Parents pushing Scouts

[Engineer61 19]

So, what do you do about the parent(s) that are pushing their Scout through the program?

 

You all know the ones....some of you may be them...

 

So the Scout likes certain aspects of Scouting...camping or hiking for example, but he could care less about badges, leadership, advancement...he's just there to enjoy what he likes and if he picks up a badge or two, then ok.

 

The parents on the other hand are constantly riding the kid..."Don't you want to keep up with Johnny?", "You only have 3 merit badges this year, Billy has nine."

 

Of course the Scout has no where to go for help, he can't push back on his parents, and he views all the SM's and ASM's as on the parent's side...gung ho and what not.

 

Seems like there is a point where Scouting does more harm than good.

[jhankins 10]

It's not Scouting that's harming those kids, it's the parents. In my neck of the woods, we avoid community team-based sports because the parents are brutal not only to their own kids, but to the others!

 

The type of youth you mention is probably one that would benefit in a shift of program focus. Perhaps the youth in question would benefit from a Varsity Team or a Venturing Crew instead. It's our job as leaders to notice these things, offer suggestions to the youth, then approach the parents.

[Lisabob 13]

With due respect, I think it is important to be sure you understand the parents' motivations before wading into this one.

 

Some parents are way too competitive and are using their kids as status symbols. That can be a bad thing, especially if the kid is totally uninterested.

 

Some parents want their kids to "get" all they can to pad their college apps or whatever, without paying much attention to the substance. Racking up points like this can be problematic, particularly if the kid doesn't enjoy the activity.

 

Some parents have kids who need more social interaction, but the kids may be the type who aren't going to seek it out on their own. The kid who would as soon sit in front of the tv or gaming system by himself or herself all day, who isn't involved in anything at school, who tends to just withdraw. Those kids might need to be pushed to get out there and do, see, try, interact with others to develop their social and emotional skills. I know several parents who push scouting on their kids for this sort of reason.

 

Some parents have kids who have a hard time understanding commitment. They might be willing to sign up for everything, but finish nothing. Maybe those parents want their kid to understand that if they've signed up and paid, they are obligated to follow through until the end of the season/year/whatever, when they may choose something different.

 

Personally, when my son was in middle school, I told him he could quit scouting at the end of the year as long as he became involved in some other venue that would provide him with connections of some sort to his community. Until such time as he did that though, he could continue in scouting. The sense of being part of something greater than oneself is important enough to me that I was willing to push him to stay in for that reason, alone. Now that he is older, I give him more leeway to make choices, but sitting alone in his room with the door closed all the time will never be one of those choices.

 

To deal with parents who "push scouts" I just think it helps to understand what the parents' goals are for pushing scouting, in the first place. Some of those goals are reasonable ones.

 

[AlamanceScouter 10]

Honestly, I wish my parents had pushed Scouting on me.....well, at least encouraged it after spending the time to learn what the program was about.

 

As a lad I was into sports and was a pretty decent athlete.....looking back on my life from the perspective of a 44 year old though I really think being an Eagle Scout would serve me so much more now than the various accolades I received playing sports. At the end of the day my son will make the decision about his level of Scouting he aspires to but I am going to encourage/support him to do his best in it.

[Oak Tree 15]

I think that there's a limited amount that you can do. I don't want to get into telling parents how to raise their own kids. The most that I would do is to consistently demonstrate a philosophy, and discuss the idea, and lead the troop in a way that shows that advancement isn't the most important thing. Pay attention to what you notice, what you reward, what you measure - this works for the parents as well as for the kids. It's not foolproof, but it sets a general tone.

[frank10 12]

I had a youth who was always making my life difficult. So one day I had a SM conference with him to try to find out why. He told me he had no interest in scouting and was forced to come to the meetings. He was acting up to get me to complain to his mother until she pulled him out.

Made a deal with him. HE could be a pain until her car let the lot, if he stopped then I would tell his mother he was trouble for the whole meting. That way I could have peace and he could just sit in the corner. No the best arrangement but was the best I could do for the rest of the troop....

 

I kept my end of the bargain and so did he... Funny thing, once he was free to do nothing he didn't want to just sit in the corner anymore. Started joining in. Had to call another SM Conference, no sense in getting him pulled out of a program he wanted to be in.

[Scoutfish 16]

When I was 16 years old and just newly recieved my driver's license, my best friend was still 15.

He was a boy scout. He might have been a life scout, star, tenderfoot... I have no honest idea.....whatever he was, I don't know. Scouting was not my thing and not on my radar.

 

But my friend loved scouting. Loved camoping out, hanging out with the other scouts doing whatever they did.

 

UNTIL his dad started telling him that if he didn't have Eagle by 16, he wasn't allowed to have and absolutely would not get his driver's license. Well, scouting went from fun to a leverage tool that my freind despised .

 

Now, if his dad had said: "You can get your license, but if you earn Eagle, I'll help chip in for a better car."...well, that might have been an incentive.

 

And when my son joined cub scouts, he pretty much changed his mind 3/4 of teh way through being a W9olf Cub. He deccided he didn't want to do it any more.

But I pushed him just a little bit, I told him that I didn't care if he dropped out, but he needed to complete at least 1 full year to get the full effect.

 

Well, he's going to be a Webelos very soon and glad I "talked" him into sticking it out.

 

I almost called it quits witha girlfriend I was dating back in 1993, but My dad had a talk with me. Told me there were certain times and certain things that just needed to be stuck with. He sid sometimes you can't make a big decision in a short time. So he "pushed" me too.

 

I'm glad he did because that girl I was dating who aggravated me soooooo much has been my wife since 1996, anfd we have a beautiful son togethjer and two aggravating dogs!

 

 

So, I know what you mean about pushing, but pushing is a little different for each person.

 

Rank for the sake of having it is a bad push. Asking your kid to wait a bit longer before making rash or unfounded decision...well....I can understand that!

 

As a leader thouigh, I'd tell those parents that there is a time frame and a purpose to each rank, activity and award that can be earned. I'd tell them as a leader, they should trust that BSA didn't just sit around and figure out the whole program in 5 minutes while drinking a beer , but rather, alot of time, thought and study went into it.

[Eagle92 110]

I have mixed emotions on parents pushing.

 

One one hand, I have seen what everyone else has seen: scouts who didn't want to be there and scouts who had a fun thing turn into a prerequisite for a driver's license or car. heck I had one scout with 62 MBs, that's right 62 MBs, decide he didn't want to do the service project to get eagle, to spite his dad. All b/c dad said get Eagle or no license and car.

 

On the other hand, I know an Eagle who had to get a little push from his SM and parents to finish up his last MB before his 18th Bday. He procrastinated for 5 years as a Life before earnign his PM MB 5 days before the deadline. I am so glad everyone gave me that little puch at the end.

[jeff-o 10]

I had one scout who didn't want to be there at the meetings. I would have a SM conference with him to talk about his behavior, and he told me, "I don't want to be in Scouts, but my Dad makes me come."

 

I took the opportunity to try and help him stand up for himself. After all, part of scouting is about teaching boys to be men and learning confidence, right? I took the time to explain to him that he needed to be clear that if he really didn't want to be in scouts, then he was the one who was going to have to tell his parents, I wasn't going to do that for him.

 

Then we talked about things that he did like. And it turns out he liked the things that we were doing in scouts, he just didn't like that he was forced to come to meetings. I encouraged him to enjoy his time at scouts and not focus on why he was there. Now he comes all the time and appears to be enjoying himself a lot.

[Eagledad 2779]

>>Of course the Scout has no where to go for help, he can't push back on his parents, and he views all the SM's and ASM's as on the parent's side...gung ho and what not.

 

Seems like there is a point where Scouting does more harm than good.

[Engineer61 19]

Well Eagle,

 

You can complain about my tone, wording, whatever...change the tone to your liking if you like.

 

My career requires me to be cynical, that should have been obvious from my Username. "Nothing is correct until it is proven to not be wrong..", is what one professor told me. So my tone in writing is most likely never going to be Sunshine, Rainbows, and Care Bears. Guess you'll have to learn to adapt.

 

And just because I don't necessarily agree with *your* opinion of Scouting does that make my opinion any less valid. Although I have noticed that you immediately discount any opinion that varies even slightly from yours. And those of us in that predicament put up with that from you... Forums are a beautiful thing in that respect.

 

I've had this problem myself when coaching baseball. In that venue, kids who don't want to be there and don't really pay attention to what is going on, get hurt, sometimes seriously. I don't put that kid at Third Base or Shortstop....

 

So my fundamental question remains...

 

Thanks for the feedback ...

 

[Eamonn 61]

Boy oh Boy!!

This is a tough one!!

Some thoughts. - Not in any real order.

 

One of the most important things a SM can do is to know the Scouts he serves.

Just about every Scout I've ever known wants to do something or is good at doing something.

If the SM can find out what this is, making that Scout shine is the easy part.

 

I have always seen my job as serving the Scouts.

How a parent goes about raising their child?

That's up to them.

I'm never happy when I feel that I'm being pushed around or being forced into anything.

The Scout belongs to the parent.

I work for the Scout not the parent.

Having said that a Scout does promise to "Do his best"

I have no problem offering lots of opportunities for each and every Scout to take full advantage of everything that Scouting has to offer.

 

Kids are really strange animals.

I know I had one!!

They will always do what you least expect them to do.

OJ never really like school work.

But he held the OA Vice Chief of Administration for 3 years and went on to serve as Section Secretary.

Even though he is my son, I never knew he had such a deep interest in First Aid. (He is now an EMT with hopes of becoming a Paramedic)

Most kids reach an age where they do what they are interested in, no matter what their parents have to say about it.

 

All Scouts at some time or another do something that is worthy of recognition.

Recognizing them keeps parents happy and makes the SM feel good -Along with the Scout!

 

When parents get out of line.

The SM should take them behind the woodshed and explain what Scouting is really all about. -It's not badges!!

Sometimes it is worth reminding everyone that if we push to hard, we do more harm than good.

I never really pushed my son to complete his Eagle.

I think he holds the world record for being a Life Scout longer than anyone else on the planet!

One reason he gave for not moving on was because the Troop he was in had a guy who had some fancy title (Eagle something or another!)Who tried to push him and like his old man, he doesn't like to feel that he is being pushed.

Eamonn.

[bacchus 10]

I have the perspective of the parent, of the adult leader, and of the scout.

 

I must be that pushy parent because to me it sure seems like every adult wants to slow the boys' advancement down. When we have a boy who has done all the requirements and wants a BOR but keeps getting told he'll be ready at another time, that's an unnecessary hurdle. When merit badges earned at camp are not issued for whatever excuse, that's adding an unnecessary hurdle. When a boy comes out and says in a scout planning meeting that he wants to be Eagle by the end of the year, and then a year later says he wants to earn Eagle within the next year and a half (that's 2.5 years after his original statement), there is obviously something wrong. We leaders don't need to be changing the youths' goals to fit our own. If one likes to participate in scouting activities and progress while another likes to participate in baseball and avoid scouting, but the leaders hold one back so the other doesn't get discouraged by falling behind, we have a problem.

 

I'm very tired of the attitude that if a youth isn't Eagle quality yet, we need to make it difficult for him to earn First Class, or Star, or merit badges, etc. If we waited before they were Eagle quality before letting them get any advancement at all, most would be about 17 1/2 before they earned Star, and then I guess the Eagle reputation could be protected and the numbers could be kept low and not "diluted."

 

A parent should not be pushing a scout to the point that he makes his child do things and participate in activities he doesn't want to do, but from my perspective I see that a parent definitely has to be involved trying to keep the adult hurdles out of the way so his son can advance. Of course when I say that, I'll back up any scout who isn't my son who is being prevented from advancement for the odd adult reason. So maybe it's a parent perspective, but it's a leader's perspective too.

 

That is not the correct application of "adult association" in my mind.

[Eagledad 2779]

>>My career requires me to be cynical, that should have been obvious from my Username.

[OldGreyEagle 5]

I guess it depends on how you define "pushy"...

 

When I was a scout, I would ask my mother what she would like for Christmas, and she would say, you know, the mothers pin for First Class would match my new suit,or when I asked what she wanted for her birthday it was, that Star pin the mothers get would look great with my new hat. For mother's day one year it was the life pin and then the Eagle pin of course.

 

Not sure if I would have done it with out the help? Motivation? Push? Course that was back when it took a man to be a scout, having to walk uphill to the rifle range 5 miles both directions in a blinding blizzard. You had to learn either morse code of semaphore and couldnt earn a merit badge until you were First Class