Twocubdad

We have a two pound bottle of Gold Bond which stays by the latrine. Sounds like a good list, but my thought would be that much of this goes on the individual scouts' lists. Summer camp is a great time to start learning person responsibility and bringing what you need is the first step. We tell our scouts and parents if they want their son to have any particular OTC medication or ointment, they should put it in their personal first aid kit. That gives us sort of defacto parental permission and gets us off the hook of dispensing medication. We do ask the boys to let us know before they take anything so we're can keep an eye on them and follow up. I do like the alphabetical roster. We include several copies in a notebook we give the SPL. The camp director is always very impressed when our SPL hands him a written check sheet accounting for all our scouts during the Monday afternoon emergancy drill. The SPL notebook has all the schedules, activities, duty rosters, etc. for the week, including individual Scouts' schedules. That way, when we say "ASK YOUR PATROL LEADER" he will actually have the right information. We run our own first year program for our new Scouts so that drives a whole list of stuff -- ax yard stuff, map and compass, one patrol tub to cook with (the new Scouts cook in the campsite one day), first aid instructional materials. My general list is much more program heavy too: All the camp lanters we own (hard to play checkers in the dark) Tiki torches (gives the site a cool, "Survivor" look) Wood carving tools and neckerchief slide blanks Leather working tool and belt blanks, scrap leather for tinkering. Dutch ovens for brownies Peaches and condensed milk to juice up the ice cream mix the camp provides Wednesday night Throwing hawks, target butts and caution tape for our private range. Rope tub for hanging hammocks and building a gateway if anyone gets ambitious. Rechargable hair clippers (we're known for our stylish mowhawks.) We try to make summer camp a fun place to go hang out with you mates for a week. We try to have alot of fun stuff in our own campsite for the guys to do. And it works. I have 16- and 17-y.o.s coming to camp for the sixth and seventh year just 'cause it's fun. This year six guys got off the plane from Philmont at 12:30 am Sunday morning and were at the hut at 11:30 that same morning to go to summer camp. Our guys take Rifle Shooting, or Metal Work or Shotgun Shooting or Water Skiing sometimes three years straight just because they enjoy it. And I encourage it. A couple times I've had MB instructors or other SMs ask why I allow these guys to repeat the same MB over and over. Are you kidding? I think it's great. And I forbid them from taking Communication, Personal Fitness, Citizenship, Personal Management or Family Life at camp. I take the heat from the parents and let the boys off the hook. "Sorry mom, the Old Man won't let me take Communications."

Interesting analogy, John. I'll continue it and note that the fellow driving 90 as well as the guy driving 30 are both endangering the rest of us who are going with the general flow. I got you beat, UC. I was an Eagle at 13 and a half. Then did much of the same stuff you list -- Philmont, jamboree, OA officer, religious emblem, palms -- rolled over to ASM at 18, attended troop meetings during breaks from college and served a year or so as a real ASM after college. My SM had to pry my fingers from the scout hut door jamb the night of my last troop meeting before I moved away to take a new job. But you and I were the exception then, and that track is a great exception now. Most 14-y.o. Eagles may hang on for a year or two through middle school and maybe a year of high school before moving on to other things. Many are gone the day you hand their mom the medal. Some guys will stick with the program because a particular element has a strong appeal to them (OA, high adventure, general camping). But except for OA, a 15- or 16-y.o. Eagle Scout can do bigger and better on his own with his family and/or friends than he can in Scouts -- and without two dozen 11 and 12 year-olds tagging along. The Scouting program requires a lot of moving parts to keep older guys interested -- fun outings, challenging adventure, leadership opportunities, big events like jamboree or NOAC and a critical mass of same-age friends. Advancement is a key component and one of the few boys can't find outside Scouting. If they grab that carrot too early, you've lost one of your prime tools for keeping older boys engaged in the troop. Yeah, everyone has guys they can point to that are exceptions, like the fellows you and I look at in the mirror. But the big numbers are in the boys who don't eat, sleep and breath scouting with parents who don't really get it and see the program as just another resume building check list activity to push their son through. Scouting is -- or should be -- an experience, not a process. Experience takes time. The longer you are in the program, the more you get out of it. By definition, a young man will experience more if he takes 18 to 24 months to earn First Class than if he does it in four. The fellow who earns Eagle at 16 or 17 and takes an elder statesman role in the troop will experience far more than the guy who eagles at 14 and drops out shortly there after. Part of my job as SM is to help the boys get the most out of Scouting they can. One element of that is helping the scout find the right pace and helping him maximize his scouting career. Sometimes that means a kick in the pants to get him going; sometimes that means a hand on the shoulder to slow him down. We don't place artificial obstacles in the way of advancement (such as one local troop which has a set of prescribed age limits for each rank). There is more art and finesse to mentoring boys than that. The goal is to temper but not smother their enthusiasm to last seven years. I have one new scout, Davie, now who has his book out for me to sign something every time I see him. The kid is a very enthusiastic Scout backed up by a rather pushy helicopter mom. After his second campout with the troop, Davie came to me to sign off on his First Class cooking requirements. He had, on the surface, been responsible for the patrol cooking for the weekend. The patrol agreed on a menu and he did the shopping. For breakfast they had pancakes and bacon. Davie was in the middle of things but so were several other guys with the troop guide there to show them when to flip each pancake. Lunch was sandwiches for which Davie laid out the fixin's but everyone made their own, and dinner was burgers, again Davie held the spatula, but the TG told him when they were ready. Did he meet the requirement? By the letter of requirement, yes. Did he learn anything? Maybe how to cook pancakes, but I don't really know since he didn't do it without help. Has he mastered camp cooking? Not close. Did I sign the requirement? Not a chance. Rather I referred him to Mr. Steve, an ASM who is a master outdoors chef, does all the cooking for the adults and counsels cooking MB and supervises First Class cooking. He's the only one in the troop authorized to sign-off that requirement. He doesn't have a set, one size fits all program, but he works with the Scouts based on their interest and abilities. He will probably discuss what the Scout has cooked with his patrol already and why he thinks he's ready to serve as patrol cook for a weekend. He will help the Scout develop a balanced, challenging menu, which the Scout then has to run by his patrol. He may suggest the scout cook his menu at home a time or two. If Steve is cooking something similar for the adults, he may invite the Scout to work with him. Maybe the boy cooks one of his meals for the patrol one weekend before serving as patrol cook. Ultimately, what we tell our Scouts is the campout on which they complete the cooking requirement shouldn't be the first time the cook for their patrol; it should be the best time the cook for their patrol. We try to apply some variation of that to most requirements.

I'll be the one to say it -- four months as a Scout and one requirement from First Class IS to fast. Even if this kid is an absolute master of every skill (which I don't believe), one Scout blowing through the requirements leads to a poor troop program. It creates undue competition to advance and puts pressure on the whole program to push Scouts along. It perpetuates the Cub Scout mentality that we don't do anything unless there is a badge at the end or at least a bunch of requirements to be checked off. It leaves boys with a one-and-done attitude about scout skills. Everyone gives lip service to Scouting being about the journey, not the destination. What sort of journey are these boys on?

I hope everyone can agree that we take all the boys as individuals. It is hard to imagine anyone with the empathy and desire to serve as a Scout leader would automatically lump every at risk inner city minority kid with a bandana as a gang member and beyond redemption. It occurs to me that part of this process must be determining which boys are "at risk" and those who ARE the risk. Your boys who really want to be Scouts and enthuasically show you their knots may be at risk but don't pose a risk, despite some scrape with the law in the past. The point many of us are trying to make is that a recent arrest for dealing meth is a rather strong indicator that a youth may present a risk to the other fellas and, at minimum, merits some serious consideration.

Or at least recognize the limits of their own competence and direct the boy and his family to somewhere else that is better equipped. EURKEA!

First, I'll note that I'm responding base on the expectation of my unit, our chartered organization and parents. I won't say we have a zero tolerance, but a very low tolerance for Scouts using drugs or alcohol on an outing. I will allow that other units may have other expectations. Also up front let me say that the "sharing" is the big issue here. Maybe he and a couple of his peers like to smoke together and it was just his turn to bring it. That's one thing. But if there is any hint, any suggestion, any thought that the "sharing" was in the form of encouraging younger kids to give it a try, he's out. Period. Third rail. Letter goes to council. But to work through Lisa's hypothetical, let me make an assumption -- or perhaps just read between the lines: That the boy "frequently" brings pot on campouts says it has happened more than once over a period of time. That "several" boys have reported his offers to share says it has been know for some time by troop leaders. This has been going on for a while and has been tolerated by the troop for one reason or another. If that is the case, and the troop leaders have buried their heads in the sand, THE LEADERS should be replaced. No competent leader knowingly allows a Scout to use and distribute drugs or alcohol on troop outings. Frankly, in that situation I'd be surprised if the council didn't revoke memberships and the unit's charter. On the other hand, let's assume the leaders are the last people on the planet to know this has been going on. Me, personally, the first thing I'm going to do is some research and find out how and where to get the family the professional help they need. I'm not qualified. Next, I'll involve my CC, COR and IH. I'll probably give my DE a call to let him know what up in case it hits the fan. Then I and another leader (probably CC) sit down with the family. We walk through the steps of what has occurred, but in this situation it sounds like most of the facts are known. We offer them our support and help and give them all the information we've learned. Our "counseling plan" for the Scout is this -- bring dope to another troop activity and we call the police. If the Scout is to continue with the troop, there will probably be conditions, such as tenting arrangements, random searches, etc. That, too, would be something we would need to research and discuss to find a workable plan. And all this would apply to any of his smoking buddies too.

Sonofagun! That's pretty much the same way I would have handled it and, in not so many words, close to what I posted last Tuesday. I would also add that you have to honestly and carefully assess the responses. Do you believe him? Is he sincere or just telling you what you want to hear? Are his parents supportive or dismissive? And more important than what he tells you, what does he SHOW you? Does he walk the walk or just talk the talk? And that takes time. I don't think you have this conversation the morning after an arrest. For one, the Scout and his family have more pressing concerns. And I think it wise to let the legal process work, (but given the speed at which the justice system works, not necessarily through to a final legal conclusion.) The only Scout I've ever dismissed from the troop walked through that process a couple times, giving all the right responses. But his on-going behavior clearly demonstrated he had no intention of following through. The troop leaders couldn't trust him to follow instructions or obey basic rules -- including those related to his and other's safety -- so it was time to end the relationship.

Perhaps I spend too much time watching Breaking Bad, but dealing meth strikes me as a pretty serious charge, not a "spot on his record". Any leader who takes seriously the health and safety of the Scouts in his charge MUST consider the possibility that the charges against this kid are legitimate and there is at least a possibility it is an on-going problem. But as to your hypothetical -- I'm struck by the phrase, "and all you wanted to be was a boy scout." What does that mean? That I want to continue to go camping? That I like having a place to hang out on Tuesday nights? That I have a new market for selling meth? Or does that mean I really want to demonstrate Scout Spirit by living the Scout Oath and Law in my everyday life? If being a Boy Scout means the latter, I would have some work to do one way or the other. I would want to talk to my Scoutmaster and let him know what was going on (if nothing else, to get ahead of the rumor mill). I would want him to know what I had or had not done and what I planned to do about it. If all I want to do is be a Scout, I would ask his help to do my best to disassociate myself from the wrong places and wrong people who got me in trouble. Or if there were more to the charges, to do my Duty to Country and obey the laws in the future. I would want his help to prove my innocence or to help me get back on the right path. And if I didn't have the courage or maturity to initiate that conversation myself, I would hope my mom would, or my lawyer, or probation officer, or even a nosey mom in the troop who brought my situation to my Scoutmaster's attention -- even if she did so with less than noble reasons. There are many Scoutmasterly and Scout-like approaches to dealing with this situation. In the context of my suburban, cupcake troop, I feel like I could be fair with the Scout and balance the concerns of the troop with the needs of the Scout. But I readily admit that in the context of a inner-city LA troop my approach is probably out of line. So with your experince dealing with troubled Scouts, BP, what would you DO? Here is your teaching moment. Give us some specific suggestions with verbs in the sentences. I've re-read the thread and all I've seen are criticism of other folks approaches and few details on your approach. In fairnes, you have said you want to give him another chance and build his trust, okay but what does that look like? How do you implement that second chance? Is it a passive, "I'll just keep my eye on things" or do you actively engage the Scout with a plan for dealing with the situation? What would that plan be? How would you engage the young man and his mom? If a passive approach is best, why do you think so? Does actual guilt or innocence make a difference to you? How do you make sure this isn't an on-going situation? If it comes to light this guy is a hard-core meth dealer, do you change your strategy? Where do you draw the line? Is there a point at which criminal behavior is incompatible with membership in your troop? What steps do you take to ensure the safety of the other Scouts in the event that this isn't an isolated instance? How do you allay the fears of the parents who watch too much TV and don't want their sons associating with even suspected meth dealers? BP, I'm trying to be straight-up and understand how you would handle this and not being argumentative. Help me out.

That was the edited version? Gee, I hate to think. Since many of us idiots are more or less agreeing with SP, I suppose that makes a whole bunch of folks unfit to be Scout leaders. Hmmmm. Or maybe we see "help other people at all times" in light of the dozens of other boys in the troop, not just the accused drug dealer. Or maybe the best way to help the one kid isn't in a program which encourages adults to step back and allow the boys to learn from their mistakes. There seems to be a case to be made that controlled failure isn't the best teaching tool for this Scout. I don't see anyone here suggesting that kids like this one never become Scouts. And even this kid had the opportunity. But Scouting is a priviledge, not an entitlement. No, this isn't murder or rape, but that really where you draw the line? Dealing meth isn't like having a couple of loose-rolled joints in your sock either. We all should be able to draw that line where we see fit for our units. Bless you for the work you do with boys like this. But don't damn the rest of us who don't have your training and aptitude.

But that's the problem, BD, as far as the OP knows, the leaders are unaware of the more serious charges against the boy. They're looking at a disrespectful, hyperactive troublemaker who seems to be getting better. I don't believe it is a forgone conclusion that the boy is expelled. Arrest doesn't mean conviction and perhaps the fellow was just standing on the wrong corner at the wrong time. But you find that out by talking with him and his mother. And you are absolutely correct that the unit leaders need to keep a close eye on the situation, but how do they know to be more vigilant if they don't know about the meth dealing charges?

Shoot, most years we had more than 55 Tag-a-Longs. Never had fewer than 225 campers. One year we were over 325 with 100 volunteers and 75 or 80 siblings in camp. Big numbers are doable. 1)We used a system of "Day Camp Coordinators" from each pack. They handled registration and any orientation-like issues for the scouts in their pack. Everything a parent needs to know should be included in an info flyer the coordinator gets to the parents via best channel (email, handouts at pack meetings, etc.) We never had a parent/cub orientation and never felt the need for one. 2) Every den had it's own place, in our case every den had it's own table in the main gym. On Monday we had multiple staff members at the door with master rosters helping parents and cubs ID their den and point them in the right direction. If a parent felt the need to walk to the table and speak with the DL, fine. If they kissed them at the door and patted them on the butt, fine too. The DL's handled check-in for the den -- took attendance and turned attendance sheets in to HQ; collected lunches; distributed nametags, etc. At a set time all the dens assembled at the flag pole for the opening and we were off. 3) Lock the gate. Seriously, have a staff member at the door turning people around. 4) Tell them so. I like the idea of making the parent march their kid through the woods to the archery range if they're late. As far as early pick-ups, I think your camp is too long. And if you only have a few kids left at 4:45, your customers are telling you camp is too long, too. If 8 to 5 is too much for sitting in school, it's for dang sure too long for a high-energy day camp. Hell, I'm exhausted just writing about it. Our camp was 8:00 to 4:00 for staff, 8:30 to 3:30 for campers. To my knowledge, working parents' schedules were never a problem. As we're in a suburban area and many if not most working parents commute, for us to accommodate work schedules we would have to be open from 6:30am to 6:00pm. Um, no. We're a volunteer-run a Cub Scout program, not day care. Parents generally worked out car pool arrangements or coordinated pick-ups within their packs. Again, that was an area where the pack coordinators helped out. As far as meeting space, how do you meet the standard for emergency shelter? Go back to your materials from camp school. Go through the case studies of the larger camps. It's in there.

But if our pack only accepts the perfect outstanding examples of kids...have we really done anything? I think you should try that. Add "We only accept perfect, outstanding examples of kids" to your Roundup flyers this fall. Let us know how it works out. My prediction is for a 50% increase in membership and a 100% increase in problem kids.

In this case, the staff treated the Scouts, the unit leaders and in some cases their own staff members as suspects and subjected them all to individual questioning (like a 52-year-old bank executive is likely to write obscenities on the wall, huh?) My real question is what standing does a unit leader have to demand access to the Scouts and/or that questioning be stopped until a parent (or I suppose a lawyer) is present? Who has legal responsibility for the youth, the unit leader or the camp staff? And by the way, I agree with you about the BM situations. We had a situation like that at camp one year. The staff closed the showers for a day demanding the responsible party come forward (right, like someone will admit to that), then demanded the troops in that half of the camp all clean the showers (again, like we can get 150 people in one shower stall to clean it). When I and another SM checked it out, it was evident that some poor kid just had too many helpings of the mac & cheese and exploded a day or two later. And just as important, from a health and sanitation standpoint, we couldn't see having a bunch of kids do the cleaning, so the two of us handled it. But being weird and generally sick individuals, we still had fun with it. We showed up for assembly that night with an "evidence bag" containing a specimen. Coincidentally, the camp dog was a "retired CSI canine" who sniffed the evidence bag and then was led around the assembly looking for a match. Of course it could have just been a Baby Ruth bar in the evidence bag. You know how sleep deprivation and camp food plays tricks with the mind. Funny, there were lots of leftovers after dinner that night.

I agree with NJ's post regarding the "new program syndrome." Yeah, great. Who's running it? This is something that if a parent or ASM gets excited about and wants to pick it up, fine. I don't have time. I'm doing well to deliver the basic program to 62 boys. But honestly, I don't think anyone else in the troop follows stuff like this closely enough to ever find out about these sorts of programs. If they're waiting for me to do the research and try to recruit a coordinator, it will have to wait until after the next troop meeting (and there is always a next troop meeting.)

With the legal department (Beavah and NJ) apparently back from vacation, I'm bumping the thread for their input.

Tough situation. In most cases, I would agree with John that the principals should sit down and work out a plan. I would expect the Scout to be involved in the plan and I would expect that he show the appropriate remorse and contrition regarding his actions. Depending on what he had done (and dealing meth would be about as serious as it gets) I would also expect some cooling-off time so everyone can clearly see that all the indicators are headed up. A reasonable cooling-off time may be until all the legal proceedings have been settled. But that all depends on all the principals -- mainly the CC, SM and COR -- fully understanding the situation and having the opportunity to evaluate it. That doesn't seem to be the situation here. The OP's issue is whether or not to share what she knows (however she may have learned it) with those principals. All other things being equal and not knowing all the mitigating and aggravating circumstances, as a SM I would want to know if a Scout in my troop has been arrested for dealing meth. What we would do with that information would depend on the particulars. I can envision situations where we would embrace the Scout and even appear in court on his behalf. I can also envision situations where he would be immediately dropped. But I believe the unit leaders should be allowed to make that decision based on the best interest of troop.

My concern would be demonstrating leadership. Sounds like a fairly craftsman-like project. I would be concerned about throwing valuable antique doors and hardware to a bunch of Scouts. Of course you son may have done the research and have the skills and patience to do a careful restoration on the pieces, but the other Scouts? How is he going to train them and make sure they have the ability not to damage the pieces?

Calico has it right. Just say no.

1. Take care of yourself. Take a shower every day. Drink more water than you think you need, then drink some more. Poop everyday. Eat your fruit and veggies. 2. Take care of each other. Watch out for the guys who aren't following rule #1. Look after the little guys, especially right after dinner when everything starts to wind down and guys are most susceptible to being homesick. Look for kids off by themselves or in their tent and not participating with the group. Draw them out. Ask them to hang out with you and play a game of checkers or cards. Take them to the trading post and buy them a slushie (let me know and I'll give you the buck.) 3. Make time to try something new. 4. Spend time just hanging with your mates. This is what summer camp is all about. Go canoeing with a buddy. Get off your butt and go with a group to free swim. Walk with a bunch of guys over to the athletic field and get in a pick-up ball game. 5. Participate, even if it doesn't seem cool. You're at Boy Scout camp for heaven's sake. YOu're really worried about looking cool? 6. Sit with a different group at least one meal every day. You'll be surprised.

Say I read the regs such that squirt guns are okay. What's the down side? Anyone ever hurt in an illegal squirt gun shoot out? Any adult's membership ever stripped for sanctioning a squirt gun battle? Insurance cancelled? Please don't go down the "A Scout is Obedient" road. We've done that enough in Uniforming threads. Assume someone honestly doesn't believe squirt guns are banned or just ignorant of the policy. There must be more pressing issues to worry about.

Okay, a little more info, but not too much to maintain confidentiality. According to my leaders on site, the damage was minor and there was some question as to when it took place. But it was to a irreplaceable camp icon so everyone was wigged out. They looked at photos from a year ago and could see no difference. There's no evidence when the damage took place -- that evening, last week, last year.... At the time the damage supposedly occurred my Scouts were in their tents asleep. Three senior staff members were in our campsite and verified this. They were still asleep later when the camp staff came and woke everyone after the damage was discovered. End of story, right? Nope. Next morning, my guys and several other units were pulled out of programs for questioning. Scouts AND LEADERS were questioned individually for anywhere from 20 to 40 minutes each. The interrogations were private but two deep. No unit adults participated. Well after lunch they decide to pull my guys back in for a second round of interviews. By mid-afternoon, one of our leaders FINALLY stepped in and said they needed to wrap things up. No all Scouts were interviewed twice. Ultimately, nothing came of it. But our guys lost most of a day at camp sitting on their hands waiting for the investigation to concluded. Clearly this put a damper on the trip and a bad taste in their mouth for this camp. They were finally released about 3:00. In no small measure I'm upset that my leaders did intervene sooner and more forcefully. This is an out-of-council camp so I don't have any contacts the way I would in-council. In some respects it's over and done with, but it still seems to me there needs to be some apology or resolution. Beav, NJ, I'd still like your thoughts. The Scouts in question had a minor disagreement with a couple staff members. Sometime during the late evening, a valuable piece of camp memorialbilia was said to be vandalized. According to the unit leaders on site, the damage was barely noticeable and there was no evidence as to when the damage had taken place. The staff members the Scouts bumped heads with apparently pointed the finger at these Scouts.

At world jamboree some of the nordic contingents (I don't remember which ones) built incredible pioneering projects -- a 24-foot, four-person working ferris wheel which operated with a rope wound around the center axle and pulled by 15 or 20 guys like spinning a top; a 12-seat in-line swing where the swing seat was a 16-inch x 20-foot log shaped to look like dragon; a DaVinci bridge which was probably 20-feet long and 10- or 12-feet tall (since a DaVinci bridge is held together without lashings, not sure if that counts as a pioneering projects.) The COPE folks here would be apoplectic.

So let's say hypothetically there is some rather serious case of vandalism at camp and the camp staff chooses to question members of nearby troops. Are there BSA policies or procedures in place relating to how this should be conducted? Specifically, how long can camp staff detain Scouts for questioning? Do troop leaders have a right/responsibility to be present during the questioning? (Not from a two-deep standpoint, but from the standpoint of protecting the Scout's legal position.) And perhaps a question for our legal eagles, how does this change if law enforcement is involved? How is information gathered by the staff treated by actual law enforcement officers?

Finally, a physical skill where we chubby kids have an advantate. Life is good. On average human beings are slighly positively bouyant and if floating like a cork will settle in with the waterline just above their eyebrows. Unfortunately, this doesn't do much for breathing. Through the years as a WSI and teaching hundreds of kids to swim, I never saw anyone who was truely negatively bouyant. Usually, holding a good, deep breath is enough added bouyancy to get you above water. The trick is getting to the point that the few percent of your body above water includes your mouth and/or nose. That's a skill which just about everyone can learn. You all know the drill -- head back, arch your back, hold your breath -- almost always works, but for some folks a little fluttering of the hands and feet is required. I'm okay with that. I don't think "resting" requires being perfectly still. If the boat sinks and I'm swimming to shore, I don't think anyone will mind if I flutter my feet a bit while taking a break. I'm just back from camp, so I missed the parent thread. But a question: Is this a real issue or just an academic discussion? Are kids being turned down for "swimmer" because they move a little while back floating? If so I'd have a conversation with the aquatics director. If they can't float on their back even with a little propulsion, they need more instruction.

Our camp has a couple gators for use by camp staffers with a need for hauling stuff, not to avoid walking. Of course there are also pickup trucks used for the same purpose. Units are allowed vehicles in campsite only with a permit which are issued only for special needs. One of our ASMs is getting up there (older than dirt beats being covered with dirt) and he was allowed to keep his vehicle in the campsite and drive around camp. He mostly walked with the rest of us but did drive a couple times when he needed to. Golf carts would be treated the same way. Frankly, if someone needs to get around, a golf cart would be less innocuous than a Ford F-250 crew cab. Maybe 3 or 4 four years ago, providing your SM a golf cart was the status symbol for the high-end troops. They went from one the first year to a handful the next, before the council established the policy.