Why do we cross over boys in March?

[Its Me]

 

The US school calendar has been unchanged for a hundred years or more yet the BSA crosses Cubs to Boy Scouts 3-months before they complete a grade. If the program were set to cross in September we would be less dependent on summer camp to obtain all our Tenderfoot to First Class requirements. The change in time gives the cubs the opportunity complete their grade. The new boys would be better acquainted and better trained to go on adventure hikes during the summer. And summer camp would not be as imposing as it is now.

 

To me it makes more sense to train the boys through the winter and take ever increasing adventures with the highest and longest occurring during the summer break. If a troop gets cubs in March they have to throttle back their program and keep the April - June campouts at a level sufficient for s new Boy Scout.

 

 

[Bob White]

You can cross Webelos anytime you want once they become eligible for Boy Scouts. Most Packs I have seen do this in February as part of the Blue and Gold Celebration.

 

The other cub ranks do not "cross" per se, they graduate to the next rank program at the end of the school year. For most packs and certainly every pack that I have ever been in contact with, that happens in June.

 

Why the pack you refer to does it in March I have no idea.

[eagle90]

Crossing over in February/March gives the new scouts 4-5 months of training and preparation for a week at summer camp. If the unit is providing an adequate outdoor program, depending on location, they will have about 4 weekend experiences for these boys. And what better place for the new boys to work on T-2-1 requirements than at summer camp? Sure beats sitting in a meeting hall and doing them!

[DYB-Mike]

Our current crop of Webelos II (my son included) received their Arrow of Light at the Blue and Gold this past February but will not formally Cross Over until a special camp-out in May. As to when the previous crop or Webelos II got their AoL I cant say, but the May Cross Over camp-out has been a tradition for our Pack a number of years.

 

No one has been able to tell me why we do the May Cross Over but I have read in the past about not subjecting new scouts to the tribulations of winter camping. This is probably not an issue in warmer climates but it is a real issue here in New England. I for one think a late spring crossing in our neck of the woods is a wise approach.

 

Some may feel that we are depriving the boys of several months of scout-level training but I dont think thats the case for us. Because my son was a Webelos II Ive had a lot of first-hand experience with his Den/Patrol (they are now called the Dragon Patrol and organized as such). Their adult leaders have seen to it that they have interaction with the Troop, even going so far as to meet at the same time and place as the Troop, which has been most cooperative and welcoming. The Webelos II were invited to accompany the Troop to a fall Camporee in Rhode Island and the den/patrol has had other camping and hiking experiences on their own. At this point, the adult leaders have decided to focus on honing camping related skills (tent pitching, menu planning, and food preparation) rather than having a last minute rush for compass points.

 

 

 

[Its Me]

 

Are there troops out there (cue echo machine) that cross in September to better align with the school calendar?

 

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by Its Me)

[ASM416]

I think the march crossover was meant to coincide with charter renewal time. My council recently changed to December for recharter but before that it was in march. I believe in some councils it still is march.

[LongHaul]

The Feb/March cross over is intended to allow the New Scouts a chance to become acquainted with the workings of the Troop and for the Troop to become more familiar with the New Scouts. What I don't understand is why there is this belief that if a boy crosses in Feb he HAS to camp in March aka cold. If the boy stays in Webelos does he camp in March? There is more to Boy Scouts than camping. One of the biggest things is learning to Be Prepared. This is accomplished at the troop meeting BEFORE the New Scouts go camping. I hear people saying that the New Scouts will feel left out to which I answer Ages and Stages. The New Scout is no more prepared to do winter camping that he would be to attend Philmont as a New Scout unless he has been prepared for the outing. May crossover was the norm 15 years ago when the Webelos program was a 24 month program it is now a 20 month program so the New Scout has a chance to find his place in the troop and the Adult troop leaders have a chance to become acquainted with the New Scout. What I find most often is the Packs that resist February crossovers are the Packs that are not utilizing the Webelos program as a transition between Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts. The Webelos program is being run as a project making award getting process rather than a skill acquisition, accepting of responsibility experience.

LongHaul

[CalicoPenn]

Let's take a look at the requirements to become a Boy Scout. In order to become a Boy Scout, a boy must either: Be 11 years old, OR completed the 5th grade OR earn the Arrow of Light.

 

For a March crossover, I imagine the key here is Earn the Arrow of Light. Many packs time their Webelos Program so that most eligible Webelos are awarded their Arrow of Light at the Blue and Gold - the Big award ceremony of the year. Once those Webelos have earned the AOL, they can join a Scout Troop. While they can technically be crossed over in February, many Packs delay the crossover to March so that it doesn't detract from the big show that is Blue & Gold. March also gives the boys (and their parents) just about enough time to make a decision on attending summer camp and prep for it. That's better for retention too, since the new Scout will have experienced summer camp as one of his first outings with the Troop, instead of waiting almost a year for that adventure.

 

A well-organized, well-run Troop shouldn't have to throttle back every time they bring in a "New Scout Patrol", nor should they. They'll be ready to integrate those new Scouts and keep moving forward.

 

Calico

 

Calico

[Its Me]

 

 

Hmmm!

 

I am not quite getting the discussion focus I hoped for. Do we not set our annual planning calendars in September?

 

I suspect that in general the unit programs escalates. For example, a canoe MB work precedes a canoe day trip which precedes a canoe overnighter. In a March cross over your program has to reset.

 

 

 

 

[Bob White]

"Are there troops out there (cue echo machine) that cross in September to better align with the school calendar?

 

Troops do not cross, Cubs Scouts cross from the packs. It is NOT the decision of the troops as to when they come.

 

As far as when dou get your planning calendars...I do not know since not all councils do it at the same time. Besides if We are doing a canoeing outing that does not mean that avery skill level of scout is going.

 

I think perhaps the reason this discussion is not going the way you expected is because you are making assumptions that how things are done in your scouting community is universal to the BSA and it is not.

 

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[scottteng]

The reason for crossing boys over before summer is to let them get some meetings and a couple of campouts under their belt before summer camp. Despite troops fund raising efforts and scholarships summer camp is somewhat pricey. The troop and hopefully the parents do not want to have boys being picked up from summer camp on Tuesday or Wednesday because of the tearful calls home to mom "I got to come home mom I just can't take this any more the boys are mean the food is inedible." In shor I'm homesick and I know how to push your buttons so you will drive several hours to come pick me up. We don't want parents wasting money sending boys to camp and then being manipulated into rescuing them. If the boys have been on a couple of trips the parents are used to the awful food and everyones mean gripes. Mostly those translate too they made me eat what I fixed even though I burned it and my patrol leader actually made sure I did my share of the work. Once they get in the swing of things most of them get excited about the merit badges they will earn and the fun stuff (shooting, climbing, nature, scout craft, aquatics) they will be doing. The weekend trips are the inoculations against the big scary week away from home. By the time reach WEBELOS age they are usually ready for the next step away from mom and dad being their every inch of the way and to reaching onward and upward for their own accomplishments which are available to them in boy scouts even though there are still adults around to make sure that it is done in a safe manner.

[BuffaloSR793]

I think a fall or late summer crossover would be good for Webelos for the reasons you mentioned.

 

To put your Pack on a "fall" schedule, for every age level you would have to conduct rank advancements at the fall Pack meeting. With some, if not most Packs being somewhat inactive during the summer months, you could run the risk of loosing boys. (rank advancements and recognition play an important part of holding boys)

 

Being a Webelos I and soon to be Webelos II den leader, I can tell you our boys are ready for Boy Scouts. Most will have earned enough activity badges to qualify for AOL by the start of their Webelos II year. We'll work on additional activity badges and sharpen our outdoor skills thru the fall and winter. We'll hike with the Troops in the fall and participate in the January Klondike derby with the Troops. In February at the Blue & Gold, well formally cross over into a Troop.

 

To me, its an individual decision. As the Webelos den leader, I view it is my role to: Make sure every Webelos attains AOL; Is prepared for Boy Scouts, Ensure the Webelos are a role model to younger Cub Scouts in the Pack and most importantly stay active in Scouting (we ensure this by making sure they have fun and I provide a challenging Webelos program).

 

We have 10 Webelos who have been together since Tigers, I can think of nothing better than seeing all of them earning their Eagle together as Boy Scouts.

 

Jeff

[CalicoPenn]

Not every Troop sets their annual planning for September - that is much more common in Cub Scouts.

 

PLC's may have an annual planning event just about any month of the year, depending on the Troops schedule. Often, its set around the Troop's elections for SPL, so that the new SPL is leading the process.

 

Troops also don't always run by a School Calendar, like Cub Scout Packs tend to do. Troops are active year round, many of them continue to meet on a weekly basis in the summer, though many may choose not to have their weekly meetings the same month as Summer Camp, and some may switch to a bi-weekly meeting during June, July and August. Most Troops also don't tend to view their programs as a build-up to Summer Camp. Every outing is as important as the last - whether its a week long trek through part of the Appalachian Trail, or a weekend District Camporee.

 

Troop advancement and programs aren't set by a theme, as it is in Cub Scouts. In Cub Scouts, Dens and Packs are encouraged to follow a thematic approach to advancement - with every month of meetings during the school year corresponding to a specific set of achievements, electives and Webelos activity pins. Boy Scout advancement is a continuous process, and each Scout sets his own pace. Troops shouldn't be setting an advancement program so that in September, every Scout will earn the First Aid Merit Badge, then in October, every Scout will earn the Aviation Merit Badge. Troops should be offering skills training in their meetings, not working on merit badge requirements. A Troop may offer a session on knot tying at one meeting, but its up to the Scout to decide if he wants to take advantage of that opportunity to get sign off an a rank requirement. He can choose to do it another time. Rank advancement in the Boy Scouts is very much self-directed, although the First Class, First Year emphasis often leads some Troops to schedule their New Scout Patrol as if it were a Webelos Den. In any given Troop, you'll find boys at many different stages of advancement, all working together and intermingling.

 

There are some Boy Scout Troops out there that might bundle Canoeing Merit Badge work with a Canoeing Day Trip and then a Canoeing Overnight, (which may indicate a relatively young, adult led Troop run by former Webelos and and Den Leaders who helped to start the Troop up) but most don't do so.

 

The biggest problem in Boy Scout Troops with escalating programs leading to a grand adventure, then starting all over again, is that after a while, the older Scouts - Star, Life & Eagle - will have gone through such a cycle a couple of times before and will lose interest and become bored. With Cub Scouts, its not as big of a problem because with the start of every school year, they start working on a new rank.

 

Most Troops should be ready to accept new Scouts at any time. If a Troop is telling a Pack that they will only accept crossovers in a specific month, my suggestion would be look at other Troops before committing to this one. Again, the requirements to become a Boy Scout are: Be 11 years old OR finish the 5th grade OR earn the Arrow of Light. We shouldn't be waiting until the next "school year" to crossover an 11 year old AOL earner who finished 5th grade in June.

 

Calico

 

 

 

[substring]

You don't have to wait till Spring to crossover. If you plan ahead, you can crossover early as long as the boys are old enough.

 

In our case, my son's Webelos Patrol had completed all basic requirements when they were Webelos I. Therefore, we concentrated on visits and campouts with Boy Scout Troops in the Fall. By December, they all had earned the Arrow of Light and crossovered to Boy Scout.

 

Our entire Webelos Patrol joined the same Boy Scout Troop because it is well-organized. In just about 2 months, all of our boys have almost completed all the Tenderfoot requirements and some of the Second Class requirements. Our goal is to get them to First Class by Summer Camp this June so that they can start earning Merit Badges. It seems that we are well ahead of schedule.

(This message has been edited by substring)

[Bob White]

Substring writes "Our goal is to get them to First Class by Summer Camp this June so that they can start earning Merit Badges."

 

Substring, Boys Scouts can begin earning merit badges as soon as they join, They do not have to be First Class before they begin, nor can a unit make a rule that says they must be.

 

It's important that leaders attend the basic training courses to learn the advancment program.