Stubborn SM

[MomScouter 10]

Recently my son moved to a troop that has the same CO as the pack he came from. There were several reasons we went there, one of which is that there are a lot of Webelos and their parents who want to join this troop next year and I have had a great working relationship with them as committee members and den leaders. My sons reasons for going there are because a good friend of his is there and he also likes the idea of having the Webelos he knows come on board. The SM has been doing this for close to 40 years and while he has a lot of Scout skills, he is really stuck in his ways. He does NOT really believe in the boy led concept - he runs the meetings and organizes activities that he wants to do. Ok I knew this before we joined but the SM had indicated he wanted to step back and take a lesser role so I figured he might do this after a while. Not so! Example - he really pushes hiking and the Hiking MB, told the boys last night they had to have it for Eagle but neglected to tell them that they could select Cycling or Swimming instead, and he was less than thrilled when I told them that. He said 'I have never known a boy who does not like to hike' but I suspect that is because he has never asked them! Camping is always at the same places, one place which is his property which is nice, but the boys do not select anything.

 

I am in the process of completeing SM training, and I am quite enthusiastic about the boy led concept, JLT training, etc, and would like to see the troop have an annual planning campout or meeting this summer as well as regular PLC meetings. I do not want to be SM, I would rather do committee and MB counselor stuff, but am willing to do what I can to steer this troop in the right direction. My problem is, how can I possibly do this without offending the SM? He is a valuable adult leader and would make a great ASM to help with skills and badges, but he is not running the troop (or letting the boys run the troop) the way BSA says troops should be run! All the district folks are aware of this and encourage my efforts but also keep their distance. It seems like my only option is to wait a year and get the Webelos parents to take training and come on board, at which time we would be a majority...but this doesn't sound like the greatest way to go. The CO is uninvolved for the most part. We live in a rural area and there are not a whole lot of options as far as selecting other troops, without a lot of travel. Any suggestions?

[Bob White 20]

Mom Scouter,

 

Every so often a unit goes through this same problem. It often is a situation that has grown gradually over the years, and since the Scoutmaster has remained the constant and families have come and gone, it was difficult to see developing.

 

Your Scoutmaster likely does not have 40 years of experience. He has a few years of experience that he has repeated several times over forty years. Because of that he is doing the parts of scouting he remembers or is comfortable with, rather than the current program.

 

Entrenched leaders often forget that the only Boy Scout Program is the current one. It changes because young people change, and good leaders change with it.

 

Another problem is the attitude of "My Troop" rather than "the Troop that I serve". Once a Scoutmaster feels it is his or her troop they have lost the proper focus. An adult who understands that the troop is owned by the Chater Organization and administrated by the Charter representative and the unit committee, is more open to suggestions and improvements than the "my troop" scoutmaster.

 

A good scoutmaster will not determine the scout program, he or she will deliver the scout program. Again, there is a big difference.

 

The troop committee needs to decide if the scouts are getting the program they expected and deserve. If not, they need to require the scoutmaster to adjust to the current program or they need to replace him. It is the committee's choice as to what to do and the Scoutmaster's option to make the right decision.

 

I understand the hesitation to replace a long time volunteer, but he has had 40 years to scout, your boys only get 7 1/2 at the most. you need to do what is right for them.

 

In my occupation I teach that there are very few occassions when you need to fire an employee. most of the time the employee has already quit, they just forgot to leave. Somtimes as volunteers we are guilty of the same thing. We need to recognize when a leader has stopped doig the job and help them find the way out.

 

Do not let the the emotions of the situation cloud the purpose. We are here for the boys, to deliver today's scouting program. If that means retraining the current Scoutmaster or selecting a new one, the committee needs to make the decision that serves the boys and act on it. The longer they wait the worse the situation will become.

 

Good Luck,

Bob White

 

 

[MomScouter 10]

Bob White,

 

As usual your words offer great advice. The program is for the boys. Unfortunately the current committee consists of a Chair who has been with the SM for a long time, and others who will not say a word. One year from now, others will come on board to chime in but for now, there are 2 of us who see it this way, 3 who say nothing, and the Chair who was flat out rude to me at the last meeting over a discussion about using merit badge (blue) cards. (She claimed they were not needed and merit badge counselors do not need to register anywhere).

 

Both the SM and the Chair are attending training with me but from what I can see, it is going in one ear and out the other when the 'boy led' or 'patrol method' discussions happen. I am going to talk to the unit commisioner next.

[sst3rd 129]

I assume that the SM and CC are taking training as a refresher instead of this being their first training in 40 years. It's a good thing. For them to continue to run the Troop the way that it's always been run, is in direct conflict with the program. Again, Bob's words are right on. I'm probably one of those old stubborn Scoutmasters, but I've moved on with the program as it has changed. I haven't agreed with all of the changes, but I take care of my primary responsibilities of training the youth leadership to execute the program as presented by the BSA. It is a flexible program in that it has lots of room for adaptation caused by the Troop's location and personnel. If the old SM believes so highly in hiking, so be it. But if the Scouts want to bike and swim, it's his reponsibility to provide the support (through the Committee, ASM's, etc.).

 

As I've grown older, there are things I just can't do anymore, but it doesn't stop me from providing the trained adult leadership to do the things the Scouts want to do. It is so important for the Scouts to see that this is their program. It is the only one like it.

 

If the old Scoutmaster can't see the writing on the wall, he's older than I think. If I saw a bunch of experienced, excited, and trained adult leaders coming up soon, I would feel blessed, not threatened. Do what you have to do !!!!!!! It's for the Scouts.

[Mike Long 10]

I can't really add to what's been said. All good advise. Just if all else fails be ready to either change troops or bide your time until you have enough support to change things.

 

Never known a boy who doesn't like to hike? I'll introduce him to a few. I'll also introduce him to some who really want to hike and can't.

 

Once again we are back to the "won't use the program as intended theme."

[shemgren 10]

I experienced a simular problem in the troop I serve as UC and COR. The SM had been there for 15 years and ran the program as he saw fit. Boy leadership was non exisitant and the patrols were in name only.

 

I got actively involved, but I was often told by the committee to close my ears and ingore the problems.

 

Ths SM came to me and expressed his desire to step down, and I started to search for a replacement.

 

The new SM went to training, started to use patrols and is open to suggestions. In addtion, the CC and most of the committee has changed.

 

There is hope, but the best choices for help is the UC and COR. The COR is charged with ensuring that the troop has adequate leadership to run the program in keeping of BSA and the CO rules and regs. The COR has the authority to remove any leader or member from the troop at any time he or she feels it is in the best interest of the troop.

 

The SM in MomScouter's troop is somewhat typical in a rural area. I would suggest toughing it out for the year, while letting the SM see that there is a light end of the tunnel, in the way of new leaders to help and maybe even giving him a chance to take a breather.

 

Go ahead and talk to your UC, MomScouter, he or she may have some suggestions you haven't thought of, since UC's usually are familar with the area and the goings on in the unit. Let the UC make the approach the SM with suggestions of change. If the UC cannot make headway, then go to your CO.

 

[Rooster7 11]

shemgren,

 

At the time you experienced the problem in your troop, I take it that you were not the COR? Just curious. Obviously if you were the COR, you could have forced the issue.

[shemgren 10]

At the time I started to actively pursue change, I was not COR. At the tail end of the period of the SM, I was appointed COR and began to push the issue, which probably helped the old SM in his decision to step aside.

[EdHunt 10]

Dear MomScouter:

 

I ran into a similiar problem several years ago. With the committe's help, we created a new postion "ScoutMaster Emertitas"..ok, down all you legal-regulation types...this was a very positive thing for the troop I was helping out. One of the troop helpers embellished a special "ScoutMaster Emeritas" badge, and we held the promotion at a court of honor, had the COrep there, even the local Mayor, and several of the influential politicians, chairpeople of this and that.

 

We had a large parchment scroll, and part of the ceremony was reading of all the accomplishments over the long career, and the new responsibilities of the "ScoutMaster Emeritas"-guiding the committee, guiding all the mb counsellors, meeting and greeting and guiding the Webelos visitors..etc.etc. We also introduced the new ScoutMaster who would try so hard to keep the troop at the same high standards in the tactical, day to day things like meetings, activities, etc. The new Emertitas was going to help guide long term strategy, like the "Soaring Eagle", looking far far ahead and not bothered with day-to-day trivia. (He was a great guy to send to roundtables, kick-offs, etc) You get the idea.

 

I think the guy was kinda relieved when it happened. We also required him to bring his grandkids to 1 meeting each quarter.....We were really glad we did it. The gentleman passed away about 9 months later...at at least we had an opportunity to recognize him and thank him for all his work. Give this a try, if ya want...maybe next year when your group is in the majority.

 

EdHunt

[tdyer56 10]

I believe you got that title from "Follow Me, Boys!" Am I right? That is my all time favorite movie. I cannot count the times I have watched it.

 

Tim Dyer

Pack 56

[Bob White 20]

Nothin' wrong with a Scoutmaster Emeritus title, just make sure you don't try to register that way. Scoutnet is confused enough without trying to figure out a new position ID #. probably best to register him or her as an ASM or MC (committee member).

 

Bob

[MomScouter 10]

Ed, I like your idea and was actually pondering something like that...my idea involved having an Eagle Reunion of all the locatable Eagles that have come out of this troop and honoring them and the SM. I thought this might be a good opportunity to recruit potential SM/ASM's too.

 

The good news is that the SM is starting to be accepting of having others take over some of the work and suggesting new ideas...we discussed finances recently and when he said 'we have plenty of money for our needs next year' (meaning advancements, etc) I said 'well some of these boys may want to go to Philmont or Jamboree or somewhere and will need to earn funds to get there' he was not only open to that idea but seemed happy that someone was willing to lead fundraisers and go to these types of events, campouts, etc, with the troop. So there is light at the end of the tunnel....Now I just need to get those Webelos parents excited about the program and into training next year!

[frostandmist 10]

One way to effect a gentle and respectful change would be to start working on the Patrol level. Any patrol can go on hikes, camp, do special projects, etc. as long as they have 2 deep adult leadership. Once the SM notes the ensuing enthusiasm, he just might join the crowd. We encourage our patrols to participate in at least a single activity per year and it works miracles. It is also a way of getting other parents involved. Remember to take photographs! Another way to open up the troop might be for a patrol to volunteer to prepare a month's schedule for submittal to the PLC. Yet one more way to show originality would be for a patrol to work on the American Heritage Award program. It is not difficult and once completed, and they wear their MEDALS, someone will get the picture! Jim Wallace, T-312

[EdHunt 10]

Hmmmmm....gee that movie sounds a little familiar....maybe it is where we got the idea. A creative Scout Leader is one that forgets his source, right? I have noticed that after I got my 40 year pin last fall I seem to forget more and more...lol. I just hope MomScouter's gentleman can be as gracious as Fred MacMurray was!

 

Regardless of the source, I experienced the power of this idea. It allows the leader to save face and avoids the frustration. I know the troop I helped really made it nice and not painful. Good luck!