Eagle94-A1

1. Welcome. I know there are good professionals out there, when I was a young Scouter, I worked for some who led me to become one when I got out of college. And being on here is a sign you may have been a good one IMHO. 2. Professionals. Treatment of volunteers by pros in the past, i.e. being ignored, overruled, lied to, yelled at, cursed out at, or being placed int he IVF for questioning council finances/insurance, has made many folks not want to volunteer at the district or council levels. So not many volunteers are around. I do not have issues with volunteers, as few as there are now, because I was heavily involved on the district and council levels prior to joining my current troop, and focusing on its survival for the past 7 years. I know the limitations and issues they face, especially in this council. I know all about the 5 P's, and backdating. Requests for help have been made multiple times in timely manners. The only "rush" times is when we get new DEs, and we talk to them about the needs when they first come aboard. And yes we know it is sometimes to late in that situation. But the same issue over and over? I know fundraising is important, but when the council has an abusive reputation because they curse out their district chair, who happens to be a local chamber officer, word gets around and donations flounder. When volunteers see you focused on one aspect of your job, Money, ignoring the Membership part, and abusing your Manpower as stated above, further donations flounder. COR is aware of the situation and understands. The troop was close to folding last year when 3 Scouts were not planning to re-register due to costs or losing friends. Local insurance benefit, and a Scout transferring into the troop saved the troop. And when my family joined the troop they were on the verge of folding for the same reasons. The troop is one of the oldest in the council, actually predating it. There is a lot of history in the Scout room There have been challenges in the past, I just hope this is one of them. But my loyalty is to my Scouts. I need to think what is best for them. And joining a larger troop that has resources and a feeder pack is in their best interest.

One reason why there are more troops is that it is not as dependent on adults like Cubs. In all my years as both a volunteer and professional, being a CS DL was the hardest. Another reason is CS used to be 5 years, and now 6. Scouts is 7-8 depending when they join..

Tough night last night. The decision to fold the troop was made last night. We been trying to recruit on our own because council is not helping, despite repeated requests. With only 4 Scouts, three of whom are in band, and one is just staying in until they get Eagle and really has no interest in camping but has no choice as he still needs Camping MB, it is now impossible to have an active outdoor program. Both the de facto CC and I realized this last nite when we tried to organize dates for November, December, and January. October was already out of play. We have not told anyone yet. I do not want to fold the troop just yet, as there are some 'housekeeping" things I want done. Finding troops for them is first and foremost, but will be challenging. All four have burnt bridges with at least one troop in the area. And another troop is in the same situation we are in: no Cub Scout feeder pack. They got an infusion of 2-3 Scouts when another troop folded this year, but otherwise are in the boat with no prospects for new Scouts after this year. Even if we merge with them, that only delays the inevitable. Also we are going to pay registration fees, but summer camp may be more challenging. We want to leave enough money with the CO to restart the church at a later date, if possible. And summer camp prices are skyrocketing. Sorry for the rambling, but it has been tough for me to get e grip on this decision.

No. The entire purpose of those requirements to to better prepare the Cub, and more importantly IMHO the parents, about the differences between Cubs and Scouts. I have seen first hand multiple times what happens when Cub "earn" AOL without actually doing those parts of the AOL requirements; They quit. Worst was the one den that didn't do any of the meetings or outdoor activity/camping, yet all members got AOL and "Crossed Over" to the troop. Troop gave them the custom neckers, slides, handbook, and never saw them again after the Cross Over ceremony.

the pre 2024 requirement was a hold over from LDS period. LDS packs could not camp at all, so Webelos1 and 2s could not camp at all. And 11 year old Scouts could only camp 4 times a year, and not attend summer camp.

Not always. I have seen Scouters go through all the training, yet still want to do things their way because 'Scouting needs to change with the times." Others just go through the motions, and then focus on their child. When you try to explain things, and mentor them, you are accused of "mansplaining," "being a misogynist," or "you don't know my son."

Not necessarily. I gotta be in the bottom 3 due to size. I could be wrong though. We are running the program as it should be run. Biggest challenge is no feeder pack, and have not had one for approximately 12 years. We got most of our scouts from existing ones who were dissatisfied with their troops. A few others who were never in Cubs, but had friends having fun with the troop was the other source. As the council stopped recruiting, packs have dwindled and died. Troops take a little longer since it is a 7 year program, and not a 4.5, now 5.5 year, program like Cubs. The Strongest troop does things their own way, and are successful because they are extremely protective of their pack. Leadership is shared, and they get fussy if other Scouts even talk to theirs.

With national increasing prices, and councils adding their own fees, Scouting is slowing becoming cost prohibitive for most families. And do not tell me to sell Popcorn. We have only 1 unit in my area selling it, and they are struggling. Only reason they are doing it is to have council waive their per Scout unit charge. And I have a feeling council will backslide on that.

CST 15 posted the following In August 2025, there were 51,888 Scouts in CST-15, compared to 53,544 in August 2024, reflecting a decrease of 3.09 percent. National youth membership stood at 814,950 at the end of August 2025, down 6.35 percent from 870,177 in August 2024. Results per CST-15 councils are shown in this table. Over the past 12 months, the number of units in CST-15 decreased from 2,593 to 2519, a loss of -2.85%. Nationally, units decreased from 39, 511 to 38,582, a loss of -2.35%.

$170 membership fee?!?!?!?!?! Only 1 of my Scouts could afford that.

i do not remember seeing this when I took Aquatics Supervision Swimming. It was an intense course.

While the Scouters in my district were skeptical of me being their DE, I was #3 in a 3 or 4 year period, only had one long time Scouter try to intimidate me. I didn't know who he was, but he made some comments about me "sleeping in a mudpuddle" at an OA Ordeal. Since he was spotless, I replied with my home lodge's old mantra, " a clean Arrowman is a lazy Arrowman," and walked off to join my chapter.

Biggest drawback is time prep. We did our own summer camp during COVID, and although I was an essential worker and had to go in to work, I had a lot more time to create a program. I do not think I could do the same thing now. Plus most of the adults are now focused on advancement and MBs, and not adventure. And this attitude has gone down to the Scouts. I have 2 scouts whose last summer camp will be 2026. One of them's attitude is the same as their parent's: they have all the MBS they need for Eagle and do not need to go to summer camp. The previous SM and I had to talk about HA activities at various camps. neither the Scout nor their parent realized they could do those activities. Funny thing is the ones who went to COVID CAMP said it was the best summer camp ever, but would not want to do it again. When asked why, they said no MBs. Even though every activity was part of a MB, and several MBs were started. Absolutely correct. Especially when camps are up for sale. Understatement. Same thing has happened in my council. Now some districts have less than 30% of the district positions staffed. It is not stupidity or ego, rather it is their superiors pressuring them to get agreeable, or as one SE called them "Pro-Council" committee members instead of the best possible choices. At least when I went thru the DE training, they taught us the right way, and would not talk about how folks are being told to do it. So the problem is known.

20 year olds cannot serve in the district role per National. And as a 21-24 year old district committee member, I can tell you from first hand experience some Scouters viewed me as "just a kid, " 'you do not know anything because..." no knots, no beds, no SM patch, ad nauseam. No, we are not complaining about lack of support from district committee members, we are complaining about the treatment by pros, which causes folks to not want to be involved at the district level at all. In my district's situation, the large majority of positions are vacant because no one wants to deal with the issues mentioned above. On thing I forgot earlier Pros need to be TRUSTWORTHY, and. not lie abut why things are being done, or not being done. Best example I can give is the council being told one reason things are being done, and the unit and district volunteers a different reason why things are being done. Do you want how it is supposed to be done, how the Pros want it done, or how it is done in reality, at least in my experience with multiple councils? The nominating committee is suppose to look at who is the best person for the job recruit them, and have the district committee vote EN BANC (emphasis) as a slate of officers. There are no choices for each position, and committee member selection can be rigged. The Pros want a nominating committee who will put people in positions so that they will do exactly what the Pros want them to do with no questioning. When I was a DE, my SE told me point blank to only select folks who can follow directions, and not necessarily the best person for each job. In reality it is whomever is willing to do the work gets the job, regardless if they are capable or not.

How many CORs are actually active on the district and council level? In my long experience, I only know of two. One was a former SM. The other was already active on the district level, and elected District Chairman when he was "appointed to be the COR. The members-at-large are usually the ones doing the actual work. 1. Pros should not ignore the unit Scouters when they need help. Listen to them as they are the heart and soul of the program. Without volunteers, you cannot have the program to recruit members. They know what works and what doesn't. While some have been Scouters a short time, others have years, even decades, of experience. 2. Pros need listen to your district level Scouters as they tend to have a lot more knowledge, skills, and experience than the pros do, especially in the service area. While Pros can stay 3-5 years in an assignment, in my neck of the wood the average 9 months. One DE left in under 30 days. 3. Do not second guess, over rule, etc the volunteers when they are assigned something to do. Best example is volunteer who was "voluntold" he was running a district camporee with 7 weeks notice because the camporee chief quit (see 4 below). Pro didn't interfere that year and it was a successful camporee. Volunteer agreed to do the following year. The Pros interfered so much it caused major headaches for the volunteer, and the event to go overbudget. Supplies were not ordered, so those supplies had to purchased locally at a higher cost. Camp got triple booked over the objections of the two folks running ITOLS and the camporee. This caused the campwide compass course to be redone hours before opening, and additional supplies not budgeted to deal with the anticipated parking issues and to designate the Cub area from the Scout areas. And I can go on and on about the interference. That volunteer promised to never run another district event ever again. 4. Pros need to remember "a Scout is Courteous." They should not yell, berate, and curse out volunteers. Especially ones who are also business leaders in the community. Not only will folks willing to volunteer dry up, but also FOS dollars will as well. Some long time businesses donors heard about these things, and stopped giving. More later