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OA and Venturing

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WOW how some people forget History of Scouts and can't put two and two together and can't come up with 4.

Try Connecting the Dots maybe or Maybe some Scouting History Lessons are in Order

Boy Scouts created and In their original conceptions, Life Scout, Star Scout(Life preceded Star until 1924) and Eagle Scout were not ranks, but part of the merit badge system that recognized Scouts who had earned a specified number of merit badges. Eagle Scout was awarded to any First Class Scout who had earned 21 merit badges.

 

Order of the Arrow was Created in 1915...and Membership Requirements remain the same today as they Did in 1915...They required the Youth Membership to have Obtained the HIGHEST RANK POSSIBLE in 1915... rank requirement of First Class.

Boy Scouts and Varsity Scouts ( LDS VERSION OF A BOY SCOUT) are the same program basically.

 

The "Order of the Arrow" is the honor society of the Boy Scouts of America, intended to recognize older scouts in their teens who best exemplify the scout virtues of cheerful service, camping, and leadership. It was not nor is it a CAMPING SOCIETY

 

Explorers/Venture Crews did not exist back then..have ya connected the Dots Yet

BOY SCOUTS have resisted Change..

 

Should Today's OA require it Youth Membership also Achieve the Highest Rank. Based on the history of having to have acheived the highest Rank possible back then

Since Explorers and Venture Crews are not Considered "Boy Scouts" should they have to pay "Boy Scout Registration Fees" to the "BOY SCOUTS OF AMERICA"

Why are Cub Scouts and Venture Crews Required to Learn the BOY SCOUT OATH AND THE SCOUT LAW Next year...Will Females be EXEMPT from Those Requirements since they Are not Allowed to be Elected into OA?

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WOW how some people forget History of Scouts and can't put two and two together and can't come up with 4.

Try Connecting the Dots maybe or Maybe some Scouting History Lessons are in Order

Boy Scouts created and In their original conceptions, Life Scout, Star Scout(Life preceded Star until 1924) and Eagle Scout were not ranks, but part of the merit badge system that recognized Scouts who had earned a specified number of merit badges. Eagle Scout was awarded to any First Class Scout who had earned 21 merit badges.

 

Order of the Arrow was Created in 1915...and Membership Requirements remain the same today as they Did in 1915...They required the Youth Membership to have Obtained the HIGHEST RANK POSSIBLE in 1915... rank requirement of First Class.

Boy Scouts and Varsity Scouts ( LDS VERSION OF A BOY SCOUT) are the same program basically.

 

The "Order of the Arrow" is the honor society of the Boy Scouts of America, intended to recognize older scouts in their teens who best exemplify the scout virtues of cheerful service, camping, and leadership. It was not nor is it a CAMPING SOCIETY

 

Explorers/Venture Crews did not exist back then..have ya connected the Dots Yet

BOY SCOUTS have resisted Change..

 

Should Today's OA require it Youth Membership also Achieve the Highest Rank. Based on the history of having to have acheived the highest Rank possible back then

Since Explorers and Venture Crews are not Considered "Boy Scouts" should they have to pay "Boy Scout Registration Fees" to the "BOY SCOUTS OF AMERICA"

Why are Cub Scouts and Venture Crews Required to Learn the BOY SCOUT OATH AND THE SCOUT LAW Next year...Will Females be EXEMPT from Those Requirements since they Are not Allowed to be Elected into OA?

So, in summary, what you're saying is that National has failed to change/clarify the OA membership requirements as the BSA has changed over time. I never thought about it like that, I only considered the current policies.

"Should Today's OA require it Youth Membership also Achieve the Highest Rank. Based on the history of having to have acheived the highest Rank possible back then" No they shouldn't, because they already have a organization for that, it's called the National Eagle Scout Association.

"Since Explorers and Venture Crews are not Considered "Boy Scouts" should they have to pay "Boy Scout Registration Fees" to the "BOY SCOUTS OF AMERICA" That is one of the things that I have been debating, people keep saying that the OA is the Boy Scout Honor Society, it isn't, it is Scouting's Honor Society. Scouting in the USA is divided into 2 parts: the Boy Scouts of America and the Girl Scouts of America. Venturing/Sea Scouts is part of the BSA, just because they are co-ed does not mean they're their own organization.

"Why are Cub Scouts and Venture Crews Required to Learn the BOY SCOUT OATH AND THE SCOUT LAW Next year..."

Because National is stupid.

"Will Females be EXEMPT from Those Requirements since they Are not Allowed to be Elected into OA?" No, they won't.

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"Explorers/Venture Crews did not exist back then.."

 

With all due respect, SEA SCOUTS, which was called Sea Exploring in my youth and is part of Venturing today, was around when the OA was formed. Sea Scouts is the 2nd oldest program in the BSA, being started in 1912. OA, while founded in 1915, 3 years AFTER Sea Scouts, did not become an official program of the BSA until the 1940s if memory serves.

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WOW how some people forget History of Scouts and can't put two and two together and can't come up with 4.

Try Connecting the Dots maybe or Maybe some Scouting History Lessons are in Order

Boy Scouts created and In their original conceptions, Life Scout, Star Scout(Life preceded Star until 1924) and Eagle Scout were not ranks, but part of the merit badge system that recognized Scouts who had earned a specified number of merit badges. Eagle Scout was awarded to any First Class Scout who had earned 21 merit badges.

 

Order of the Arrow was Created in 1915...and Membership Requirements remain the same today as they Did in 1915...They required the Youth Membership to have Obtained the HIGHEST RANK POSSIBLE in 1915... rank requirement of First Class.

Boy Scouts and Varsity Scouts ( LDS VERSION OF A BOY SCOUT) are the same program basically.

 

The "Order of the Arrow" is the honor society of the Boy Scouts of America, intended to recognize older scouts in their teens who best exemplify the scout virtues of cheerful service, camping, and leadership. It was not nor is it a CAMPING SOCIETY

 

Explorers/Venture Crews did not exist back then..have ya connected the Dots Yet

BOY SCOUTS have resisted Change..

 

Should Today's OA require it Youth Membership also Achieve the Highest Rank. Based on the history of having to have acheived the highest Rank possible back then

Since Explorers and Venture Crews are not Considered "Boy Scouts" should they have to pay "Boy Scout Registration Fees" to the "BOY SCOUTS OF AMERICA"

Why are Cub Scouts and Venture Crews Required to Learn the BOY SCOUT OATH AND THE SCOUT LAW Next year...Will Females be EXEMPT from Those Requirements since they Are not Allowed to be Elected into OA?

Although, the more I think about it, the more I think that co-ed groups should be separate from both the Boy Scouts and the Girl Scouts, they should be their own division of Scouting.

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WOW how some people forget History of Scouts and can't put two and two together and can't come up with 4.

Try Connecting the Dots maybe or Maybe some Scouting History Lessons are in Order

Boy Scouts created and In their original conceptions, Life Scout, Star Scout(Life preceded Star until 1924) and Eagle Scout were not ranks, but part of the merit badge system that recognized Scouts who had earned a specified number of merit badges. Eagle Scout was awarded to any First Class Scout who had earned 21 merit badges.

 

Order of the Arrow was Created in 1915...and Membership Requirements remain the same today as they Did in 1915...They required the Youth Membership to have Obtained the HIGHEST RANK POSSIBLE in 1915... rank requirement of First Class.

Boy Scouts and Varsity Scouts ( LDS VERSION OF A BOY SCOUT) are the same program basically.

 

The "Order of the Arrow" is the honor society of the Boy Scouts of America, intended to recognize older scouts in their teens who best exemplify the scout virtues of cheerful service, camping, and leadership. It was not nor is it a CAMPING SOCIETY

 

Explorers/Venture Crews did not exist back then..have ya connected the Dots Yet

BOY SCOUTS have resisted Change..

 

Should Today's OA require it Youth Membership also Achieve the Highest Rank. Based on the history of having to have acheived the highest Rank possible back then

Since Explorers and Venture Crews are not Considered "Boy Scouts" should they have to pay "Boy Scout Registration Fees" to the "BOY SCOUTS OF AMERICA"

Why are Cub Scouts and Venture Crews Required to Learn the BOY SCOUT OATH AND THE SCOUT LAW Next year...Will Females be EXEMPT from Those Requirements since they Are not Allowed to be Elected into OA?

My grandma used to tell me I could catch more flies with honey than with vinegar :). The answer to why are cub scouts and venturing crews picking up the scout oath and law is that it is consistent with the mission of the BSA which is to install the values of the Scout Oath and Law in the participants. It's many things but hardly stupid. FWIW, I don't believe there is an organization called the Girl Scouts of America. There is an organization called the Girl Scouts of the USA; they are a totally separate organization than the BSA. The only thing they share are the name scouts and America.

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Sea Scouting is the BSA's implementation of the Sea Scout program, initially developed in 1910 by Warington Baden-Powell in England. The founders of Sea Scouting in the United States are Arthur A. Carey of Waltham, Massachusetts and Charles T. Longstreth of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Both leaders independently established Sea Scout groups in the summer of 1912. This accomplishment was recorded in the inaugural issue of Scouting. They Originated outside of Scouting, They do not use the Same Rank system as the Boy Scouts.

 

When National revised the Explorer program and created the Exploring program in 1959, it purposely left the Sea Explorer program alone to see how it operated along side the new Exploring program. In 1965, they decided to make some changes to Sea Exploring, as embodied in a new edition of the Sea Exploring Manual. This rollout was originally planned for October 15, 1965, but was later extended to March 15, 1966.

With the establishment of the Exploring Division in 1969, William Lidderdale was named the first Director of Sea Exploring since 1935. Also in 1969, Sea Explorers would allow girls, usually Mariner Girl Scouts, to participate as guests with Sea Explorer Ships. In 1971, with the rest of the new Exploring program, Sea Explorers would go fully co-ed.

  • Wearing of OA Lodge flaps is not allowed on Sea Scout uniforms (though some do wear them).

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The first of the older boy, or "Senior Scout", programs created was Sea Scouts with a manual written by B-P's older brother. This program was adopted early on by the BSA in 1912. Later on, other programs were added in the US, most under the umbrella of the Senior Scout program of the 1935 and afterwards.

In researching the needs of older youth, the BSA made changes to the Senior Scout programs over the years. The Senior Scout programs of the 1930s and 40s gave way to the Explorer programs of the 50s. Further research lead to the Explorers of the 50s giving way to the Exploring program in the 60s. In the 70s Exploring went co-ed. Programs came and went to meet the needs of high school and college age youth. Most recently, Exploring was split into two separate programs: LFL/Exploring and Venturing.

 

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DCsimmons Early BSA LEader West fiercely defended the use of the term Scout and the right to market Scouting merchandise.

The organization's original name was the Girl Guides of America. In 1913, it was changed to the Girl Scouts of the United States and the organization was incorporated in 1915.The name was finally changed to the Girl Scouts of the United States of America in 1947. The organization was given a congressional charter on March 16, 1950. West Sued the Girl Scouts and lost over the use of Word SCOUTS

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qwaze ..

Anyone who is Not a Registered Member of the BSA loses Membership in OA..Youth or Adult..They may rejoin without having to do another Ordeal if they reRegister with BSA and Pay their Lodge Dues and still level of membership as when they become inactive..Ordeal Brotherhood or Vigil.

 

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qwaze ..

Anyone who is Not a Registered Member of the BSA loses Membership in OA..Youth or Adult..They may rejoin without having to do another Ordeal if they reRegister with BSA and Pay their Lodge Dues and still level of membership as when they become inactive..Ordeal Brotherhood or Vigil.

Understood, but E92 pointed out that OA may have boys who no longer are members of a troop, but since their BSA membership is current, by virtue of being in a crew or ship, they are still in the Order.

 

Now maybe this is administrative oversight, or maybe noone wants to challenge a boy who went through his ordeal shows up and serves at meetings and conclaves and can pull a current membership card out of his pocket. But, it undermines the notion that the order exist solely so a boy could better serve his troop.

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WOW how some people forget History of Scouts and can't put two and two together and can't come up with 4.

Try Connecting the Dots maybe or Maybe some Scouting History Lessons are in Order

Boy Scouts created and In their original conceptions, Life Scout, Star Scout(Life preceded Star until 1924) and Eagle Scout were not ranks, but part of the merit badge system that recognized Scouts who had earned a specified number of merit badges. Eagle Scout was awarded to any First Class Scout who had earned 21 merit badges.

 

Order of the Arrow was Created in 1915...and Membership Requirements remain the same today as they Did in 1915...They required the Youth Membership to have Obtained the HIGHEST RANK POSSIBLE in 1915... rank requirement of First Class.

Boy Scouts and Varsity Scouts ( LDS VERSION OF A BOY SCOUT) are the same program basically.

 

The "Order of the Arrow" is the honor society of the Boy Scouts of America, intended to recognize older scouts in their teens who best exemplify the scout virtues of cheerful service, camping, and leadership. It was not nor is it a CAMPING SOCIETY

 

Explorers/Venture Crews did not exist back then..have ya connected the Dots Yet

BOY SCOUTS have resisted Change..

 

Should Today's OA require it Youth Membership also Achieve the Highest Rank. Based on the history of having to have acheived the highest Rank possible back then

Since Explorers and Venture Crews are not Considered "Boy Scouts" should they have to pay "Boy Scout Registration Fees" to the "BOY SCOUTS OF AMERICA"

Why are Cub Scouts and Venture Crews Required to Learn the BOY SCOUT OATH AND THE SCOUT LAW Next year...Will Females be EXEMPT from Those Requirements since they Are not Allowed to be Elected into OA?

GSUSA is the female scouting organization of the USA, it is basically the same as the Boy Scouts other than the fact that it is all female.

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Why can't a Youth simply "Better serve his Unit" no matter if it is a Post, Troop, Crew or Ship?
They are already doing that, the OA helps them do it better. OA membership is recognition of the fact that a scout is "better serving his unit." Plus those OA weekend trips are extremely fun and the HA Base opportunities through the OA are extremely valuable. Venturers just want to have the same opportunities.

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WOW how some people forget History of Scouts and can't put two and two together and can't come up with 4.

Try Connecting the Dots maybe or Maybe some Scouting History Lessons are in Order

Boy Scouts created and In their original conceptions, Life Scout, Star Scout(Life preceded Star until 1924) and Eagle Scout were not ranks, but part of the merit badge system that recognized Scouts who had earned a specified number of merit badges. Eagle Scout was awarded to any First Class Scout who had earned 21 merit badges.

 

Order of the Arrow was Created in 1915...and Membership Requirements remain the same today as they Did in 1915...They required the Youth Membership to have Obtained the HIGHEST RANK POSSIBLE in 1915... rank requirement of First Class.

Boy Scouts and Varsity Scouts ( LDS VERSION OF A BOY SCOUT) are the same program basically.

 

The "Order of the Arrow" is the honor society of the Boy Scouts of America, intended to recognize older scouts in their teens who best exemplify the scout virtues of cheerful service, camping, and leadership. It was not nor is it a CAMPING SOCIETY

 

Explorers/Venture Crews did not exist back then..have ya connected the Dots Yet

BOY SCOUTS have resisted Change..

 

Should Today's OA require it Youth Membership also Achieve the Highest Rank. Based on the history of having to have acheived the highest Rank possible back then

Since Explorers and Venture Crews are not Considered "Boy Scouts" should they have to pay "Boy Scout Registration Fees" to the "BOY SCOUTS OF AMERICA"

Why are Cub Scouts and Venture Crews Required to Learn the BOY SCOUT OATH AND THE SCOUT LAW Next year...Will Females be EXEMPT from Those Requirements since they Are not Allowed to be Elected into OA?

I've also seen GSUSA troops doing trips/outings with BSA troops.

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qwaze ..

Anyone who is Not a Registered Member of the BSA loses Membership in OA..Youth or Adult..They may rejoin without having to do another Ordeal if they reRegister with BSA and Pay their Lodge Dues and still level of membership as when they become inactive..Ordeal Brotherhood or Vigil.

Yeah, I think there are election eligibility requirements (15 days/nights of camping in last two years, First Class, Scout master recommendation) and then there are membership requirements (elected, completed Ordeal, registered member of the BSA, Lodge dues paid). Venturers as members of the OA is no contradiction. They just can't be elected from Crews or Ships without also being in a Troop/Team.

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