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Gonzo1

Adults hijacking PLC plan

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Hey, wouldn't it be great if Betty could be your best ally and supporter? What could you do to make that happen? It'd be better than an enemy, and she may not be going away anytime soon.

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FScouter,

I've already thought about reverse psychology, but I really find her intolerable.

 

It's not the female part, it's the person part.

 

Suggestions?

 

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Cappie Gonzo,

What is that old adage about keeping your enemies at your side?

>>Not welcome

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ASM915,

Yeah, I'm a yankee, the outsider and new (here).

 

Our council policy is no tour permit required if the unit is going someplace in the district.

 

My main beef here is that "it was decided" by 4 or 5 adults and did not involve the boys. Parents basically said, 'hey, that sounds like a good idea.'

 

The scout who was supposed to teach the skill came in on time with notes and props and ready to go just to have someone pull the plug who really shouldn't have. I kow the PLC sis getting active, but after 4 years, these people should know better. However, "Betty" thinks she knows all she needs to.

 

CC, SM, Adv Ch, didn't really make any attempt to stop her.

 

So as a way to get Betty by my side, I could emplore her to "share her vast wisdom and knowledge" but helping conduct training.

 

G

 

 

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Our Council has a simular policy, but for Council/District sponsored events only. Everything else warrents a permit.

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Yah, Gonzo, in the big picture view of things I agree with Lisa'bob. It's OK for you to protect the boys and keep their meeting plans on track one evening, but dealin' with Betty just isn't your job, eh?

 

You're not the SM. You're not the CC. You ain't the CO either, eh? :) You're the new guy. Slow down the train. Take a year or three, and be content with that gradual improvement. The boys need that time, too, to learn new ideas. Give other adults space to learn and to do their jobs in their way and at their pace.

 

Yah, yeh wouldn't step in and take charge from the boys when they're not doin' it perfect, would yeh? ;) Then don't step in on the CC or SM. Where appropriate, give 'em some gentle feedback privately in the same way you would for the SPL. Then be willing to let them fail, in the same way you would for the SPL.

 

Beavah

 

 

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Beavah, Lisa

You're both right.

The CC said the other night that "referree" wasn't in his job description, hmm, seems like it is.

 

I know I need to be patient

 

Thanks,

 

G

 

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Wow, tough problem. I've had issues with problem-making adults and have had to go to the woodshed a few times. Thankfully I had the complete support of the CC and the ASMs to back me up.

 

I'm a "high road" kind of guy and like to approach things above board. When faced with a similar situation a few years ago I came out at a committee meeting and said "hey guys, I have to apologize, we've stepped on each other's toes more than once lately. I'd like to improve this and suggest we do it gradually by learning how a troop is supposed to be run according to the BSA. It's not for me or for you that we're doing this, but for the boys. I suggest we start with New Leader Essentials and Youth Protection Training, and then have Troop Committee Training (Troop Committee Challenge)."

 

In our case, I was the one who delivered the training, but you might not be in a position to to do that. I'd seek out someone from the district, a trainer or maybe a unit commissioner, to come in and conduct the troop committee training.

 

In our case, things turned around quickly. The one problem-maker ended up going into hiding. He stlil causes trouble from time to time, but is essentially gone. The rest of the committee really fell into place and worked well together. It's been two years and we've nearly doubled in size since then, so we are in need of doing it again, as I see other "betty's" on the horizon.

 

Good luck.

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Gonzo and Fellow Scouters,

 

 

Myself coming into this string late. You have already been given excellent advice and thoughts.

 

While some committee members may hijack a PLC, maybe their ideals were good but their method and approach was in error. Possibly, a fund raising event like this could pay for everyone to attend Summer Camp and pay for a year of programs. (good ideals).

But her delivery method or presenting the idea, should have been brought before the committee as well as the PLC especially if a fund raising event takes place during a regular advancement program meeting night (bad method/approach).

 

Quiet often, via adult association being a method of Scouting, our SM and ASMs have to hijack the PLC. Maybe hijack is too aggressive a term, but more steer or guide is what we do. As often as we may, our comments sound more like, I dont think skydiving is an approved activity, Dont you think that someone will get hurt if we juggle flaming torches?. And we attempt to steer some PLC discussions Can we achieve any advancement during this next camp out. If we all consider bringing our backpacks to the weekly meeting, we can inventory and see if we are ready for the next campout, and accomplish a Second Class requirement. Often ending with, What do you think? to the SPL and PLC.

 

Between the personality difference in your Troop Committee, and they do occur in quiet a few units. Either within Scouting, local PTSA, the local churches, community based organization and of course city politics. It sounds so familiar to see you type, that your Troop Committee Secretary feels she is fully trained and completely understands the program. Further that she was not inviting training from yourself. She does not want to hear what you have to say.

 

As EagleInKY stated, Invite the District Commissioner staff to meet with the committee.

 

I would invite the Troop Unit Commissioner, Assistant District Commissioner or District Commissioner to conduct the Troop Committee Challenge during a Troop Committee meeting. While they are there, they can discuss real life scenarios, and ethical decision making. Lets say (In a hypothetical presentation. The PLC had an okay plan for advancement for the night, maybe the PLC was going to look at the second class requirements for 5 minutes and play 55 minutes of dodge ball. A little advancement, a lot of fun. But an adult had a plan to pay off Summer Camp in one swoop, if the advancement and program meeting was diverted.) Would this be good vs. good, good vs. bad, or trivial?

 

Hopefully, the Commissioner staff, can mediate issues and shed some light on the Troop Committee and maybe even some non participating parents. I would personally say, good ideals, but bad approach based on the actions of your Troop Secretary.

 

Good Luck!

 

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

 

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Crew 21 Adv,

 

I think I mentioned it earlier, but I'm an ASM and the UC, the COR is also the ADC. So we got that part covered.

 

It really is a matter of being in the good ol' boy network with this bunch.

 

CC is trained, runs a casual, but effective meeting.

 

I'm going to spend a few minutes at the next Cmte mtg on G2SS highlights. ie, no smoking around scouts, traveling in the backs of pickups, etc. just the highlights.

 

 

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Red Flag! Gonzo, did I understand correctly that you are the UC for a unit where you are also an ASM (and a pretty actively involved ASM at that)?

 

If that's the case, I strongly suggest you seek a change of UC assignments. No matter how well-meaning you are as a UC, other people in the troop are just not going to be able to differentiate between what you say in one role vs. in the other. And for that matter, you might not be quite as objective as you would like to think, when switching hats (and shoulder loops). The result is bound to be that at least some will resent and maybe ignore you in BOTH roles. I've seen this happen.

 

A UC ought to be someone who is a little removed from the day-to-day activity of the unit so that they can provide that impartial perspective when, as inevitably occurs, people in the unit get mired in their own issues and come into conflict with each other.

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I am going to be very blunt here.

WHAT IN THE HELL IS THE SCOUTMASTER DOING, WHEN BETTY IS HIGH JACKING THE MEETINGS?

 

Whew, done yelling.

If the SM does not have the fortitude to nip this in the butt, you might as well give up and do what Bevah says, sit back and watch, you have no hope.

 

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Lisa,

The dual hat thing is a little uncomfortable for me too.

I'll be asking for a switch soon in the UC role, that way the unit will get someone different, but have a "second UC" "undercover" . I agree on your other comments as well.

I was the UC before coming on as ASM as my son crossed over in Feb.

 

 

Dan,

The SM is weak, well meaning, but weak. The CC is the same to some extent. Betty doesn't hijack all the meetings, just a couple. The CC adds things on the calendar too (a hijack of sorts) at the last minute like "Lakeshore Clean-up" next weekend. C'mon, it's 10 days away, and this after the semi-annual fundraiser and camp-o-ree.

 

I'm trying to be effective, positive and help out.

I'm doing my best.

 

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It happened again!

 

The PLC decided to go one place for a two night backpacking trip. The committee and SM decided they want to set up tents in the daylight, so the SM changed the destination and plan. Now, we're leaving Saturday morning and going to a different place.

 

 

Sheesh!

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