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cardinal50

Adults wearing uniforms to boost ego?

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BadenP seems to think that any adult that wears a uniform who is not in a direct contact position with youth are merely feeding their egos or reliving their childhood.

The BSA is a uniformed organization.

I'm a Unit Commissioner and wear my uniform at every Scouting function as I feel I should set an example. I encourage all the adults in the units I serve to wear the complete uniform as it serves a two-fold function. First, it encourages the boys to wear theirs. Secondly, it's a outward and visible sign to the community at large that scouting is, indeed, present in the community on a daily basis. I keep my uniform very plain, only wearing POR, Council strip and District Award of Merit knot. I could wear everything I'm entitled to wear and dress like a third world general but I don't feel a need to feed my ego. At 60, I'm certainly not trying to relive my childhood. BadebP must hang around a lot of weird Scouters to cause him to form his opinions of those who aren't SMs,ASM, and others that hold "front line" positions.

 

YiS

Dave

 

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I think any registered adult attending a scout function who owns a uniform should wear it if the venue is appropriate for a scout uniform.

But, I think that uniform should meet just the minimum standard of the insignia guide.

Adults who adorn their uniforms in excess of the minimum standard are doing so to boost their own egos. The program is about the youth, not the adults.

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You are dead nuts on target!

 

The uniform is a key method of Scouting. Adults need to set an example - preferably wearing a full uniform. My own personal beef is that my son's troop uses really small neckerchiefs. They look silly on this 6'5" leader.

 

I like when adults have Arrow of Light, religious award, and especially Eagle knots on their uniforms ... I try to point out what they mean ... pointing out that its important to work hard to achieve those tough goals. Most adults I talk to wish they would/could have earned their Eagle (myself included). A kind of carrot if you will.

 

I like when adults wear their adult patrol patch (we use the Owl patrol - Old Wise Leaders) - another example set.

 

BUT adults who wear so many knots and other junk that they look like wanna-be generals ... its embarrassing.

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knot envy - not (pun) a pretty thing.

 

You know what I enjoy? Getting criticized about by my uniform by those who can't even wear the full uniform properly. Always brings a smile to my face.

 

Does the Insignia Guide actually point out which knots only egotists wear? I can't find it in my copy.

 

I didn't know there was a bare minimum in the Insignia Guide - which page is it on?

 

What about wearing the Philmont Bull on a Jac-shirt - are those guys egotists?

 

What about a SM or ASM wearing a campaign hat - are they egotists?

 

I need to know these things.

 

The program is for the boys, right?

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If a Scouter earns the knot then they are wrong if they do not wear the knot. Seems that would be the guidance properly prescribed by the insignia guide.

 

Why is it presumed that only youth earned knots (Eagle Scout, religious, and Arrow of Light) are okay but not any others? Those others indicate continued dedication and diligence to the cause of Scouting to me. But wear them properly and in accordance with the insignia guide. Do not wear extra embellishment that are not authorized or demean the purpose of Scouting. We are leaders that should be all about setting the proper example for the future leaders of America.

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Would it be better if we all dresed in monochromatic grey tunics and pants? Marched in formation and recited the same chant as to not show any individuality?

 

Then one day a cute girl in bright orange shorts and a white top can come running up and use a hammer to smach the notion of conformity

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I agree Nach. It's funny, but it seems the opinion of some is, "Congratulations on earning this award. Now put it away and never speak of it again, because you should be ashamed if anyone saw it on your uniform."

 

And maybe those that wear the uniform when others might think it "silly" just want to be included. How do you think the one boy out of uniform feels?

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Irsap,

I like your congratulations line.

The individual has to make a decision in this regard. New adult leaders are just as excited as the boys to receive some recognition. That first knot is an important one. After a while, maturity sets in for most, but not all. I'm sure it's those certain people that BadenP and others are referring to. As we age, we learn that many times "less is more." Compare two well-know generals: Patton and Eisenhower. One played it up, and the other played it down. We have the same in Scouting. Was either one wrong? No. Personal preference. Both looked good in a uniform ... as do we, when we wear it properly.

BDPT00

 

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And then there are some scouters in this forum that can't seem to read, grasp or understand what has been posted by others. Thick- Thicker- Iliterate, lol.

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If we're dense, or thick or illiterate, please enlighten us as to what you actually meant when you wrote in the other thread:

 

"The committee member, for one, does not need to wear a uniform to perform their behind the scenes functions, and while they can technically wear one because there is a "PATCH" for the position, the uniform in this case is nothing more than a self ego booster for attending an adult meeting once a month, not even working with the kids. Why on earth does that person need to wear a uniform except to call attention to themselves. "

 

Please enlighten us as to why it absolutely must be an ego boost and to call attention to themselves, as opposed to some other possibly non-self serving reason.

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Well I know a few adults who like to brag, usually they do not follow through. And I admit when I was a brand new OA chapter adviser at the ripe old age of 21, I too was seeking after the odd knot or two. My problem was that outside of my troop and a few folks on the lodge and council level, no one seemed to take a 21 yo Eagle and Vigil seriously (that may explain my post about the 18YO female ASM). I thought that if I earned the adult knots, then other adult leaders I came into contact with would take me more seriously. I was wrong, even after earning my STA, I still had folks telling me "You don't know what you're talking about," or "you don't know anything about the OA" despite serving on the council's training staff as SPL of the JLT course and serving on the lodge's ECM. Because these indiviudals had not seen me do my jobs in the past, they equated my age with a lack of KSAs and experience.

 

I had a great chat one day with the council's VP of training as he was once my ASM for BA22, and we worked together numerous times in the OA. he said it isn't what you are wearing that defines you, but what you are DOING that matters. Yes you are entitled to where everything you earned, and in fact he encouraged me to do so, but the more important thing is HOW YOU ACT (caps for emphasis, not screaming)

 

As BP would say, I got a lot of "swank" on my uniform. Yes it shows what I've done and been recognized with, but more importantly ti does a few things. First and foremost it reminds me that I must always live up the Scout Oath and Law, and as an Arrowmen, the Obligation as well.

 

Secondly it sets the example for the scouts in the program. they see you fully uniformed, then they want to be fully uniformed two. I knwo my son couldn't wait to get his TC necker, and uniform shorts because he see me fully uniformed, and that included wearing a necker.

 

Third the uniform serves as an inspiration to youth and adults alike. I love it when scouts and adults ask about some of the stuff I have on my uniform as it tells them of the opportunities that are available to them. I also point out some of the recognitions that others are wearing, especially the Philmont insignia. I want scouts and adults to think about having the same fun and adventure I had growing up and as a young adult in the program.

 

Sorry I cna keep this up all morning, but hte kids are up now.(This message has been edited by eagle92)

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When I refer to the minimum of the insignia guide, I'm speaking of the required items only, not the optional ones. The CSP, Position patch, World Crest, Epaulets, Unit numbers, Flag. For the adult, that should be the uniform. Any additional patches is to boost the ego of the wearer.

 

And I practice what I preach. I used to be an ego booster. My old uniform is adorned with every patch, knot, OA flap and hangdang I earned. Looks like a Central American dictator. But when I got the new centennial uniform, I decided to go commando and just do the required patches. Humbling really. Really helped me focus on why I'm a leader. I do for them, not me. Several of the other leaders in the unit asked me why the change (they thought I was just lazy). I tell them. Makes them think too. A few have followed my lead, others still look like Christmas trees.

 

Now the dilemma. Last meeting, one of my dear friends and co-leader on all our high adventures (I've spent more nights in a tent with him than my wife) presented me with that new 100 Year ring that goes around the World Crest. That is pretty cool. Do I defile my standards or put it in my collection box with the rest of my bling? I don't want to offend him, but I also don't want to slide down that slippery slope again. I guess I need to call my sponsor.

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Hmmmm.... I would have thought an "Insignia Guide bare minimum" would include Scout pants, socks and belt. Come talk to me about my uniform when you get those part right, ok?

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My only objection is to knots that can be had by stroking a check. I refuse to buy one of those. Those who put in hundreds hours working with boys or contrbute dollars at the unit level are equally, if not more, deserving of recognition. But miss a few roundtables and "no knot for you!"

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Gern,

I hear ya about the centennial ring. I try to wear only the stuff that has meaning that I earned. Yes I've earned the ring,and I do want to set the example with the cubs I'm now working with, but it's a "Gimme" so I am debating it also. But it looks so COOL on a CS uniform!

 

Also is it just me, but do the bellows pockets and smokes pocket add to the cluttered look? I look my centennial uniform and it looks cluttered and messy, but when I look at my ODL, which has all the same stuff except unit numbers, it looks very neat.

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