Horizon

I don't know about percentages but I've recently realized that the things that prevent boys from making decisions are lack of maturity, lack of trust between scouts and adults, and fuzzy boundaries between the adult and scout responsibilities. Immature boys just don't make decisions and a lack of trust kills confidence. Fuzzy responsibilities encourages boys to defer to adults and for adults to step in. Making a short, clear list of responsibilities (as well as consequences for not meeting their responsibilities) makes it easier to pull back the adults and for the boys to know it's their problem. I've recently had a lot of luck with this idea. Everyone is happier. Well, the scouts and I are happier, some of the parents are not at all happy with the chaos or some of the ideas these guys come up with.

 

And by short I mean short. I don't care what they eat as long as it has some protein and a fruit or vegetable. I don't care where they are until flags Saturday morning as long as they're quiet from 10pm to when everyone wakes and that they look out for each other's well being, I don't care when they wake up or if the eat breakfast.

 

 

 

Don't know what you mean by directives.

 

The boys want to play laser-tag/paintball, I said I would love to - but BSA won't allow it. (I DID, however, point them towards Kudu's list of wide area games...)

The boys want to go shooting, I remind them that we need a range master. We have one good range master in the troop, they need to call him and see when he is available.

The boys say that they want to beach camp, the troop adults take care of the reservations for next year (nly a couple places you can beach camp where we are, and they fill fast).

The boys voted on where to go for summer camp, the troop adults dealt with the reservations.

The boys want to go backpacking, the troop adults deal with the wilderness permits.

 

So the boys drive the activities, the adults facilitate them. I don't expect boys to do tour permits, medical forms, or any of the other administrivia required in our organization.

 

Meetings are opened by the boys, with times at the beginning and end for adult announcements (usually around forms and payments). Meetings are run by the boys, with the SM walking around the different stations. That gives us a fair amount of chaos, I admit.

 

Sometimes do we step in too much - yup. Usually when there is a breakdown in youth leadership for a variety of reasons, and I want to keep the boat from sinking / someone getting hurt /etc. I always question myself when stepping in, sometimes an adult is too fast, sometime we are too slow.

Like I said - I want the boys to run the campout. That is where the leadership role is. Managing a spreadsheet and binder of medical forms - they can learn that later when they go to Woodbadge or some other BSA MBA program.

Don't know what you mean by directives.

 

The boys want to play laser-tag/paintball, I said I would love to - but BSA won't allow it. (I DID, however, point them towards Kudu's list of wide area games...)

The boys want to go shooting, I remind them that we need a range master. We have one good range master in the troop, they need to call him and see when he is available.

The boys say that they want to beach camp, the troop adults take care of the reservations for next year (nly a couple places you can beach camp where we are, and they fill fast).

The boys voted on where to go for summer camp, the troop adults dealt with the reservations.

The boys want to go backpacking, the troop adults deal with the wilderness permits.

 

So the boys drive the activities, the adults facilitate them. I don't expect boys to do tour permits, medical forms, or any of the other administrivia required in our organization.

 

Meetings are opened by the boys, with times at the beginning and end for adult announcements (usually around forms and payments). Meetings are run by the boys, with the SM walking around the different stations. That gives us a fair amount of chaos, I admit.

 

Sometimes do we step in too much - yup. Usually when there is a breakdown in youth leadership for a variety of reasons, and I want to keep the boat from sinking / someone getting hurt /etc. I always question myself when stepping in, sometimes an adult is too fast, sometime we are too slow.

I don't know about percentages but I've recently realized that the things that prevent boys from making decisions are lack of maturity, lack of trust between scouts and adults, and fuzzy boundaries between the adult and scout responsibilities. Immature boys just don't make decisions and a lack of trust kills confidence. Fuzzy responsibilities encourages boys to defer to adults and for adults to step in. Making a short, clear list of responsibilities (as well as consequences for not meeting their responsibilities) makes it easier to pull back the adults and for the boys to know it's their problem. I've recently had a lot of luck with this idea. Everyone is happier. Well, the scouts and I are happier, some of the parents are not at all happy with the chaos or some of the ideas these guys come up with.

 

And by short I mean short. I don't care what they eat as long as it has some protein and a fruit or vegetable. I don't care where they are until flags Saturday morning as long as they're quiet from 10pm to when everyone wakes and that they look out for each other's well being, I don't care when they wake up or if the eat breakfast.

 

 

 

SPL looked him in the eye and said "We didn't come here to pretty up our campsite - my guys don't hang out at camp at all. As long as there isn't a safety problem, I am fine with not getting any awards."

Camp Boss looked at me for support, received none.

Don't know what you mean by directives.

 

The boys want to play laser-tag/paintball, I said I would love to - but BSA won't allow it. (I DID, however, point them towards Kudu's list of wide area games...)

The boys want to go shooting, I remind them that we need a range master. We have one good range master in the troop, they need to call him and see when he is available.

The boys say that they want to beach camp, the troop adults take care of the reservations for next year (nly a couple places you can beach camp where we are, and they fill fast).

The boys voted on where to go for summer camp, the troop adults dealt with the reservations.

The boys want to go backpacking, the troop adults deal with the wilderness permits.

 

So the boys drive the activities, the adults facilitate them. I don't expect boys to do tour permits, medical forms, or any of the other administrivia required in our organization.

 

Meetings are opened by the boys, with times at the beginning and end for adult announcements (usually around forms and payments). Meetings are run by the boys, with the SM walking around the different stations. That gives us a fair amount of chaos, I admit.

 

Sometimes do we step in too much - yup. Usually when there is a breakdown in youth leadership for a variety of reasons, and I want to keep the boat from sinking / someone getting hurt /etc. I always question myself when stepping in, sometimes an adult is too fast, sometime we are too slow.

We rotate.

Lost Valley near Indio, CA is our Council Camp. Nice place.

Emerald Bay run by the LA Council is on Catalina Island. Awesome place for summer camp, and a great program for Venture (their Rugged program is great, and the best deal for getting a SCUBA license).

Camp Whitsett offers whitewater rafting, another out of Council location.

Camp Chawanakee is up in the Sierras, on a lake, offers sailing, canoeing, rowing and a mile swim all in a freezing cold lake in the mountains.

By rotating, our boys don't get bored from going to the same place every year (nor do our adults who burn a week of vacation to attend).

We started the rotation when our in-Council reservation was cancelled because our week was going to be LDS week, and we were no longer welcome. That was long ago, but the Council handled it very poorly at the time and it left a bad taste in the unit's mouth.

Don't know what you mean by directives.

The boys want to play laser-tag/paintball, I said I would love to - but BSA won't allow it. (I DID, however, point them towards Kudu's list of wide area games...)

The boys want to go shooting, I remind them that we need a range master. We have one good range master in the troop, they need to call him and see when he is available.

The boys say that they want to beach camp, the troop adults take care of the reservations for next year (nly a couple places you can beach camp where we are, and they fill fast).

The boys voted on where to go for summer camp, the troop adults dealt with the reservations.

The boys want to go backpacking, the troop adults deal with the wilderness permits.

So the boys drive the activities, the adults facilitate them. I don't expect boys to do tour permits, medical forms, or any of the other administrivia required in our organization.

Meetings are opened by the boys, with times at the beginning and end for adult announcements (usually around forms and payments). Meetings are run by the boys, with the SM walking around the different stations. That gives us a fair amount of chaos, I admit.

Sometimes do we step in too much - yup. Usually when there is a breakdown in youth leadership for a variety of reasons, and I want to keep the boat from sinking / someone getting hurt /etc. I always question myself when stepping in, sometimes an adult is too fast, sometime we are too slow.

Well, one of my units is scrambling now to find a replacement site to camp at this weekend. All state places are full, leaving two BSA sites possibly since the National Parks are all closed

To try to make this a bit more Scouting again (a few of you seem to forgetting the Oath and Law in your interactions)...

 

If we want to balance the books, then you have to either increase revenue or cut spending. If you want to play with spending, CATO has put some information on a site:

 

http://www.downsizinggovernment.org

 

This could be a good exercise for Scouts in Cit Nation - what would you cut? Make them approach each cut from an Oath and Law perspective along with the Constitution.

 

A flip side is to ask them what things could the government do? For this debate, do they agree that there is a problem with people who have no access to affordable healthcare? How would they solve that? What is the obligation of the nation? Help educate the discussion. Show them the historical levels of deficit and debt (and PLEASE make sure that they know the difference).

 

http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/debt_deficit_history

 

Then you can talk about historical taxation levels, and you can teach them about the EFFECTIVE tax rate (which is vastly different from initial rate). Lots of information there:

 

http://strata.oreilly.com/2013/01/us-tax-rates-visualization.html

 

If you want to get deeper, you can overlay these numbers with party control of the House, Senate and Presidency and try to find a pattern, anywhere.

 

The system is far more jacked up (as my Scouts put it) than just the ACA - yet the Republicans refuse to admit that.

Again - how many are willing to let die or go bankrupt due to a lack of healthcare? Or, alternatively, what is your proposal to fix the problem of $400 aspirin in the hospital? The birth of my son was either $30k or $5k, depending on whether I was uninsured (the $30k) or insured (the $5k).

The silence from the right wing is deafening on this subject.

To try to make this a bit more Scouting again (a few of you seem to forgetting the Oath and Law in your interactions)...

 

If we want to balance the books, then you have to either increase revenue or cut spending. If you want to play with spending, CATO has put some information on a site:

 

http://www.downsizinggovernment.org

 

This could be a good exercise for Scouts in Cit Nation - what would you cut? Make them approach each cut from an Oath and Law perspective along with the Constitution.

 

A flip side is to ask them what things could the government do? For this debate, do they agree that there is a problem with people who have no access to affordable healthcare? How would they solve that? What is the obligation of the nation? Help educate the discussion. Show them the historical levels of deficit and debt (and PLEASE make sure that they know the difference).

 

http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/debt_deficit_history

 

Then you can talk about historical taxation levels, and you can teach them about the EFFECTIVE tax rate (which is vastly different from initial rate). Lots of information there:

 

http://strata.oreilly.com/2013/01/us-tax-rates-visualization.html

 

If you want to get deeper, you can overlay these numbers with party control of the House, Senate and Presidency and try to find a pattern, anywhere.

 

To try to make this a bit more Scouting again (a few of you seem to forgetting the Oath and Law in your interactions)...

 

If we want to balance the books, then you have to either increase revenue or cut spending. If you want to play with spending, CATO has put some information on a site:

 

http://www.downsizinggovernment.org

 

This could be a good exercise for Scouts in Cit Nation - what would you cut? Make them approach each cut from an Oath and Law perspective along with the Constitution.

 

A flip side is to ask them what things could the government do? For this debate, do they agree that there is a problem with people who have no access to affordable healthcare? How would they solve that? What is the obligation of the nation? Help educate the discussion. Show them the historical levels of deficit and debt (and PLEASE make sure that they know the difference).

 

http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/debt_deficit_history

 

Then you can talk about historical taxation levels, and you can teach them about the EFFECTIVE tax rate (which is vastly different from initial rate). Lots of information there:

 

http://strata.oreilly.com/2013/01/us-tax-rates-visualization.html

 

If you want to get deeper, you can overlay these numbers with party control of the House, Senate and Presidency and try to find a pattern, anywhere.

 

The Fair Tax will trigger black market and bartering when you hit that level of taxation. It will also reduce consumption, reducing income and profits. The economic shock will not be small.

The Flat Tax from Hall and Rabushka is another model for tax reform, but it too will have an impact on behavior, but less than the so-called Fair Tax. http://www.hoover.org/publications/books/8329

So you want to end Social Security? How many dead are you willing to accept? Will you pay to relocate the elderly into their families' homes, or just leave them on the street? After all, without the monthly check, grandma won't eat and won't keep the heat on. We kill a few every winter on the East coast when heating oil prices spike. Ending a program like that will not be easy. Let us hear your plan for ending entitlements that will not result in bringing back the problems they were designed to solve.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

To try to make this a bit more Scouting again (a few of you seem to forgetting the Oath and Law in your interactions)...

If we want to balance the books, then you have to either increase revenue or cut spending. If you want to play with spending, CATO has put some information on a site:

http://www.downsizinggovernment.org

This could be a good exercise for Scouts in Cit Nation - what would you cut? Make them approach each cut from an Oath and Law perspective along with the Constitution.

A flip side is to ask them what things could the government do? For this debate, do they agree that there is a problem with people who have no access to affordable healthcare? How would they solve that? What is the obligation of the nation? Help educate the discussion. Show them the historical levels of deficit and debt (and PLEASE make sure that they know the difference).

http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/debt_deficit_history

Then you can talk about historical taxation levels, and you can teach them about the EFFECTIVE tax rate (which is vastly different from initial rate). Lots of information there:

http://strata.oreilly.com/2013/01/us-tax-rates-visualization.html

If you want to get deeper, you can overlay these numbers with party control of the House, Senate and Presidency and try to find a pattern, anywhere.

I picked up this book at summer camp one year:

http://www.amazon.com/The-Gospel-Red-Man-Indian/dp/1585092762

The opening by Seton is fantastic, and talks about how the religion of the Native American fits with the Christian, the Jew and the Muslim. I have read that portion for a Scout's Own service.

As for the scattering of our faiths, I have met and enjoyed the sermons of Erin Dunigan:

http://not-church.org/tag/erin-dunigan/

For POR - missing campouts means you might be replaced. Triggers an SMC and discussion of sign offs..

I believe the Pope wears one as well' date=' and I have seen photos of Cardinals in the Catholic church wearing them, though I suspect they don't call them yarmulkes.[/quote']

 

Right, it is called the "zuchetto". I believe it originated as a way for clergy to cover their tonsure (the part of the head that is shaven) and has remained even though the tonsure has been more or less done away with.

 

Now you can all go back to your regularly scheduled discussion of Trail Life. About which I will say, basically I agree with you. The only situation in which I could see a Jewish or Muslim or Buddhist boy wanting to join Trail Life is if he were friends with a bunch of other boys who were joining, and even then I would expect most parents to try to steer their son toward an organization that was equally welcoming to all religions. (I know that's what I would do if I still had a son of Scout age.)

 

With what I've seen from Trail Life USA, I can say that as a Catholic I would not want my sons to join. It seems like it is basically a Protestant organization.

Presbyterians under PCUSA are NOT having the national body push gay rights. We voted on it. The United States Constitution is, in many ways, modeled after the Presbyterians (the Minister who signed the Declaration? Witherspoon? Presbyterian). To get something passed, it must come from the States first (Presbyteries), then be voted on at the Congress (Assembly), then be RE-affirmed at the NEXT meeting of the Assembly. Yes, some congregations are leaving after losing two votes in a row. But that does NOT mean that this is pushed from above - this has been a long-fought battle for years. My wife was on Session back in the 80s when this was being debated. It just took until recently until it made it through the General Assembly. Here is the thing, individual churches STILL choose their minister (we don't appoint them, each congregation chooses theirs). So a conservative congregation is under zero requirement to accept a gay minister. Local control lives in the PCUSA.

I will never a bear scout telling me that you had to buy your way into heaven....That is what his minister said.

 

Also same bear scout was telling our muslim scout he was going to hell because he didn't believe in God.

1- How or when is the US gonna stop borrowing money to spend on non-essential services? Maybe this shutdown will highlight just how much we can live without. Eventually our money is gonna be worthless, so the sooner we face that we're spending too much; the better chance we have that our republic will survive. Our grandchildren already have a big enough bill to pay.

 

2- The Dems had two years, 08-10, when they controlled the government. The electorate became so alarmed at their free spending ways that they elected Repubs to the house in 10 and again in 12. The house is the division that spends money. So, yes, elections have consequences. For the Dems to now refuse to negotiate with the body that is constitutionally in charge of the purse strings is a facetious tantrum, devoid of logic, enabled by a biased media.

FYI on the jokes about essential vs non-essential, my company operates that way. I have had to lay off people who weren't essential - I could keep the doors open for less, I just could not grow. Once the economy recovered, we added those people back who were necessary for long-term growth.

As for the government, the Office of Management and Budget defines essential vs. non-essential this way:

1.) Provide for the national security, including the conduct of foreign relations essential to the national security or the safety of life and property.

2.) Provide for benefit payments and the performance of contract obligations under no-year or multi-year or other funds remaining available for those purposes.

3.) Conduct essential activities to the extent that they protect life and property, including:

Medical care of inpatients and emergency outpatient care.

Activities essential to ensure continued public health and safety, including safe use of food and drugs and safe use of hazardous materials.

The continuance of air traffic control and other transportation safety functions and the protection of transport property.

Border and coastal protection and surveillance.

Protection of Federal lands, buildings, waterways, equipment and other property owned by the United States.

Care of prisoners and other persons in the custody of the United States.

Law enforcement and criminal investigations.

Emergency and disaster assistance.

Activities essential to the preservation of the essential elements of the money and banking system of the United States, including borrowing and tax collection activities of the Treasury.

Activities that ensure production of power and maintenance of the power distribution system.

Activities necessary to maintain protection of research property.

1- How or when is the US gonna stop borrowing money to spend on non-essential services? Maybe this shutdown will highlight just how much we can live without. Eventually our money is gonna be worthless, so the sooner we face that we're spending too much; the better chance we have that our republic will survive. Our grandchildren already have a big enough bill to pay.

 

2- The Dems had two years, 08-10, when they controlled the government. The electorate became so alarmed at their free spending ways that they elected Repubs to the house in 10 and again in 12. The house is the division that spends money. So, yes, elections have consequences. For the Dems to now refuse to negotiate with the body that is constitutionally in charge of the purse strings is a facetious tantrum, devoid of logic, enabled by a biased media.

1- How or when is the US gonna stop borrowing money to spend on non-essential services? Maybe this shutdown will highlight just how much we can live without. Eventually our money is gonna be worthless, so the sooner we face that we're spending too much; the better chance we have that our republic will survive. Our grandchildren already have a big enough bill to pay.

 

2- The Dems had two years, 08-10, when they controlled the government. The electorate became so alarmed at their free spending ways that they elected Repubs to the house in 10 and again in 12. The house is the division that spends money. So, yes, elections have consequences. For the Dems to now refuse to negotiate with the body that is constitutionally in charge of the purse strings is a facetious tantrum, devoid of logic, enabled by a biased media.

Maybe if the other side of the aisle (which I still register with) would have made a proposal to help cover the uninsured, and helped small businesses with huge costs, and noticed the people going bankrupt due to health care costs, and broken the AMA monopoly on new physician training centers, etc. we wouldn't have ended up here. Or, perhaps, they could have gone with the Heritage Foundation / American Enterprise proposal that Governor Mitt Romney established in Massachusetts. Ignoring the root problem is not helping things.

His inspiration might not be right, but if he lives by Oath and Law and did the work - he has earned it.

Some get Eagle without trying - they just do it because they love Scouting and wake up one day and realize that all that they need is a project.

Some want a checkbox for college applications, are prevented from getting their driver's license, are bribed somehow, etc.

This one sounds pretty clean in knowing about the outside influence - but was he a good Scout?

I have several boys in my unit who are dragged to meetings and campouts by mothers who know nothing about Scouting, but want their boys in it (Asian immigrant community). I consider it part of my job to make the boys like and enjoy Scouting - since they have to be here anyways.

If you are spending the cash, there is a swiss army knife that has a USB drive in it. I have given that some of my Eagles as they went off to college.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Victorinox-Swiss-Flash-Drive-Silver/dp/B00A16V10G/ref=pd_sim_sg_3

If you are spending the cash, there is a swiss army knife that has a USB drive in it. I have given that some of my Eagles as they went off to college.

http://www.amazon.com/Victorinox-Swiss-Flash-Drive-Silver/dp/B00A16V10G/ref=pd_sim_sg_3

I backpack regularly, with and without Scouts along. Over the past 3 years, I have tied my shoes and once used a timber hitch. My tents don't need knots, my gear doesn't need knots, and my truck is an SUV so everything goes inside it. If I have to top strap, I use straps.

That said, I teach knots, have competitions, and my unit does pretty well at Camporee. But the only way I get the boys to really embrace the knots is our annual "we left the tents at home, oops!" campout. The boys have to build their own shelters, and start pulling out their handbooks to remember a few knots at times.

Same issue with fire starting. There are very few places we camp where open fires are allowed. Fuel gathering is prohibited. So backcountry cooking is done with small stoves.

I like knowing the classics, but sometimes you have to make the program reward the mastery.