kb6jra

I hate double posts! I wish there was a way to fix this.(This message has been edited by kb6jra)

Everything not covered by BSA publications can be handled by applying the 12 points of the Scout Law...

This works with trained leaders and with the boys usually, but unfortunately I've found that most Committee members and parents that are not necessarily trained as Scout Leaders need a written commandment to follow.

Our troop for example has a 96 page Policy and Procedures manual. Most of the information is a reprint of the Scoutmaster's Handbook, the Scout Handbook, the Patrol Leaders Handbook, the Senior Patrol Leaders Handbook, and some items from the Field Book to name a few. It also covers some college level information on health and nutrition and backpacking basics not covered in the Scout books. So why do we have this huge work? Most parents will never take the time to read any of the above resources, but for some reason they are willing to delve into a single document that has "all the answers" in plain text. If there's ever a question like "why do you do things that way" or "why isn't my son the Patrol Leader" or "why can't I sit in on my son's Board of Review" we just ask them to check out that section of the PPM to see how it's done.

SctDad,

National Camp School is a Regional training, you can apply to it but your application needs to be OKed by your SE. I may be incorrect, but I believe you must have a secured position, or a bonifide reason, to attend the NCS session in order for your application to be approved.

Generally NCS is held in the Spring months leading up to Summer Camp season. Applications are available on your Regional website. As an example, here's the url for the Western Region NCS site. http://www.wrbsa.org/program/ncs/

I had a friend who wanted to be certified for BB guns for use at Cub Day camp. he got his wish when he was asked to attend NCS for range officer. Now he gets asked to run multiple day camps in several districts in our council. I guess he got what he asked for...ha!

Well, speaking from a recent spate of NCSs in our Region...

Scout Executives were asked to assemble staffs for the trainings. The trainings were to be held at local summer camps with adequate facilities for the curriculum given (ie. waterfront for the aquatics training, rifle range for the shooting sports training, etc) The summer camp we were to use was not one of our council's camps. I'm not sure if this is by design or not. The staff I was asked to be on through our SE was made up of council trainers, executive board members with specific expertise, and the like.

Talk to your Council's training chairman. Let them know you're interested. Make yourself available for other trainings. I've looked through the two huge tomes I was given for program and there's nothing in there about staffing the course. I'm sure that's in an even bigger binder.

Good luck.

"It is important to set reasonable expectations on the cost up front. But I also provide them a frame of reference when doing so. Even when considering the cost of a new uniform, a year in Cub Scouts (excluding overnighters) is less than either one and a half months of Taekwondo or a season of AYSO or Little League (which run for less than a quarter of the year.) "

I use this argument all the time, because it's a great way for people to see how ridiculous they are at spending money. As parents (generally) we're more than happy to go down to the sporting goods store and buy that $75 mitt, $250 bat, or $85 cleat for little Johnny to be the biggest, baddest, best ball player in town, but when it comes time to cough up $$ for Scouting, 'wait just a minute, it costs money?'

I'd say you should provide clear cut rules of your fund raiser to your parents and the kids, as well as goals and expectations so they know what to expect. Like infoscouter said, if your parents understand why it's needed, where it's going, they are more likely to get behind it and support the fundraiser.

By the way, don't call it a raffle, it's an opportunity drawing.

I've never been a contingent leader...yet. I'll be the Scoutmaster of one of my council's troops this time around.

As for applying for staff, it must be sent though the local council with the ok of the SE before it's forwarded to the region. I had specific knowledge of a venue that needed help and applied to that one venue.

Scary Stuff Lisa,

I would tend to "admonish" the boys caught in the act aside from the rest of the troop, and like Beavah said, have them present to the troop about the dangers of thier actions.

The CoH isn't the best place for this IMO, maybe a special Troop Meeting should be called, this will not only give a perfect opportunity, but give it the importance the subject deserves.

Good luck, I know I would have chewed on a few young souls if I'd been the SM who's house they just left.

I've recently heard a most hillarious story from a couple of old time Scouters on a WB course. They went to a gun shop and wanted to buy some black powder, for a fire lighting ceremony. Black powder if not confined will create a lot of smoke and enough flame to start a fire. You can use a model rocket squib to ignite it.

When the clerk asked about the use of the black powder, the older man looked at him sort of crazy like and said, "we're gonna blow some stuff up". Needless to say they left without the powder and had a heck of a time finding another gun shop in this part of the world.

I typically invite the boy over to my house for desert and a talk. It's informal, no uniforms, no salutes, no practicing the Oath and Law. There's time to do all of that later. We talk about his future aspirations, college plans, job opportunities, career paths... The conversation winds around the Scouting program and his take on it, it's relevance to him and his friends, and what he sees happening to the program in the future. We talk about his favorite times, outings, summer camps... We talk about his future in Scouting and the Troop and how he's intending to give scouting to others.

When we're done, I ask for his book and sign it. The boy ususally looks up and says "That's it, that was my confrence?" I'm the type of person that doesn't like canned questions, because you mostly get canned answers. I'd rather know what the kid feels and knows and share the memories that have enriched his life (and mine for that matter). IMO it's more genuine than a script.

There are some unwritten benefits to holding a Board of Review in person as opposed to online, or over the phone.

This is a time where the boy's ability to interact with adults is practiced and the boys efforts are given credence. This process is a confidence booster for some kids, as it allows them to participate in a discussion about something they are familiar with, their own advancement, and succeed.

There is no specific prohibition to teleconferencing a BoR, but IMHO it would be a last resort measure to be sure. A face to face meeting with a boy who is attempting to earn a rank is worth a long drive on occasion, and making it a face to face would lend the proper air of importance about the process and the end result, rank advancement.

The most successful presentations I've done for the Family campaign have the unit leaders fully supporting it, giving the first donation, presenting at the highest attended event, such as a CoH or a B&G, and holding my presentation to a maximum of 15 minutes. In our council, we give a campership to summer camp if a troop has 100% participation, or a campership to Cub Day Camp for a cub pack.

I've had some success at committee meetings as well, but only in matching my $ goals for the unit, not % participation.

Our CoH's (we had one last week) are MC'd by the SPL, that's part of his job description. We have a time for announcement, which is my job as SM. I also take that time to tell the boys just how proud I am of thier accomplishments for the period between the CoH's. It's awesome to see thier faces light up when they get praised in front of the parents.

We do have FOS presentations to our unit at CoH's, but it's 5 minutes, it is done by me, and we move on. I get about 80% participation in the end. Not bad.

Discipline really has no place at the CoH. It needs to be handled elsewhere and to keep the focus off of the negative.

Joe Price was a great guy, he was a MB councelor in my council as a kid. He also developed and Scoutmastered our JLT course, Buckskin Confrence for the first 15 years. Everyone loved the Great Kahuna.

I believe his son is currently a member of our council, we were talking about the Price family last night at a council meeting. I'll inquire about it if you like and try and get a response from the family.

My old council received $10K from a government grant for thier LFL division. The council was almost immediately sued by the ACLU claiming that the funds were not used for the LFL division as had been stated. The suit was ultimately dropped by the ACLU for lack of proof, but the damage had been done. The suit cost the council a minimum of $40K to defend itself against the attack.

Kind of brings to mind the old joke President Regan delivered, "The ten most feared words in the English language "I'm from the Federal Government, and I'm here to help.""

This is the first year in 5 years I've not been the FOS Chair for my district. I feel like I've gotten a free pass from the Cousinostro...ha!

Last year our goal was tripled, and we met it somehow. It was amazing to see it work out. This year, we've increased our overall goal by 10% and are meeting it, just. This is a very difficult economic environment to solicit donations from and I don't see it getting better for a couple of years honestly.

Good luck to all in their campaigns.

Svendzoid,

This reminds me of a topic I discussed with my DE some years ago. An adult leader in a unit near my own told her in no uncertain terms that he wanted to be on the executive board. It was surmised that this need was dictated by his resume and how it would be affected by a board membership. There was no other reasonable explanation why this man would want to be a board member, as he had never served in a leadership position for the District or on any committee.

She politely told him that the only way he'd be asked to join the board was to prove himself at the District level first. It may seem that the Executive Board is full of seat fillers, people who purchase the seat licenses so to speak, but there is some hard work being done at this level, outside the monthly ra ra meeting that is. An executive board would be hard pressed to accomplish the business that is Scouting with seat fillers.

From my own experience, I had no compunction to be a member of my council's executive board, but was asked after I was successful in my District job and noticed by the incoming board president. While at 20 years old you have a definite skew on program, I'd venture to say that you will have that same view in a couple of years or so.

Work at the District Level. Attend Roundtable, serve as a commissioner, help with Camporee, Day camp, other high profile events where it's hard to find adult volunteers. Your contributions will be noticed, and accepted. You'll find yourself being asked to do more difficult jobs, where organization and people skills are terribly important. Most people don't start out at the top of any game, art, hobby or career. They have to work their way up, which in my mind is the most honorable way to get to the top of anything.

Good luck, work hard, and keep with it. Don't let minor setbacks interfere with your love of Scouting.

The only time I've ever seen an induction to the OotF was at Summer Camp, Camp Chiwanakee, CA. 1973-1975.

The motto, oath and the song are relatively the same. I still remember the "initiation" of the members, now considered hazing. Each new member had a choice. They could suck down a raw egg or munch down a half cup of dehydrated onions.

About half lost thier initiates meal immediately. Nice presentation during meal times I must say.

Just jump up and down a lot and say "ooo ooo ooo, can I go, can I go".

LOL

They probably figure that it's not that big of a sales issue since it's going to be the capstone event for the 100th Anniversary events. I'm sorta biased about Jamboree since I've attended one as a youth and then again on staff last time.

I can't imagine any council not being able to fill thier contingents, but with this downturned economy who really knows. I've already got my payment plan worked out. My Council's going to charge close to $2500 for the trip.

The suggestion that adult staffers have attended 21C WB, is because the two courses are nearly identical, and the 21CWB trained adults will have a better grasp of the material since they've taken the same course presentations.

The SM does not get a 3rd bead, he gets a 4th bead if all the conditions are met.

Lisabob, your council should be taking "interest" apps now, or at a minimum just compiling a list of interested souls. Our Council is fielding 4 troops and I believe that we have enough on our interest lists to fill 3 of them.

contact your Council Jamboree Committee person and get on the list. If you don't know who that is, it's usually under the VP Program's domain.

If you do send boys to the Jamboree, it will be an experience they will never forget, that I can guarantee.

Our District is responsible for ultimately approving Eagle projects. Our Advancment Chair has the responsibility and may appoint an appropriate person for the job or do it him/her self.

They, like others here, require enough information in the ELSP Workbook that if the Scout were abducted by aliens, another scout or adult for that matter, would be able to follow the plan. The Candidate must include drawings or plans if appropriate, before pictures, list of materials needed, tools needed, personell needed, along with a detailed list of how each would be used.

The level of detail they're looking for reminds me of what we teach in Wood Badge. Project planning really requires a great amount of detail. I believe we teach the same skills at NYLT, altough I could be wrong here, I'm not an NYLT expert by any means.

Well they have already figured out the application and payment thing. They're using the same method and software they used for the National Meeting, and that worked out alright, at least when I used it.

I'm excited about Jambo, I've applied to be a contingent leader. I have my interview in early June.

AWESOME!

I'm our council's 100th Anniversary Chairman. They're only minting 350,000 and each will have a $10 surcharge that will go to the Boy Scouts of America Foundation.

I plan on buying a handfull.

Wow, I heard about this at our Area Training Conference last Fall. I can hear huge arguments on both sides of this. One thing they didn't allude to was the 4th bead for NYLT Course Directors. Thems might be fitin words...

I certainly understand that the commitment and level of staff development and training are similar, so much so that they mirror each other in most council situations, however wouldn't it be better in some respects to have a completely separate recognition system for staffing NYLT?

Thinking of it from a recognition collectors standpoint, you know who I'm talking about, the scouter who volunteers for things just to say he's been there, done that. This scouter really isn't in it for the youth, he's just interested in a new dangle from his neck, a new neckerchief, etc. Those people will be left without a special bobble from the NYLT course because the adult recognition for service is for Wood Badge...hmmm...

What's the totem or symbol for NYLT anyway?

Found this site through another listerv group.

It has the site map (not much change from 2005) and the Guide. Good info, not much new except for the safety stuff and the additional requirements for Adult Leaders (1st ASM, SM).

http://www.jamboleader.org