war on Christmas

[evmori 11]

Dan,

What beliefs would I have to compromise? All of them.

 

Respect to me is like trust. It needs to be earned.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

A blessed Christmas to all

[DanKroh 11]

So Ed, then how do you reconcile the fact that as a Scouter, you swear to uphold the Scout Law, which says you should respect the beliefs of others, to the fact that you feel you cannot respect my beliefs without compromising all of your own?

 

[evmori 11]

Dan,

I respect your beliefs. You are free to believe what you want. I don't agree with them but I don't have to.

 

I don't know you. I have no idea if I should respect you as a person. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt since you are a Scouter, though.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

A blessed Christmas to all

[Trevorum 24]

I believe that respect is not earned; it can only be lost. Sometimes it can be re-earned.

 

Every person is worthy of respect even if you don't know them.

 

I respect every person unless they have actively given me a reason not to.

[Oak Tree 15]

Respect:

1. To feel or show deferential regard for; esteem.

2. To avoid violation of or interference with

 

When I say I will respect the beliefs of others, I'm using meaning #2, which is the way I perceive the Scout law to intend.

 

When I say "respect must be earned", I'm using definition #1.

 

Oak Tree

[DanKroh 11]

Ed says: " Dan, I respect your beliefs."

 

Well, I'm very glad to hear that Ed. However, I am concerned about how quickly you were willing to compromise ALL your beliefs to admit that.

 

I asked: "Ed, could you please specify which of your beliefs you would have to compromise to be respectful of a Pagan Scouter's beliefs?"

 

To which Ed replied: "What beliefs would I have to compromise? All of them."

[SemperParatus 1]

Whether you regard him as Lord or merely a great teacher, Jesus calls you to respect (and love) everyone, even when they offend you, disrespect you, or cause you far worse harm. I can't think of anything more difficult than that...or more liberating of the human spirit.

[DanKroh 11]

Nicely said, Semper.

 

And may the spirit of Christmas bring you and yours great joy, blessings, and peace.

[evmori 11]

Whether you regard him as Lord or merely a great teacher, Jesus calls you to respect (and love) everyone, even when they offend you, disrespect you, or cause you far worse harm.

 

We are called to love one another. Love & respect are not the same thing.

 

While I respect everyone's beliefs, I don't agree with everyone's beliefs.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

A blessed Christmas to all

[scoutingagain 20]

Since everyone is being so respectful I'm almost hesitant to post this link. However it seemed to fit into this thread the best.

 

It includes a Holiday Greeting from the ACLU.

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/usatoday/20051219/cm_usatoday/afictionalwaronchristmas;_ylt=AhMPuzOtdMYqSDTa2.dVDYqs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3YWFzYnA2BHNlYwM3NDI-

 

SA

[Rooster7 11]

I agree with Ed. Its important to understand and note the definition of words. While Jesus implores us to love one another, we are not exhorted to accept all people and ideas in high regard.

 

SemperParatus,

 

How do you reconcile -

 

Jesus calls you to respect (and love) everyone, even when they offend you, disrespect you, or cause you far worse harm.

 

As compared to Jesus words in these verses:

 

But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them: "You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? Produce fruit in keeping with repentance.

Matthew 3:6-8

 

Did Jesus respect these men?

 

Or these verses:

 

Whatever house you enter, stay there until you leave that town. If people do not welcome you, shake the dust off your feet when you leave their town, as a testimony against them. So they set out and went from village to village, preaching the gospel and healing people everywhere.

Luke 9:4-6

[SR540Beaver 116]

Ed and Rooster,

 

You are right, it is important to understand the meaning of words or sentences. I think you guys are viewing "respect" as accepting other people's beliefs that are contray to yours. I think the actual intent is to respect the person's "right to believe" what they want, not "what they believe".

[SemperParatus 1]

Respect...as in holding each other in esteem as a fellow human and child of God - not in whether or not we agree with another's words, thoughts or actions. I don't think it is possible to love if this broader concept of respect is lacking. R7, Jesus died for the Pharisees and Sadducees and you and me, all the same.

[gwd-scouter 11]

Just received a card today. Not quite sure what to make of it....

 

Says "Season's Greetings" below a painting of the Nativity Scene.

 

[Rooster7 11]

SemperParatus,

 

I believe Jesus died for all men. But not all men will receive Jesus. With that said, Im not sure what your point is concerning the Pharisees and Sadducees. He certainly did not respect them.

 

32"Whoever acknowledges me before men, I will also acknowledge him before my Father in heaven. 33But whoever disowns me before men, I will disown him before my Father in heaven.

 

34"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn

" 'a man against his father,

a daughter against her mother,

a daughter-in-law against her motherinlaw

36a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.'

 

37"Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me; 38and anyone who does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me. 39Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.

 

Matthew 10:32-39

 

Perhaps I am alone in my thinking, but Jesus does not seem to be saying, Say, do, and believe as you please, I will still respect you.