FireKat

"I suppose what we really need is just to go on a hike with someone who knows what they are doing and follow their examplebut I dont know how that would be possible. anyone want to volunteer? (jk)."

Not really a bad idea, why not find a local troop who might take y'all on a hike? Good leadership practice for the troop and a chance to learn while doing for you. 

Many things can affect how to handle it. How old is the boy? Yonger ones, it is usually best to talk with the parent(s), depending on their receptiveness to that type of thing. I know I would want someone to tell me. Older boys will hide such things from their parents and may resent you for tell them. If you can talk with an older boy you may get out of him what is bugging him. Many times it is parental problems and the last thing they want is to talkto their parent about problems. Sometime being a good ear to their problem will help them figure it out themselves. No judgment, no answers, no "this is what to do"s; just let them talk.

Hope that helps a bit.

Kat (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

Y'all forgot my favorite - 'I have been to Wood Badge so I don't need to take any more training'. 

I have nothing against WB but I do not like it when they look down on anyone who has not been to it.  As with comparing college educated against someone who learn things thru the school of hard knock, many times I will go wil the undegreed person.  Just cause you went to a school does not mean you actually learn anything.

It can also be hard to enjoy scouting when there is no level (including Nat'l) in your area that is not falling apart.  We shall keep trying to make scouting again about the kids - not adults.

Strange thought..... how many admin type really interact with the boys on a regular basis?  Only at jamborees, PR events?  Do they only live in the corporate towers?

Narraticong, From what you described at that competition, the judges were at fault.  The judges should have made some allowances and done things that the boy could handle.  Picking out one boy to highlight his weakness is not what scouting is about.  Have a take with the organizers before the competition to make sure that they know of the disabilities and politely remind them of the goals of scouting.

As to council have an expert not in our council.  They did not have anyone to help until recently. At least they are working on it.

Many adults will not admit that they cannot deal with disabled doing what 'normal' kids are doing. So they pick on the disabled to bring out the problems in secret hope it will make the disabled kid quit. 

Some of these adults have the idea that the disability is contagious. I see enough of them around. They claim to want to help but their help is just the opposite.  These attitudes are kept hidden because of political correctness but they are still rampant.  I takes careful observation to discover those that are uncomfortable around handicapped.  Mostly they fear/dislike what they do not know or understand. Help them understand. 

Please do not let a few narrow-minded adults hurt either your handicapped scout or the boys that have been trying to include him. I commend the boys in your troop for working with a boy with disabilities. They will be much better citizens in the long run. A simple, one time competition is not as important as including the boy in scouting.

coffee....coffee....COFFEE!!!!!!!

Must not pollute with additions or flavors!

Forget the frue frue Starbucks stuff - just black and strong - not bitter.

Many people make bitter coffee so they add junk. I must have some that is not bitter & I learned to make it without any type of coffe maker.  Stuck in a lab with a bunsen burner, beakers and paper towels.  I even had others come for bench top coffee as it was never bitter.  Can't really tell you how to do it as others have tried but no luck.  If I have a way to boil water and coffee, I can make it. 

If you really wish to help the boy you will have to put up with the mother. Two options are have a heart to heart with her and be ready to lose your head. In the long run it might sink in.

The second is to continue to politely and calmly listen when she rants. All she is doing is making a fool of herself. With luck your non-response will cause her to give up on attacking you. Be prepared for an escalation before it works.

Either is hard. 

There is nothing worse than someone who sat in a class, not really paying attention because they think they know the stuff, then lording around as an expert while things fall apart.  I have seen this way too many times. 

Like a bull in a china shop, they stomp all over, not helping and sometimes even making it worse.  I would rather have a natural listener than a dozen class trained oafs that will not listen to the kids or another adult because they have the training.  We have some of that going on. One class is more than years of working with the kids in their eyes (oh, it does not matter if those adults went through the training too they just did so they know more).  Meanwhile the kids are being trampled by these trained adults. 

All the true listeners can do is help the kids learn how to deal with those adults. Makes our work harder. Most times there is nothing that can be done but to be a good shoulder and hope it does not make the boys scouting experience a bad memory.  

Dealing with bullies and the emotional needs of kids is not something that can be written in stone or a policy, not in specifics.  It must be kept in generalities.  Allow the adults to deal with the situation as needed.

 Kids lives are not black and white but many shades of gray.

Emotional support does not come from a text or class.  

It cannot be outlined, organized, or taught.   

It comes from watching and listening. 

Use your eyes. Do you see a kid hanging back?  Not joining in? Go find out why. Ask carefully with sympathy not judgment. 

The hanging back may be due to someone being mean to the boy.  Watch for interactions.  Dont let them see you watching. You can be surprised by what you can observe when they think you are not watching.  That is a skill not all seem to get the hang of. You have to be almost invisible.

Once it can be determined what is the problem then comes the education.  Both the bully and the victim need to be talk to. Not lectured at but a casual conversation that can help them come to realize what is going on and if it follows scout sprit. 

I always enjoy it when the light bulb goes on. The lesson then becomes part of them where a lecture is soon forgotten.

Bottom line is there is no one way to handle these things. It will vary on the kids, the incident, and the severity of the damage.  Kids, especially boys, have to be taught empathy. They must learn to walk a mile in the others moccasins. 

Bob, sorry, As you can see it was removed.

That is what I get for tryoing to post with the flu. Brain doesnt alway work right.

As to ignoring bulling by not reconizing it and it causing thoughts of suicide.... I am having to deal with that now. The school etc says it is not bulling and none happens unless a school offical sees it but it even goes to direct death threats. School officals claim they cannot deal with the bully as he is 'high risk' and disavantaged. That is why I get angry- the school continues to blame the victim and say the victim is the problem (victim has been physically assulted and told it was something he did). Victim belives it and thinks of sucide. School claims the 'bulling problem' has been handle because of 'training' of the staff.  In the last few months there have been 3 assults on campus requiring EMS response but if you ask the school officals they deny the attacks. Also at least on succesful and a few attempted suicides by kids. Problem getting worse. Ask school, they point to paperwork on anti-bulling. Just a head in sand -way of dealing with the problem.

I agree with jblake47 in

I guess I wouldn't say bullying always includes an element of harm to the other person, nor do I think it's always a long-term repeated process towards any one person.

It is just another way to say they are doing something while actually not doing anything, just as the schools do. They say see, we have this policy(training) so we are doing something.  Meanwhile the bulling continues and kids get hurt, mentally and physically.

Dont say you are doing something by making kids aware, really do something to stop it.

"Our adult leadership had several lengthy meetings to discuss HOW to deal with the situation...which ultimately we were unfortunately not able to resolve and the scout and his mother (a member of our troop committee) resigned"     This is what usually happens, the kid being picked on has to stop it by leaving.  Tell me, scoutmomma, what happen after the boy left? Were the instigators ever delt with or was the whole thing dropped?  Why did the same thing happen again? Same bullies?

I agree with Ed. BSA should cover dealing with bullying but to put it as an achievement makes the kid feel like if he cannot stop bullying he is a failure. That is why I am angry with BSA for adding it. The kids are confused and think BSA has the answer to how to stop it. Believe me, telling is not the answer, sometimes it make things worse.

Deal with this situation - - overheard at summer camp, father to 12yo son (verified).

"_____ ,come on and take a shower with me."

I have actually seen a few that have velcro to hold the rank patch in place.  Or staples.

I am old school I do not see that it takes much to put a few stiches in a patch. Thank goodness I have not seen anyone using the temp holders - I might not bite my tongue and tell them how I think that they do not think much of scouting not to put a few stiches to hold what they should be proud of.  I guess that goes with pushing 'ranking up' not value of the rank.

I want NATIONAL to tell us the answers.....Schools don't have them and do not stop bullying. I know- both my boys were picked on by bullies.  The only way they finally got them to stop was when they got bigger than the bullies and  flatened them. They only had to do it once.

The schools never helped, they kept asking my boys what they could do and how they could fix it. One of my sons was badly choked in school. They did nothing to that  kid and belive it or not, actually put him in the SAME class as my son! Even though he was still threating my son.  I once had to call the police to get a death threat handled as the school admin. kept putting me off. When the police showed up things changed. Schools now only CYA for themselves. They put off parents hoping that they will drop it!

If  BSA has the answer - lets hear it!!!!

I still have a problem with just about forcing first year boy scouts to take first aid. Most 10-11 yos do not have the maturity to do first aid. They giggle thru the class.

Also, here we go again with the adults telling the kids what to do.  Scouting is exploring the world at the kids pace and what interests them. They are to be a reward for being  interested in a subject not for sitting in a lecture for X hours with only thoughts of when is that person going to hand them the little blue card. That is doing things only for advancement, not for learning.

I wish they would stop focusing on advancement and refocus on learning as was intended by B-P.

Beavah, when was the last time you poked your furry head out of your hole?   Around here no one has been rude to some one offering a seat or holding a door since the early 80s.  It has become respectful for persons of either gender to hold the door for the next person or someone who will have troubles with the door.  The only place I see rampant ignoring of the next person is in the schools.

That old courtesy is returning slowly. I think it is due to the polite response of the person getting the courtesy.  I have even had gentlemen hurry up to a door to open it for me. I always thank them for the courtesy.  I hold doors for others too. When I did this years ago there was few thank yous, but now there is more.  If the few keep plugging at encouraging manners they just might come back.

As to hats -  A&M has a large sign in the entrance of the  student building, it says (if I remember correctly) that hats are to be removed to honor the fallen in wars.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

I have always wonder how the idea that giving monies to a non-denominational but religious organization would truly violate the above? 

If they give without respect to the religion or lack there of (all meeting other criteria equally) it is fair treatment across the board.  But as it stands now the govt is supporting the religion of no religion (religion as in belief in no god) and ONLY that religion.  So in a way the govt is establishing the religion of no religion.

 If you want govt money you cannot be tied to any religion but the religion of no religion. That seems a bit unfair.  They are prohibiting the exercise of religion it by trying to ban BSA from bases. Are they going to ban all prayer services on base too?  

I hate legalease!!! And the way lawyer twist things around.

Yuks, OK how about a troop that has an unplanned tradition? Every eagle project done by someone in our troop breaks at least one tool (usually expensive) I wait for it to happen. (over the last 4 years that has been about 10 projects) a lot of broken equipment. New parents do not believe it when I tell them to watch for it. Love the expression on their face when it happens.

Sometimes that can be for the best. If you get a bit too hurried on an embarrassing post and don't self edit it can be a blessing (hint from someone, maybe?)  - been there

"a climb up two flights of stairs is like scaling Everest." 

To some people watching me climb (or decend) a flight of stairs they might get that idea about me.  My trouble with stairs is due to a very badly broken leg a few years ago. It was broken across the joint and I am luck to be able to move the joint. The pay back for being able to move the ankle is unstability unless is is set down in just the right way or it folds up like there is no leg there. That happens to me all the time an scares all around me thinking I am hurt. No hurt but to pride and dignity. So I take it slow and sometimes use a cane to catch me if that happens (prefer a walking stick). I can still out distance (not speed) some that seem more fit. (don't suggest ankle braces as I have tried every one out there - not strong enough) I do execrises to work on strength but that will not fix the joint.  I want to go hiking but must take longer to watch placement. They go without me and I find a hiking path I can go at my speed.

Nevere assume that someone is incapable of someting until proven. I know a little old lady (75) who is a overweight. She looks like a classic german grandma. Big thing is, never, I mean never act like she is incapable of doing something or you might loose your head! That woman can pick up an 18 wheeler tire and throw it at you! You would never think she was physically capable of carring her groceries much less anything more. I saw her run down a teenager who dared suggest she could not do something.

True, on some people it can show what their problem is (excess eating) but if one has joined scouts there must be someone in there that wants to be doing the activites.  I have restrictions now and you should hear me whish I could go with them! Sometimes it is not I cannot but more I would hold them back. I wait with fustration for them to return and tell me all about it and encourage them to do as much as they can while they can, just in case.........

Just a little warning, Be ready for hard feelings all around. We had one appeal up to national - a very long, painful process I never want to happen again.

District -no. Council - YES.  Contact your council (or go thru your dist advancement chair) and find out if any of the boys' achivements have been recorded.  You  can use internet advancement once you set it up to keep a check on things. If their achivements have not been recorded it will bite them when they move on.

Yes, I agree that there is a weight problem. Mostly due to overindulgence. Some absolutly cannot be reduced without starvation. [A friend has an abnormallity in their famioy that does not allow a normal weight. They were studied at Bethesda Hosp because of it]

We, as adults need to supply good foods at functions - true. But do not look down your nose at those with excess weight. Many times that can add to the excess eating (eating is emotional). Be kind and helpful (now where have I heard that?) and encourage any small effort one makes.

Being too skinny is not healthy either. That needs to be watched for also.