Pass the Knot

[BubbaBear]

Folks,

 

When I was Scoutmaster, I started a little ritual at the end of each meeting, campout, activity based loosely on a Roberts Rules of Order procedure called Pass the Gavel...I called it Pass the Knot.

 

I made a Monkey's Fist Knot and told the boys (and adults) that only the person holding the knot was allowed to speak. The person speaking was allowed to say whatever they wanted so long as 1) they did not attack anyone personally 2)did not "put down" the opinions of other speakers, 3) did not interupt anyone, and 4) when they were finished, they would "pass the knot" to the next person and was not able to speak again.

 

The Scoutmaster had the last word.

 

I am asking you in the Spirit of Scouting to do this with me now on this topic we have been discussing...I will serve as Scoutmaster.

 

OK, who is first??

[BubbaBear]

Having the last word here means nothing people...

this is about ALL the things we are supposed to be teaching the kids...if we can't practice those things here, how can we view ourselves as good examples for the boys? If it is a matter of me being the moderator (Scoutmaster) let me know, I am not afraid to step down, although my intentions are to not comment specifically, but rather provide a "Scoutmaster's Minute".

 

Jake

 

 

[dan]

BB

So I guess I am a little slow.

What are you asking for?

Comments on you monkey fist thingie?

A better way to do it?

Is it a good idea?

Comments on Bobbies Rules thingie?

(communtiions is an ar5t form )

 

I guess its okay but scouts should not need a monkey fist to talk in turn.

 

My sons troop does the same thing except they do not use the monkey fist.

All scouts and leaders can comment on what they liked and disliked about the outing. Only person that can comment is the SM.

 

[BubbaBear]

OK People...listen up!

 

For a very long time the pro's and cons of the homosexual debate have been posted here...we are currently a "house divided"...what I am looking for in this thread is for everyone whom has an opinion (on this subject) to express it, and express it once.

 

I do not expect that this issue will go away, but I would like to see those of us whom have been debating this topic to "virtually shake hands", and leave this arena as friends.

 

Dan, your last two sentnces didn't make sense to me...would you repeat?

[sctmom]

::: taking the knot :::

 

I think it should be a local unit option just like other issues about leaders. I don't think there are hordes of homosexuals waiting to take over the Boy Scouts.

 

 

::: passing the knot :::

[dan]

Oh this is a continuation of THAT discussion!? The one I have stayed out of.

 

Well my thoughts on it is, Wait it does not matter what my opinion is about gays being BSA leaders, because I will follow the BSA polices, and if I do not like them I will try and to change them or leave the organization, but not through an online message board!

 

My last 2 sentences just said that my son troop does the same thing as yours did with the Bobbies Monkeys fistiey thing without the Bobbies Monkeys fisty thingie.

 

[Quixote]

My knot - i'm taking it home with me - i need another one for my shirt...ok, so it's not that kind of knot.

 

I assume you're trying to get us to stop beating Secretariat up? Sounds good to me, maybe we can focus our energies on working with the boys instead of debating whether homosexual acts are related to bestiality and other perversions and whether morality doesn't mean anything unless it's in a vacuum.

 

Only problem is that issues such as these are what this particular forum is designed for - i think - a place to discuss "Issues & Politics" which is what this debate is.

 

I think everyone's thoughts on the subject have been posted on other threads.

 

Hey, kinda like how that monkey fist knot looks on my shirt (except it's too heavy) - you can have it back now, thanks.

 

YIS

Quixote

[BubbaBear]

Now you got the idea!

Quiote has passed the knot...

[evmori]

I now have the knot.

 

Debate is good. This is an excellent place to air ones views and to hear other views. We all won't like what others post and others won't like what we post. That's what debating is all about!

 

I now pass the knot.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

[sst3rd]

I'll take it, thanks.

 

You folks get so deep into this, I grew tired of reading. No one is going to change their opinions, period. I've said this before, there is already local option, it's just not a National BSA Policy in BOLD print in one of the manuals.

 

Our Troop's Committee has long since discussed our responses when and if the subject comes up. For the 37 years of our Troop, it simply has NOT been an issue.

 

I now pass the knot.............

 

anderson

[tjhammer]

I'll take the know for a quick question to sst3rd:

 

Since it seems like you might be suggesting that your committee (or if not yours, at least some local committee) assumes local control and might be receptive if a person of good character, who happened to be gay, were to apply for membership, may I ask if this position is well known among the parents and boys of your unit? Do you think that one 14-year-old boy in your unit who right now may be secretly struggling with the realization that he may be gay knows that he would still be welcome if his secret were to come out? Is he getting your message or is he just getting the message from the papers that Scouting thinks he's unworthy?

 

... putting down the knot, and listening attentively.

 

[nldscout]

I will take the knot, thanks

 

The problem with this issue is there is no middle ground. Some of us feel it is an ugly terrible thing to be gay, some see nothing wrong with it. There will never be a satisfactory resolution to this issue.

 

If BSA changed it would tear the organiztion apart. A lot of scouters, scouts, supporters and CO would drop.

 

Its to bad it just went as far as it did.

 

Passing the knot now.

[littlebillie]

(takin' it)

 

no one should be holding their sexuality up as a model, gay OR straight. and no one should be condemned based on it.

 

Any leader, or anyone, chosen as a role model is NOT being chosen for studliness on either side of the great divide. They're being chosen for their camping skills, or their communication skills, or their compassion. They're being chosen because they're good teachers. Sometimes they're being chosen just because they can show up regularly. So, I put issues of chosen companions aside and if they are responsible, dedicated folks, I welcome them.

 

I don't know anyone living who is a totally perfect role model. But I DO know a lot of folks who are really terrific at one or more things that are appropriate to scouting. If they can pass their scouting-related skill along, terrific.

 

That said - a pederast's a different matter altogether. Drawing and quartering, boiling in oil - that's letting them off too easy, gay or straight. Touch a kid, go to prison. Hitting a kid - we've all heard of it - that's out, too. Any abuse of the young by someone in a position of trust - must be punished.

 

(passin' it along)

[BubbaBear]

...taking the knot...

 

In as much as I have tried to be neutral in this argument, I have failed. I would advise those of you whom seek change to contimplate a glacier.

 

It is formed over time by powers that we cannot challenge and by shear size which we will be crushed by should we throw our bodies in front of.

 

Its course is predetermined and only the Almighty can stear its direction. Those whom ride on its size will only find themselves crushed by it eventually.

 

When the time comes that the glacier is to change the face of the earth, it will. Neither you nor I can dictate when that will be. We can dynamite it,

chip away at it steadily, but only time will change its direction, if at all.

 

Not everyone wants to change the direction of the glacier. Some revel in the shear power of it and some hide behind it. We will all take our positions as we see fit.

 

Who is right and who is wrong? Only the glacier will know, through time.

 

I ask forgiveness from God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit for my sins, not from mortal man.

 

You, Oh Lord, hold the glacier in your hands. Should I be wrong in where I position myself in relation to that glacier, set me on the path You deem righteous.I do not trust in those whom choose to speak on your behalf. And please guide my fellow Scouters as well, Oh Lord. AMEN

 

...passing the knot...(This message has been edited by BubbaBear)

[littlebillie]

...and in its wake, the glacier leaves the scree of forgotten ages, the rubble of that which it has crushed and collected and carried - and forgotten.

 

but standing before the behemoth is a slow path to self-destruction. years, and decades might pass before it takes you undertoe - more likely, you will be pushed blindly aside, for know this - the glacier is mindless.

 

it is an unintelligent, unthinking force that passes no judgement - it does not because it cannot.

 

Behold the glacier.