purcelce

lol Barry!

I'm not overweight, sort of in shape, and I still don't like portaging. At one portage I grabbed one of the gear bag and it must of weighed close to 100 lbs. I stood up and whamo, fell on my back. I looked like a turtle upside down. I made it back up to my feet and whamo, fall on my butt number two. Once I made it up to my feet again I leaned forward and headed toward the next lake. Good thing nobody saw me.

Dan,

We had about 20-23 portages. On our 3rd day we had back to back 120 rod portages. I still don't like em

Dan,

We got back yesterday afternoon. Great trip, but I still hate portaging. Quick highlights.

-Canoe tipped over on first day and I got wet.

-Food was pretty good.

-Fires didn't affect our groups.

-Ran into a Venturing Crew from New Orleans.

-I hate portaging.

-Awesome pics that I will post on a website and send you guys the link.

-Only bear we ran into was the one that hangs around the outfitters.

-hauled fishin' tackle for 70 some miles and didn't catch a stinking thing.

-I hate portaging.

-Got a killer tan.

-I peed on Canada.

-Candian Boarder Outfitters are an awesome group.

I've got 8 from my crew going.

I went to NOAC in 2002 and had a blast. Wish I was going this year, but Ely and Woodbadge drained my scouting trips fund.

Saturday morning I take Crew 805 to BWCA. There's 15 of us going (two canoe crews) and I finally get my first vacation in three years away from civilization. Tour permit, med forms, and gas money is all taken care of.

If anybody has and last minute tidbits now's the time to let us know.

Cary P

Crew 805 Advisor

Mr Backwood,

So you are a committee member for your troop. Good for you.

But I'm raising the b.s. flag. It appears that you have a grudge against this scout and his SM dad.

The kid earned Eagle and he should be congratulated. Then I suggest you find another troop that would be a good fit for you and your son. No need in having bad vibes and taking the fun out of scouting for you and your son.

my 2 cents.

Cary P

The OA is the only national society. Several councils have their own honor society. A few that I have been in contact with are:

Tribe of Mannasseh (Okaw Valley Council)

Tribe of Mic-O-Say (Pony Express and Heart of America Council)

Firecrafters (Crossroads of America Council)

Only world cup stuff I got to see this time was the Portugal/England match. Would have loved to have seen yesterday's game, but I had an Ely shakedown to conduct.

All I'm seeing is just one side of the story. The application must me signed by the unit leader and committee chairman. According to the post by backwood. This means the Committe Chair is in kahoots with the Scoutmaster.

Most Eagle applications are reviewed and certified by a council representative to make sure all merit badges correspond with the council records, and other dates (birthdate, last board of review for life etc) before a council rep signs the application.

Backwoods how are you assoicated with the troop? Committee member or ASM? I need more info before I can give my opinion.

I've sat on seveal Eagle BOR's as a member and a few times as the "chairman of the board". so I have a little exprience with this.

YIS

Cary P

Welcome, grab a cup of coffee, throw a log and some girl scout juice on the fire and enjoy the ride!

Welcome, grab a cup of coffee, throw a log and some girl scout juice on the fire and enjoy the ride!

I just got back from Camp Happy from my week stint as Aquatics Director. Great week. The best parts of it all was: I had three first year campers complete the mile swim. Three kids who were non-swimmers made blue swimmer. One old guy finished completed the mile swim. I got to play pirate. Nobody drowned on my watch.

Right now I'm listening to the Outlaws' "Green Grass and High Tide". It has one of the best "jam sessions" I've heard. This could be a guitar solo, guitar duel, etc.

Others that come to mind are:

Chicago - Feeling Stronger Every Day

Boston - More Then a Feeling

Styx - Come Sail Away

ok who's next?

C.S. Lewis' "Mere Christiananity"

New Testiment: Romans, Hebrews, and Thesilonians.

For fun I want to read a few biographies on Patton, Rommel, and Omar Bradley.

Advancement is not big in my crew. So far we have only had 3 bronze and one gold award in the past 10 months. Four kids are close to completing bronze. I don't ram the advancment down their throats, but I let them know that I am there if they want to advance.

In our council only a handful of youth a earned any of the Venturing awards. We have about 10 Crews that are geared toward the Outdoors Cluster.

Last month one Crew in the council had some kids earn two silver and a ranger award. I had the pleasure of presenting the silver to one of the youth.

When our crew started I went with this:

1. Had two months of events planned out.

2. Appointed and interim Pres and VP.

3. The second event was a lock in campout. Part of the weekend was for the youth to elect their officers and have a rough plan of events for the following year.

Hope this helps.

Cary P

Crew 805 Advisor

In the Present: Am I that stupid?

Flashback to Jun 5th. I'm headed out to Camp Happy to take a CPR class that I need for my upcoming trip to Ely. It's staff week and I see members of my Venture Crew and other guys I haven't seen since last summer. We shoot the breeze about the summer of 2004 when I was Aquatics Director. I walk into the Camp Director's office to check in. Once he sees me, he states he needs to talk to me. "Great" I think to myself, "One of the boneheads from the crew has done something". Once we get out of earshot and eyesight of anybody he starts to beg..."We need you to be Aquatics Director, the current one can only be here for staff week and session one." Now the Camp Head Honcho is a big guy and I've never seen him look so pitiful. It reminded me of when my daughter brought home a mangy old cat and ask if we could keep it. How could I refuse, plus being one of about 3 camp school qualified Aq dirs... I stated that I needed to switch around some vacation days and I'll see what I can do.

I contact work and I'm able to be Aq Dir for session two. Camp Dir shows signs of happiness.

Fast forward to Jun 9th. I'm back out at Camp Happy helping out the Cub Scouts' Fun with Son. Staff members start swarming around me welcoming me aboard for session two.

fast forward to the present. How did I get myself into this mess? Come to think of it, this going to be one fun, wet and wild, messy week back at Camp.

If you're headed to Camp Happy next week, come down by the waterfront. I'll have coffee and a chair for ya!!! Can't wait!!!!

OGE wrote" woke with a start last night, I had gone to sleep ruminating over in my mind what BSA could do. And I have it, work with me here as I think the idea may need some fleshing out. First off, lets ditch the old program, wait we cant do that, too much value, lets keep the Boy Scout program and then venture out into something competely new. Lets have BSA start a new program, Co-ed this time, a program that appeals to older youth (I love writing that, older youth) lets say 14 to 21. We will lay off the uniform requirement and not require one or allow the individual units themselves to come up with their own uniforms. Because so many youth arent as excited as the outdoors as there once once, the outdoors wont be a focal point for the program. Instead we could have a differnt groupings of interest. We would keep the Outdoors, but also have Sports, Arts, Hobbies and maybe even a religious interest grouping. Members of the program could work in any of these areas.

ANybody think such a program would fly? "

Hey OGE I think you have something there

I see the main problem as program and recruiting. You must have both for a unit to survive.

I did "numbers" work with my crew and here is what I got.

Total youth: 35

Total females: 7

Total males: 28

So far this year we've recruited 9 new members. A majority of these kids came to me asking to join. Most crew members live within 15 miles of our CO's establishment. We have kids that live as far as 40 miles away. We have one buisness meeting and one activity a month. Some events will have 15 kids while others (like this coming weekend) will get 20 plus.

If your unit puts on a great program then they will come and stay.

Cary P

Crew 805 Advisor

According to the Uniform Police Manual page 567, section IVII, para 2.2.5(b): The Offical BSA Uniform MUST be refered to as either the "Field" or "Actvitiy" Uniform. If an UP Officer witnesses such an offense then he/she is required to issue a Warning Citation (UP Form 345/4) if said offender then the UP Officer must...

If you are on a budget and looking for jungle boots, head to a local army surplus store. They may carry used jungle boots, I've seen them priced at 20 bucks. Just make sure they fit well and the soles are in decent shape. I'm headed to BW this summer and that is my plan.

Way to go Ed!

I haven't agreed with some of your posts, but you do stick to your beliefs, and give great sage advise. Glad you are here!

Cary P(This message has been edited by purcelce)

Got this off an "unoffical" BSA uniform site

http://www.mninter.net/~blkeagle/police.htm

Cary P

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Combating the "Patch Police" - or Preventing Being Perceived as an "Patch Police Officer"

Ever attended a Scouting event or activity whereby you observe someone going up to some Scout or Scouter (or YOU!) and start in...

"You can't wear that there...it's not official.."

"What is this. I've never seen this...you sure this is a Scout patch?"

"This is the old version...you are supposed to only wear the current version..."

Many of these people have the best of intentions, but for some reason or another, they either have self-appointed themselves or use the wrong tact in informing you that the things you are wearing are in the wrong location, or that they should not be worn.

Many Scouters and Scouts call these people the "patch police".

Are what they are doing "legal" or "official"?? Maybe.

First, remember that Commissioners -- ALL Commissioners, not just the unit level or District/Council level Commissioners -- have a responsibility to insure the correct wearing of the official uniform and insignia. That's part of their jobs, and most Commissioners view it as a teaching, coaching and training part of their jobs. This does NOT mean, however, that they can go about this in a mean-spirited manner, talking down to the Scout or Scouter whom really was either told incorrectly or did not receive ANY guidance at all as to where to place the various badges and insignia of Scouting.

The BSA's Insignia Guide is the overall "guidance" on what goes where. This site supplements the official guide by providing information on how those badges and insignia are to be worn, what they look like IN COLOR, and some background on some variations of the insignia or uniforming item.

Second, remember that for the most part, there is a place and location for EVERY piece of insignia that is produced by the Boy Scouts of America, it's local Councils and Districts, and units. NOT EVERYTHING GOES ON THE UNIFORM SHIRT AND NOT EVERYTHING IS WORN AT ALL TIMES. For instance, merit badge sashes are worn only during formal occasions; medals and ribboned awards are worn only during formal occasions; and aquatic badges and insignia are worn only on swimwear.

Third, some of these people may have NEVER seen what you're wearing, so it is immediately "assumed" that since they've never seen it, then it's not official. That's human nature working at its worst.

I see someone wearing a badge or item incorrectly. What do I do?

First, insure that they are indeed wearing the badge or item incorrectly. If you're a Commissioner, you should be carrying in your binder or notebook a current copy of the BSA's Insignia Guide. If you're just "joe or jane Scouter", you may not have a copy but try to have one handy for such occasions.

Not ALL insignia and uniforming items are in the Insignia Guide. That in part is why I built this site. If in doubt as to the official nature of an item, let it go and ask other Scouters if they've seen it or heard about it. Check this site out often, as I'll add new or changed insignia in the "News" section of the site.

Second, remember that the Scouter you're going to approach is going to be a bit embarrassed at the fact that they are wearing something wrong. So remember "praise in public, criticize in private." Take them off to the side and let them know of the error. DO NOT DEMAND THAT THEY "FIX IT NOW". They won't be able to. Suggest, as in "Are you aware that this badge is for the Scouts only?" They may not be aware that some badges and insignia are ONLY to be worn by our youth members. "You know, some folks here are going to try to correct you about wearing this..." goes a longer way than "Hey. You can't wear that on your shirt!"

Third, remember that you are talking to a fellow Scouter or to a Scout. You're not talking to a soldier in the military. If a badge or item is a few inches off, at least they are wearing it.

Fourth, offer to sew or place the item on the uniform in the right place. A lot of times in which I attend various Scouting activities, I see the year pins on youth and adult uniforms worn on the left pocket flap instead of above the pocket where it belongs. I ALWAYS ASK FIRST IF THEY DO NOT MIND ME FIXING THEIR UNIFORM SHIRT. This gives them the opportunity to say "Why" in which it gives you (or me) the chance to explain where the badge or item belongs.

Finally, make sure that you let them know where they can get more information about where the item is to be worn. They simply MAY NOT KNOW that the item is only to be worn on a vest or that they can not wear a temporary patch where the Jamboree emblem is to be worn...they saw someone wearing what looked like a temporary patch there, and they don't know that "every badge has its place" on the shirt, jacket or vest".

How can I prevent being attacked by the Patch Police?"

First, insure that the things you are wearing on your uniform conforms to what the Insignia Guide (and perhaps this online guide) says. Take your uniform shirt and take a look at the full color scans to insure that the "knot emblems" are "right side up"; that the year pins have the right color backing; and that you are wearing the insignia according to the illustrations.

Second, if your Council has special insignia or items which can be worn on the uniform shirt, make sure that you know where they are to be worn. Councils have the authority to supplement the official insignia with insignia and badges of their own. Check with a Commissioner or your Council's Scout Executive or representative.

When someone confronts you with one of those "Are you SURE you're supposed to wear this" question or the "You're not supposed to", simply and politely ASK THEM WHERE IS THIS IN WRITING. Most Scouters with good intentions will find you a copy of the Insignia Guide or some other printed publication (or will point you to a page here or elsewhere online) which explains where the item is to worn.

DO NOT TAKE IT PERSONALLY. The person is merely either trying to honestly make all Scouters and Scouts look good, or he or she is exerting their personal "power" and you just happen to be the hapless victim. Instead, acknowledge the person and thank him or her for their concern and explain that you will "check it out" before changing your uniform. And do so when you get back.

Finally, if someone tells you "TAKE THAT OFF NOW!", simply explain in a polite tone that "I will remove it when I return home if I can be shown in a written, printed publication that what I have on is illegal or not official. If you can show me right now something in writing which says that what I am wearing is not official for wear where I am wearing it, then I will be happy to borrow a pocketknife and go to a room someplace and remove the item. But in all due respect to you, I will not remove something merely on the words of someone else."

There is NO SUCH THING AS A "SPECIAL" distribution or "private" listing which only goes to professionals or to key volunteers dealing with uniforming and insignia issues or items; those telling you that there is such a publication are lying. Whenever the BSA's National Uniform and Insignia Committee releases information about any change or addition to the official uniforms or the insignia which goes onto them, it is IMMEDIATELY RELEASED TO THE ENTIRE MEMBERSHIP and there are NO PRIVATE PUBLICATIONS. Such changes are released through national publications, through local Council publications and during staff meetings of both volunteers and professionals.

(and because I or other volunteers get copies of those releases, we add them here to this site as well as to share them with several online forums. Copies of what is being released as changes or new items are also placed on the US Scouting Service Project's website).

Some folks will tell you "It just came out as a change", or "I have read it before I got here", both which could be correct. Your response should be "Can you please get me a copy of it? The BSA says that they send their changes to everyone, so you should be able to get me a copy, right?"

Don't let people - with good intentions or not - bully you around just because they are wearing "more stuff" than you, or because they are perceived as "higherups". We are ALL in the same game together. There's no reason why ALL of the rules dealing with uniforming are not available to everyone. That too, is why this site exists. Simply ask them to provide you the information in a printed matter so you can have it as reference.

You know...They could be wrong.

I hope that this information has helped you to understand the role of the "Patch Police" and helped you to deal effectively when they "pull you over" and attempt to correct or inform you why they "pulled you over"!!

Settummanque!

(This message has been edited by purcelce)

Do crew officer briefing first (this tells the kids what their job is)

then do VLSC (this tells them how to do the job)

Saint,

I served 20 years in the military and BSA is not a military organization.

All adults may have that right to discuss dress code violatins in a school setting, but not in the BSA. If there is a major GTSS violation then yes the adult needs to jump in and correct the situation, but for an adult to say "Hey Boy Scout, take that off that illegal patch" (no offense MV)" is not cool if it's done politely or not. That's the Scoutmaster's or other unit leader's job of the troop in "violation". Now talking to the SM in private about the situation is cool.

I have not see anything in writing in any of my BSA literature that says we as adults should be "correcting" uniform violations.