scotteg83

23 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

To be clear, if my wife wants to volunteer for GSUSA Troop at even 1 event lasting 1-2 hours she has to pay $25 and register as an adult.  

I am assuming if she wants to stick around, she has to volunteer.  And also assuming that Girl Scouts do not require the adult to stick around.  And if the Girl Scouts go camping, are adult (non volunteers) required to go?  At all age levels?

2 minutes ago, walk in the woods said:

I suspect @qwazse's point is using software is good for the adults, but, takes responsibility away from the boy.

Oh I understand his point, but I also know my Son has 2 incomplete blue cards in his scoutbook that he's sat on for the last 2 years now

17 hours ago, qwazse said:

I know I'm tilting at windmills.

Boys should not leave camp until their cards are returned. If the SM wants to sit in the parking lot and sign and separate the unit copy then and there, he may.

Scouts take home partials ... the advancement chair should never see them. This is for one simple reason: a scout may want to follow-up with a counselor the day he gets home. Making a boy wait until a court of honor to see his partial application is (dare I say it?) adding to the requirements.

Our local camps are using Blackplug software and it can be uploaded to Troopmaster (our achievement tracking site).  Parents have access and can view the partials the day after camp.  I know its not the same, but they have access to it.

Also, our advancement chair goes to camp with us, and with enough conversation, almost all our Scouts knew what their partials were before we even left camp.

2 hours ago, qwazse said:

With Dad's generous purchase of one bale of hay and a nice poster/target, I mastered archery in our back yard next to the woods between summer camps on a 25# wood bow that my brother had left in the basement rafters. (Best part of growing up: being tall enough to find stuff the rest of your family left in rafters.) That also included making/remaking bow string, fletching old arrows, learning the warp of an arrow and adjusting aim accordingly. It was the year my 100 year old grandpa moved in, and  after I made a run to the general store to buy his Marsh Wheeling cigars, he would sit out and watch me shoot. (Mom wouldn't let him smoke in the house). It's as vivid as that spring day: the memory of his weak arms and poor sight trying to pull back that bow.

I hope your son has similar good memories (excepting the tobacco purchase) as he masters this skill!

If you are concerned about a safe range, most big-box sporting good stores and sportsman's clubs have youth programs.

Regarding the troop, your son should be asking:

• Why he "got back" the blue card. It should have been given to him by his counselor at camp.
• Why his adult leaders are so arrogant to think that they, not their scouts, should be mismanaging blue cards.
• Why the troop advancement chair cannot read instructions. "Applicant will turn in this record ..." means just that. It should never be given to the unit by anyone except the scout via the SM after the SM has signed off on all three portions of the application.
• How soon the troop committee can revise its policies so that it delivers on the promise of scouting (which includes, among other things, a youth being accountable for his own advancement paperwork).

Our local summer camps gave electronic printed white cards instead of blue cards, and they go straight to the leadership on the last day of camp.  So I can see how the scout didn't get a blue card right away.

4 hours ago, Saltface said:

I sent an email on the 6th. How long did you wait for your response?

little over a week

51 minutes ago, perdidochas said:

Just talking about YPT. 

Yes, but this thread is on the topic that National is making those people register.

55 minutes ago, LVAllen said:

Really?

My state requires every volunteer who might have regular or unsupervised contact with students or in-class time to undergo a background check. "Regular" means more than 4 times in a month. The volunteer gets to pay $60 for the privilege. $33 if you are in the vicinity for more than 72 hours seems more feasible than that.

Yes, but do you tell parents that sign up for sports the same thing? Most parents plan to show up with their kid, and do as little as possible. They aren’t the “volunteer”, more like wishful innocent bystander.  But to say, registration double, or tripled (one parent or two) to have your child participate, is going to scare off parents. 

2 hours ago, perdidochas said:

I don't see the big deal. IMHO, all parents who go on campouts (even under 72 hrs) should take YPT for their own protection, and more importantly, so they know what's going on.  It doesn't take that long. 

YPT yes, but pay the $33 registration fee to National (plus whatever your local council adds for insurance) doesn't seem feasible. 

12 minutes ago, Pale Horse said:

My guess is that Cyndi @ Member Care Contact Center  (if that's even her real name) isn't quite at the level of the execs (lawyers?) at National writing the policy. Probably a midling call-center attendee who has to answer 1000s of calls/emails ever day about hundreds of different items.  Sure it'd be nice if they were all on the same page, but I bet if you resubmit the question 10 times, I'm not sure you'd get a consensus either way.

Sounds like that needs to be done,

who else wants to email and post results?

last time I looked:

Right side (your right):

BSA lifeguard emblem and/or aquatics instructor BSA emblem

Nothing else

Left side:

Mile Swim BSA (can be earned multiple times and get a patch for each time)

Boardsailing, Snokeling, SCUBA, Kayaking, Whitewater Rafting awards (not merit badges)

Special Swimming Recognitions from Local or Regional Camps (i.e. polar dip, canoe instructor, etc.)

1 hour ago, Chisos said:

This is not an uncommon occurrence.  Units are "owned" by their Charter Organization, so unit volunteers are also volunteers with that CO.

For example, my troop is chartered to a Catholic parish.  All leaders have to do BSA YPT, as well as our Diocesean youth protection training.

We were chartered by the knights of Columbus and met at the Catholic Church.  When the Knights gave the scouts back to the church, we were hit with the extra requirements from the church. The pack moved charters to the local hospital and the troop stayed on another year while looking for a different charter as well. 

Our troop:

Webelos Woods District Campout

Camping in New Hampshire and going ziplining 

camping at Acadia National Park

Day trip to indoor rock climbing

56 minutes ago, Pale Horse said:

72 hours across all events for the year?  Yeah right, let's break that down at the Cub Scout level.

• 10 Pack meetings @ 1.5 hour each (including setup and break down) = 15 hours.  Down to 57 hours left.
• ~14 ordinary Den meetings @ 1.5 hours = 21 hours.  Down to 36 hours.
• ~8 outdoor adventure den meetings (hike, field trip, etc.) @ 2 hours = 16.  20 hours left.
• 3 community service events @ 2 hours = 6 hours.  Down to 14.
• 3 Popcorn Show & Sells (oops better have 2 registered leaders at ALL scouting events 🙄) @ 2 hours = 6.  Down to 8 hours.
• Trip to the corn maze with the pack for 4 hours.  Just 4 hours remaining.

These are just some things off the top of my head, but I think we get the picture.  These are all events that "ordinary" parents attend, not leaders.  I haven't even got to Day camp or heaven forbid they want to come on a family camping overnighter.  It's pretty obvious the rule is written for singular activities exceeding 72 hours.  There's no way around it, if you did it else-wise every single parent would need to be registered.

Our pack goes camping 4 times a year.  Average 40 hours a campout 5pm Friday to 9am Sunday, that means my Cubs cannot attend all den meetings and pack meetings and only attend one campout, without going over 72 hours. 

I will say, that my council is claiming that if the parent is just in the background and not participating (not giving instructions or teaching) then that time does not count to the 72.  

16 minutes ago, NJCubScouter said:

They do not re-run the criminal background check for a recharter.  I believe, though I am not 100% positive, that they need your written authorization every time they run the criminal background check on you.  That authorization is contained in the adult leader application.  So, if you apply for a new position where a new application is required, they re-run the check, which you have just authorized.  That would include a registered unit leader registering with a different unit (i.e. pack to troop, or troop to crew, or troop to another troop, etc.); a registered unit leader registering at a different level (i.e. district or council); a registered adult registering to also be a merit badge counselor; etc.

That makes sense.  Just mean you can have a Scouter that has been registered in one position for 40+ years, and have a criminal background issue since they have never registered for a new position

So I emailed national asking about a clarification on the 72 hour rule, because our council was saying it’s 72 hours over a year span, and not just one event. This is what I got in response. So for my pack, that means every parent that attends more then 3 weekend camp-outs MUST become a registered leader, and pay the $33 fee to national.

Quote

Thank you for contacting Boy Scouts of America regarding Youth Protection.  Your council is correct, anyone that will be with our youth for more than 72 hours over the course of the years activities they should be registered and taking Youth Protection as an extra safeguard to keep our children safe. So if a parent is going to be at a camp out that is going to last 36 hours this weekend, and another camp out next month for 36 hours and then they are going to be attending anything else during the year they would need to take Youth Protection and be registered.  
If you need additional assistance, please call us at 972-580-2489. (Advocates are available from 7:00A to 7:00P CT; after this time you will be transferred to our voice mail which will be answered the following day) or send a reply email to MyScouting@Scouting.org and please include the *ref#24-2176327 number in the subject line.
Thank you for your support of Boy Scouts of America.
Cyndi
Member Care Contact Center

So i registered 7 years ago, and signed the background release.

So do they ever re-run a background?  Is it every year with recharter?

1 hour ago, qwazse said:

I honestly have never met a single boy who looked up our troop on a website.

facebook maybe, but its usually the parent that looks it up

7 hours ago, Saltface said:

What is it that we know?

that there's some bad people in the world lurking in the bushes to steal our children.

Now that is part sarcasm, but in some cases....

On 09/02/2018 at 3:06 PM, ham_solo said:

/Still plan to continue to use TroopTrack for our troop because it has every feature that people have been asking for years in their forums to be added to Scoutbook(and little if any progress has been made apparently over the years).

What feature?

Our troop still uses Troopmaster, and until Scoutbook has the ability to do it offline and then sync later, we will never swap.

My Pack does Scoutbook, so that will help with not having to pay the $70 we've been paying

Took it a couple weeks ago online, and took a training class on it last weekend so I can help the District training team do in-person training.

Glad to see the flip phone is updated. 

Really seem to hit huge on points versus the last edition, glad to see the focus on it, even if its overwhelming for some

welcome

On 08/29/2018 at 7:49 PM, Ranman328 said:

Our District did not turn away anyone.  There were no restrictions on what grade girls could join.  There are photos of one Troop in my area that has a girl in it and she went to summer camp with the Troop but yet according to the District Commissioner, we have no girls registered.  I guess it wouldn't matter since there are not any girl handbooks out yet.

That's sad.  This is a hard enough challenge to overcome properly, and to have a District do whatever they want, will only make it harder in the long run.  I am glad my daughter is only a first year Webelos this year, so hopefully some of the kinks will work out by the time to cross over.

19 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

This is my opinion, so take it with a grain of salt. I do not think SMs, Skippers, CMs, and CAs  should be working on the district level except as MBCs. They need to focus on their units. I also do not recommend DLs and WDLs serving on the district, except as MBCs and day camp staff,  because they are the primary direct contact leader for their dens. Serving on the district and council level can be overwhelming, time consuming, and does take away from their Cubs.  I've done it, and I wish I would not have.

I can understand your thought process.

But, if you take out SM, Skippers, CM's, CA's, DL's and WDL's, who is left?  Besides the old retired scouters that have no unit anymore, and could tell you all the glory days of BP, but nothing useful for the current issues at hand?  I appreciate learning from someone that has experience, but that also can show it in ways that are updated and with the current model of scouting. 

Also, being part of the District Training team, isn't a full commitment, at least for my district.  You offer your set skill set, for certain trainings, and only offer it when you are available.   We have a great "old timer" that does fire skills/safety.  We have another that does great Orienteering, a handful that help with cooking, etc.  Now the District Training Chair, that's a full time commitment, but that doesn't mean that person is the only one doing training at any given time.  In fact, ours arranges the training, but barely gives any herself.  I myself chip in for Den leader, CM, and Pack CC positional training, and have helped with BALOO. 

On 09/02/2018 at 9:53 AM, walk in the woods said:

I can't speak for @cocomax, and I appreciate your teaching baloo, but I can generally say solid unit leaders should focus their time and talents on their units.  It isn't the unit leader's job to fix the district.  It's the district's job to serve the unit.  That is especially true for direct contact leaders.

District is 99% volunteered leadership (only paid position is DE).  So yes, its the district job to serve the unit, but where do you think those volunteers come from?  Is it fair to say a solid unit leader should only focus on their own unit, and not share their knowledge and assist others?  If that's the case, even forms like these should shut down, because you have your own unit to focus on.

I support the district and other units as much as I can.  I wont miss my units events to help out, but my free weekends go to help as much as possible

On 08/31/2018 at 9:56 PM, cocomax said:

The GSUSA organization is a wonderful group.  After taking GSUSA Camper training, I can tell you it was light years better than my BSA Outdoor training.

  My BSA Outdoor training was 90% flip charts, and an obsession with leave no trace. . .  we were taught to always hike in groups of 5 or less to minimize impact on the environment, wear special soft sole shoes to not crush grass or worms, walk on rocks when possible, always pack out your used TP and Poop in zip lock bags, always carry a bear locking canister,  use window screen to screen the dirt where you camped to gather all the micro trash, place a tarp under were you are cooking to catch food crumbs,  when building a fire dig a hole and carefully set the dirt and grass in safe place and line the hole with a space blanket to shield the worms and microbes from heat, when done with the camp fire, pack out the ashes remove the space blanket and return the soil and grass to the hole. . .  I asked the instructor how often she camped and her answer was, "Never, I don't camp."  It was so boring, hour after hour of flip charts and hand outs.  They group that I was which formed little clicks,  and their was lots of bickering and unhappy people, 3 of the people did not want to take the class at all, but had to because they needed it for wood badge.  

My GSUSA instructors where two old girl scouts that must be in their 70's that have camped all their life and are still camping. . .  we played lot of FUN outdoor games, carved fuzzy sticks, started camp fires, sharpened knifes, tied knots, cooked bread on a stick, bandanna in foil, cooked hobo packs,  learned map reading, did a compass course, cooked an egg in a bag, made cookies over a campfire in a pair of cardboard boxes, we did skits, they told funny stories of their grand adventures,  the ladies ran use around all day it was such a blast.  It was such a great example of scout spirit and fellowship. It really made me look forward to working with the Girl Scouts.  One thing they reminded us again and again was this has GOT to be FUN. You must have fun with this, or the game of scouting will not work. 

 GSUSA is fun, my GSUSA troop is fun,  my Boy Scout Troop is very fun. . .

The GSUSA Council in my area is rock solid and very fun and have their act together, my BSA Council is a mess of infighting and incompetence, I do my best to ignore them.  

That funny, I just took ITOLS last month before taking my daughter to Webelos Resident Camp.  My ITOLS experience was almost Identical to your GSUSA training.  We did hands on learning.  Had multiple adults teaching the difference sections. We did all the hands on for each station, the Maps and Compass was done by a Scoutmaster that also does Orienteering competitions.  Had multiple maps of the current area and some from his troops trailblazing trips.  The backpacking section was done by a Scoutmaster that is working on his 4th trip to Philmont and went over his Philmont Backing.  Dinner was 5 different recipes that we all helped make, including Dutch oven whole chicken. Ropes was hands on, and I finally learned better was to remember some basic knots.  We even did the group campfire and did skits and songs.  I don't think we had a single flip book to view, most was done outdoors at the campsite.  Finally learned how awesome yellow birch bark is for fire starting.