Hiromi

I'm happy to hear that is going so well for you guys. What I think passes for cool in school I find offensive as well. And my scouts are a uniformed unit, and they are proud of their uniform (even if they are only pretending to be Scouts). But like I said- the uniform in these parts is disappearing, and so are the units. This must be a regional aberation. I concede that I may be completely off the mark in my ideas about what scouting ought to do to imporve its image and program- if anything at all. Pappy

Hi Bob, I never said I wasnt following it. I said I loathed the over-emphasis paid on this aspect of outdoorsman ship. It gets to the point of being girlish. I understand it is just plain good manners to leave a place the way you left it, especially if it is public nature preserves But boys need to get out into outdoor classrooms that allow them to change things around. Move the boulders in a stream to manipulate flow. Fell trees and fashion things from them. Build a primitive astronomical calendar. Build shelters. Make things that activate their imagination and sense of play. We are

Hi Bob, It is a Scout Camp FOS allow us to use. Camp Jim Hill is an outdoor Scout camp. On the grounds we build (using pioneering methods) teepees, towers, bridges, and all sorts of structures. We have been given permission to eleimante all the Honey Locust and other undesirable trees and underbrush. (No small task, since every time you chop down a Honey Locust hundred of new saplings emerge in a shirt time- which are also handy for scout projects as well.) We of course take special care to keep our site clean. Pappy (This message has been edited by Pappy)

The Outdoor Code As an American, I will do my best to - Be clean in my outdoor manners Be careful with fire Be considerate in the outdoors, and Be conservation minded. We follow the rules when in Public and Private lands. We practice high imapact scouting at our own Camp Site. We are in the business to teach our boys how to build and adapt the enviroment to human needs. Leasure camping in "Parks" is a differnt skill set that we practice when camping in "Parks", and places other than our Base. Pappy

Old Grey Eagle, You are right of course. I wasn't applying for a job as the CEO of BSA. And no, of course I don't follow the BSA prescribed format to the letter. Whenever I make a point about scouting I usually give pretty exhaustive anecdotes from my own experience or explanations of my logic. But yes, I am pretty inexpereinced. Pappy (This message has been edited by Pappy)

CNYScouter, These links are loaded with ideas. One fun activity we do that is cheap and requires teamwork is simply hide and seek (Or we call it search and evade). You can let the scouts have cell phones so they can cover a larger area, or have to rely on hand signals alone. You could make it a search and rescue and involve first aide s well. ANother great one is geocaching and orienteering courses (with scavenger hunts). You could involve in such a game code breaking- riddle solving, rope use - sort of like a miny on the spot Klondike. You could either make the course y

Fire Cat, You're getting a little hysterical. We cut those trees and shrubs down to create a nice view - for humans. I really don't know if anyone understands what the "overall benefit of the environment" is. That smacks of arrogance to me as well. The environment is indifferent. It only acts opportunistically. The idea of synergetic harmonious eco-systems is a fairy-tale designed to make man seem out-group from nature. Killing animals is not unethical or ethical. It is a benign act. Deriving pleasure from the pain and suffering of another creature is truly

Trevorum, "Shuddering to think" is a symptom of girly-man-ness. As well as saying things like - "That is really scary". There is a cure for this condition. A. Read the Holy Bible. (Any Edition will do) B. Watch lots of Westerns, especially John Wayne and Clint Eastwood films. C. Shoot an animal (or use your bear hands) and watch it die. D. Break a horse. E. Read Ayn Rand's The Fountainhead or Atlas Shrugged. F. Read Aristotle G. Hang out with Real Men. H. Every time you look at something that you couldnt have come up with yourself, have the humility to admit

This report is very informative. Strategic Plan Research Reaching the Next Multicultural Generation Reaching Generation X and Millennial Parents -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.scouting.org/media/research/02-1058.pdf In 2006 the Boy Scouts of America introduced the new 20062010 National Strategic Plan to build Scoutings strength as it moves into its next century. As a part of this plan, 2006 was named the Year of Research so that we, as an organization, can better understand how to reach youth and parents, and provide a

The death of Canadian scouting Hans Zeiger August 12, 2004 http://www.renewamerica.us/columns/zeiger/040812

CALICO, I STAND CORRECTED. Question - I have been told that there are more trees today in the United States of America than there were when the Pilgrims landed at Plymouth Rock. Is this true? If so, why? Rather, the forests have been recovering from clearing after the arrival of Europeans. http://realm.umd.edu/chesapeake.shtml Anthony R. Brach, Ph.D. ========================================================== I don't know how this could be determined, since there is no real way of knowing exactly what forests looked like at any given time that far back in history. Its l

Fire Cat, This Day and Age indeed. There are more trees in North America than anytime in Geologic history. Cutting down forests, preserving forests, burning forests, are all benign acts. Nature is incompletely indifferent. If we didn't cut down the forests of Europe we never would have built her cities, warmed her homes, and sailed the seas and tilled her soil. Forests grow back- sometimes with a vengeance. Environmentalism has become to many a religion, except in that faith man is not created in the image of God but is instead painted as a devil and a destroyer. He is a

"Pollution is bad sure- we get that. Our National Parks are not for human development - get that too." Scoutingagain, If you read my post I actually said that my scouts learn not to pollute and to observe no trace in public parks and such. But the emphasis on No Trace should never supersede our perspective on man's rightful relationship with his environment- which is that we are here to build, create, nurture, plant, hunt, and form. Over-emphasis on keeping nature pristine is really wrong-headed and narrow. I am concerned that we are emasculating our boys by not emphasizing

Fair enough Lisa, I've got nothing else to say about it. Pappy

That may be ripe for another thread Old GRey Eagle. But what we conserve seems to be a little more important than teaching boys to keep their paws off Mother Nature. I am firmly in the camp that says slashing and burning, cutting and building, is a lot more about conserving the manly arts and man's proper relationship with his environment rather than doing our darndest to keep the TV Indian from crying. Pollution is bad sure- we get that. Our National Parks are not for human development - get that too. But I want my boys to see trees as things to harvest as well as to

Bob, Scouting has been on a steady downward decline in our Council, and especially in our district for twenty years. I am a new unit. 5 years. But since my unit was formed two packs has dissolved and troop numbers have plummeted. Bob, you are definitely a company man. You have made that abundantly clear. It is never the BSA's fault in your eyes. So fine. Maybe you're right. But I think BSA can be improved as a business model to create bigger market share of youth programming in this nation. You think it is a problem with training adult volunteers. I have rea

As I stated. I am not as confident in the BSA status quos as many of you are. I think that scouting is an outdoors movement. I think that ethics and morals are paramount- but that Scouting,as I have seen it practiced- usually only pays a little lip service to that portion of its program, especially where the Boy Scout age youth are concerned. So lets say we will leave it to the CO- and we will support them in the way that they ask to be supported. We make the program more beefed up on those skills that the youth are demanding, and lighten up on the paperwork and dry tr

Not a set up. I have not contradicted myself. I am all for a very conservative idea of scouting, as you all well know. But I am not going to say that what I want for my unit is what anybody should want or have. I am specifically addressing what would be a better model for the National Organization as it moves forward. I think the monolithic scouting movement is having many pangs, and is in need of a reorganization to meet the needs of a very diverse population. Getting CO's to adopt their own style of scouting, and see SCOUTING AMERICA as the best resource, with the best custo

OLD GREY EAGLE, I am only suggesting that we think about letting the customer decide what values program, if any, they want in their scouting package. If a CO wants to do a traditional model- well we have that model in ready supply, don't we. If it is a venture model- we have that to. I am saying- drop all the categories and allow the customer to customize their own unit, and use SCOUTING AMERICA as an organization to aide them in outdoor training, organization, etc. I am saying the customers should have a choice, otherwise they will go away. If we are best at Scout craft, outdo

Bob, The model I propose would better serve the greater cause of spreading Scouting and scoutcraft to a wider and more diverse population. It would also keep National vital and focused on Scoutcraft- training - and outdoor adventure. It would help BSA by giving it a business model that would attract more talent, youth, and positive attention. Those that hold that the only problem with BSA as it stands is that people just don't get BSA and people just arent trained enough to do BSA right- they will be opposed to such an idea- because in their mind it is not BSA that needs fixing but i

BSA- as SCOUTING AMERICA: Would offer traditional Boy Scouting only as an option from a broad menu of options and services. But yes, the Scout Oath and The Scout Law would no longer be an integral part of Scouting America as an organization, but perhaps something that it might suggest but not mandate. It would be left to the CO to design the Values portion of their youth program. Let Religious and other community organizations run the values portion of Youth development and let Scouting provide Scouting and Scout Craft. It is a democratization model. And it would be an

This was spun from another thread. BSA SCHISM RED STATE SCOUTS/BLUE STATE SCOUTS SCOUTING AMERICA I propose a new title for BSA: SCOUTING AMERICA I propose we brand a new message for SCOUTING AMERICA that scouting is for everybody, wherever they find themselves in life, spiritually, economically, politically, culturally. I propose we make the values portion of scouting, along with the uniform an option and not a mandated portion of the program but an option to be creatively derived from the CO using the SCOUTING AMERICA services. We open up the option for all

You get no arguments out of me there Scouting Again. If it is true that BSA already would allow CO's to create their own values program tailor suited to their own unique BSA-affiliated program, then maybe BSA should market this aspect of itself to these organizations. An Ad line might go something like this: "Let us help you make your Youth Program something your youth will absolutely love. We offer high adventure- adult and youth training, safe access to the great outdoors, and a 100 year tradition helping make youth into Americas most productive adults." As I said- the s

le Voyageur, You have the disagreeable habit, le Voyaguer, shared by many on this forum, Gold Winger included, of picking one line of someones post and making a larger critical point you know darned well is neither in context nor the original intent of the poster, and which often times is only meant to trivialize and ridicule the posters position. I am making a sincere attempt at communicating ideas and trying to keep this out of the realm of conjecturing about the motives of the individual posters. If you have a comment to make about my greater intentions, do a better job of looki

le Voyageur, Don't be too sure that knowing what time it is is any guarantee of knowing that the current fashion is good, true, or beautiful. I think personally that the people who believe that there is a status quos that we must adapt to to be normal and with the times are in real danger of giving up what is truly timeless and worthwhile. One of the benefits of being Christian is that the bible guides us in these matters, and cautions us to be weary of the world, especially when it concerns our children. We have devolved democracy down into adolescent and pre-teens for the pas