son is headed for Kandersteg International Scout Camp in Switzerland day after tomorrow. Link to post Share on other sites
BadenP 93 Posted July 22, 2004 Share Posted July 22, 2004 I am surprised that your DE didnt do more for you. When I was a DE we had a similiar problem with an Eagle candidate going to the World Jamboree, and his new SM, after verifying all the work had been done and then I talked to his SM who refused to sign him off. So I called the Key 3, Dist. Adv. Chair together and we held the review with the SM present. The boy was a model candidate with wonderful letters of recommendation. This new SM just did not like him for some personal reason. One of the reviewers was a SM himself and invited that boy to transfer to his troop, the offer was accepted, and he had his court of honor with his new troop. The boys former SM resigned 3 months later after several more complaints were filed by other scouts.I received a great letter from the boy while he was at the World Jambo thanking me. Ironically that boy is now the Scoutmaster for that same troop that invited him in to hold his eagle court of honor. He said he wanted to give back to those scouts that welcomed him years earlier. So you see all is not hopeless.(This message has been edited by BadenP) Link to post Share on other sites
goodkidsmom 10 Posted July 23, 2004 Author Share Posted July 23, 2004 Wow, what great results, and interesting that that SM had other complaints filed against him. Over the years several parents have grumbled about various issues related to this SM, but he is so enthusiastic about scouting and puts so much into being SM that it's seemed to balance the negatives. Nobody's perfect. This SM did leave another troop about 5 yrs ago under less-than-ideal circumstances - don't know the details, though. It's good to hear that other boys who run into similar issues get support and go on to succeed. I'm sure that'll happen with my son too. I just hope it's very soon, and it sure would be nice if it were backdated (just as a matter of principle). A few apologies would also be nice, but I don't expect them and would be surprised if we got them. thanks for posting GKM Link to post Share on other sites
Proud Eagle 13 Posted July 23, 2004 Share Posted July 23, 2004 Best advice- Find another troop if possible. Warn others not to join this troop. If that isn't possible talk to charter organization representative, institutional head, District Executive, Unit Commisionar, and any others you can find. You may be able to win on appeal, but it is not possible to have an enjoyable Scouting experience in a perpetually adversarial environment. Therefore, you either need to move to a new environement, or change the one you are in. Link to post Share on other sites
goodkidsmom 10 Posted August 2, 2004 Author Share Posted August 2, 2004 CC send my son a letter about why the BOR didn't recommend him for advancement. Sparing you the details, the few specifics were not compelling, and the rest was vague. CC was clearly influenced by SM. We've written a reply rebutting the points. It doesn't look like we can resolve this internally, and the formal appeal is going through channels. There's more involved than I can say here - please aim supportive vibes toward PA. GKM Link to post Share on other sites
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