How to Tell an SM It's Time to Step Down

[Eagle94-A1 2687]

Most of you know the situation. For those who don't brief recap.

 

We have a "Lem Siddons situation" in that the SM is in his 70s, has major medical conditions that require him to have oxygen. He'll bring 2 tanks with him when he camps, and I found out that one of the reasons the Scouts decided on a bunch of local camp outs is because of his health.

 

When he restarted the troop, the SM was the only adult who was there all the time as the primary ASM was also CM

 

Today the primary ASM, who is a church member, is willing to step up since he is no longer involved with Cubs.

 

I've switched to ASM to help out with the Scouts, and attend just about everything now.

 

We have two ASMs and an MC who attend almost every meeting as well now.

 

So the base of adults helping has grown in the past year exponentially. He is no longer needed to provide stability to the troop.

 

We know he is a Scouting addict. We want him to continue being involved with the troop. BUT we don't want him to continue as SM, feeling obligated to do everything and attend everything and dying on us. And by "we" I mean the ASMs, which includes the IH.

 

I've talked to the COR a few months back, and they want a church member to take over. No problem there for me. But we have one willing to step up now that he has stepped back from Cub Scouts.

 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

[Stosh 3452]

A scout is kind, friendly, courteous, etc.

 

I would think this could be handled, delicately yes, but effectively nonetheless.

 

It's time to get the UC, COR, IH, SM, ASM's together to help the SM understand he's holding the boys back a bit and that a change would be beneficial to the SM's legacy in the troop.

 

1) Old SM becomes honarary SM with emeritus status.  He is still expected to be at all scout meetings with the other adults.  Maybe register him officially as an ASM.

 

2) New SM takes over and functions as such but bounces off any and all major changes in the program with the old SM's blessing if possible.

 

3) Hold a "retirement" "appreciation" banquet for the Old SM, making sure all former scouts are invited.  This celebration should rank right up there with the best ECOH ever with maybe omitting the helicopter arrival of the Old SM..... Open convertible would be nice,pick him up at home and drive him to the celebration.

 

4) Hold a monthly campout, service project AND LEGACY EVENT, where the activity would allow for the old SM to actively participate even with his health restrictions, maybe not overnight, but canoeing where he can paddle if he wants or just ride and enjoy the scenery if he prefers. Make it mandatory he attends!  All other events are optional.  Maybe he'll be the one driving the pickup truck when the boys do the road cleanup project.

 

Whatever is decided, remember this guy gave his heart and soul to that unit.  Make sure the unit lets him know it was worth it.

[Krampus 696]

I would hope that when I reach that point I will have the good sense to realize that the unit needs to be passed on to someone to do what I can no longer do. @@Stosh gives good advice.

[RememberSchiff 3689]

<---  Hmm a "Lem Siddons situation"

 

A new RV with a full tank of gas and out-of-state plates might do it. Just saying.

[qwazse 4351]

This guy might not be one for banquets. If that's the case, reserve a court of honor or campout where the changing of the guard can be made.

 

As far as program goes, discern how much the boys chose the locations because they had to have him there vs. they wanted to have him there. Based on that, you need to figure out if you need to toss him the "gold watch" or insist that he still needs to be part of the team.

 

With those local camp-outs, figure out how to build in the appropriate physical challenges for the boys. SM emeritus stays at base camp, ASMs supervise the leadership corps/ venture patrol(s) as appropriate

[Stosh 3452]

This guy might not be one for banquets. If that's the case, reserve a court of honor or campout where the changing of the guard can be made.

 

As far as program goes, discern how much the boys chose the locations because they had to have him there vs. they wanted to have him there. Based on that, you need to figure out if you need to toss him the "gold watch" or insist that he still needs to be part of the team.

 

With those local camp-outs, figure out how to build in the appropriate physical challenges for the boys. SM emeritus stays at base camp, ASMs supervise the leadership corps/ venture patrol(s) as appropriate

 

Whatever it takes!    I do like the idea of insisting he still needs to be part.  The stepping down part should be his decision alone.  I would never want the man to feel he is no longer needed.

[Eagle94-A1 2687]

Couple of comments,

 

1) Definitely do not want to throw him out like dirty laundry. He got the troop restarted, and essentially singlehandedly worked with the Scouts for 4-5 years. When I talked to him about me taking over a few months back, he said point blank he wanted to stay on. I told him no problem, but I did NOT want him to feel obligated to do anything. I think he knows the time is coming, but he's is a true Scouting addict.

 

2) When you're a Scouting addict, it is sometimes hard to step away. My wife has commented that I am going to be like the SM when I get to his age.

 

3) We are definitely planning on keeping him involved. BUT we don't want him to feel obligated to attend when he is having challenges.  Last night was an example. Wife had to drive him to and from the meeting. And during the meeting he had to sit back and let other adults do some things for him. He was having breathing issues again.

 

4) Legacy event would probably be survival camping on his property. Last time we did it, he staid in his house overnight.

 

5) We got a COH coming up in April. If we could get him to step down then, we could make a big shindig. While he may not like it, a good roast never hurt anyone. And since the COR is the former SM, they got some stories

[Krampus 696]

Whatever it takes!    I do like the idea of insisting he still needs to be part.  The stepping down part should be his decision alone.  I would never want the man to feel he is no longer needed.

 

I am glad my unit has never had a long-serving (greater than 6 years) SM. We've built a sense of stewardship within the unit, so it is expected that the SM will step down someday. I think that builds an awareness in the program that the mantle of leadership -- just like with the Scouts -- needs to be passed on to a new generation.

[CalicoPenn 729]

If he wants to stay on, he may be worried that the unit will decline again - or it may be that this is what gives him the motivation to keep on trucking if he's got serious health problems - gives him something to do and fight for. 

 

If he's comfortable with the ASM that's ready to step up, then having a friendly discussion about how the Troop is doing and suggesting a Scoutmaster Emeritus role would be a good start.  Does anyone have a friendly relationship with his wife?  She could be your biggest ally into talking him in to an active Scoutmaster Emeritus role.

 

Don't overlook the possibility of his working more directly with a "new scout" patrol to help get them up to par - especially if he's already used to have Scouts camp in his "backyard". 

 

One thing I would avoid - if he's willing to go for a SM Emeritus type position, I would stay away from any big celebrations or roasts.  I know the thinking is in honoring him, but it can also be seen as a retirement message and it may be that he's resisting the idea of retiring from Scouting more than he wants to continue to be Scoutmaster. 

[Stosh 3452]

@@CalicoPenn

 

I tried to draw out a couple of concepts in my original post. 

 

1) Even though he is "stepping down" from SM, he is expected to be on hand for SM support of the new SM.  The SM's role of bouncing all changes off of him first so that he has ownership in the processes of the troop still apply.

 

2) His participation in the Legacy Activities would be mandatory for him.  Physically he may not be able to camp, but he still is expected to be a necessary part of the troop, for hiking, for canoeing, for any activity he is able to attend and the activity will be designed with his limitations in mind.  It might be going to the local museum and all he does is sit in the coffee shop with the other adults, he's still has to be there.  I'm sure the boys would enjoy a Saturday of fishing.  All the Old SM need do is sit in his lawn chair and hold the pole in one hand and coffee in the other.  He's taken care of his boys all these years, now it's time for them to take care of him and it's not a burden once a month to pull something together.

 

3) Just because one reaches the rank of Eagle and the troop throws a huge party to celebrate does not mean it's the end of the road!  That will be the theme of that celebration.  A milestone?  Yes.  A destination?  NO WAY. 

Edited March 1, 2016 by Stosh

[CalicoPenn 729]

Stosh,

 

I like your ideas though I'm not sure about making any activity mandatory for him - we don't make them mandatory for any other Scout or Leader - but I like the idea of the Troop doing activities where he has the ability to hang around and interact with the Scouts. 

 

I'm also not sure about a new SM getting the stamp of approval first before something can be done - may as well keep him as SM then.  Any new SM should have the ability to put their own ideas to work - but he should certainly be a resource to the SM - and I can definitely see the CC using him as a sounding board to make sure any new SM isn't driving off the rails.

 

I also agree that he deserves a big party - where my concern lies is that he is reluctant to give up the post and I'd want to make sure that offering a SM Emeritus position doesn't get interpreted by him as being pushed out.  Whether intended or not, big celebrations/roasts after taking on a SM Emeritus role could be interpreted as being a retirement party - even if that's not the intention.  However, one possible way around it might be to choose some other big event - a birthday perhaps - or a big anniversary of his years in Scouting - to throw him that party - I just might not do it until a few months after he takes on the new role.

[Stosh 3452]

Stosh,

 

I like your ideas though I'm not sure about making any activity mandatory for him - we don't make them mandatory for any other Scout or Leader - but I like the idea of the Troop doing activities where he has the ability to hang around and interact with the Scouts. 

 

The thought behind this would be to indicate to him the importance of him being there for those activities.  This gentleman is going into his golden years with serious health problems.  He's losing his independence, his value to those around him and his body is telling him to quit.  But he still has his dignity in tact and to loose face, to lose being a valued part of something especially something as important to him as scouting would be depressing.  "Mandatory" is your way of saying, your value is too important not to have it there.  Seriously, this guy had to have his wife drive him to the scout meeting.  The #1 symbol of independence, the driver's license is now passing out of his grasp.  Sure, the day will come when he will say, I know it's mandatory, but my body just won't get me there anymore,  Your only response will have to be.  "It's not going to be the same without you there".  THAT is the most important expression of caring one can give.

 

I'm also not sure about a new SM getting the stamp of approval first before something can be done - may as well keep him as SM then.  Any new SM should have the ability to put their own ideas to work - but he should certainly be a resource to the SM - and I can definitely see the CC using him as a sounding board to make sure any new SM isn't driving off the rails.

 

Again this is one of those dynamics that need to be couched in quotes.    His ability to guide this troop, to bring it back to life, and flourish has been on the value of his opinion.  He owns this troop and by having the new SM bouncing off ideas on him will allow him the dignity of retaining his ownership and valued opinion in the troop.  Mr. Old SM.  we have this new SPL who went off to NYLY and came back and has some new ideas he would like to try out in the troop.  Has this worked well for you in the past?  What went well when you tried it, what didn't  Is there something I should know before I work with him on it.  He wasn't to try out the patrol-method and we haven't done well with that in the past, do you think with these new boys we should try it again?

 

Oh, just do what you want, you're the SM now. 

 

Yes, I know, but your input is still important to this troop and to me.

 

See where that's going?

 

I also agree that he deserves a big party - where my concern lies is that he is reluctant to give up the post and I'd want to make sure that offering a SM Emeritus position doesn't get interpreted by him as being pushed out.  Whether intended or not, big celebrations/roasts after taking on a SM Emeritus role could be interpreted as being a retirement party - even if that's not the intention.  However, one possible way around it might be to choose some other big event - a birthday perhaps - or a big anniversary of his years in Scouting - to throw him that party - I just might not do it until a few months after he takes on the new role.

 

@@CalicoPenn

 

When I left the ministry I left behind a lot of political nonsense, pettiness, and power struggles.  I might have walked away from my profession, but I didn't walk away from my ministry.  I sat down and looked at my skills and what I have been lead to believe are my passions in life.  One obviously, is youth.  the other is geriatrics  Both these areas in a person's life are super important to help people through gracefully.  People in the middle years can basically fend for themselves.  But the two ends are special. 

 

Ever wonder what the special bond is between the grandparent and grandchild?  It's the glue that holds the world together.

 

I had an experience back when I was in my second parish that I'll never forget.  My 3-4 year old daughter, my collie-shepherd dog and I would routinely visit the local nursing home.  One evening we went through the doors and my daughter bolts to the first person in a wheel chair she sees.  She clamored up on to his lap and started a conversation without thinking.  How's your day?  kinda thing  The elderly gentleman visited with her for only about 3 or 4 minutes, but both seemed to enjoy the "talk".  My daughter said she had to visit a whole bunch of other people but maybe someday they could visit again.  He said that would be okay.  Off down the hall she went.  The dog and I tagged along.  I hadn't gone but 10 feet when a woman approached me from behind she was in tears.  She struggle to get the words "your daughter" and "my husband" out between sobs.  I figured the next person to show up was going to be the nursing home administrator with an earful for me.  I waited for a moment and she finally calmed down a bit and the next words were "Thank you!"  It would seem that this gentleman that had just carried on a conversation with my daughter had not spoken to anyone else in the past 10 years, not even his wife.

 

There are certain "triggers" in the life of our youth and other "triggers" in the lives of our elderly.  When they connect up, some pretty amazing, even "miraculous" things can happen.  Never underestimate your boys and never underestimate their elders. 

[CalicoPenn 729]

Darn - who's peeling the onions in my living room

[scoutldr 732]

Sounds like the problem may take care of itself soon.  How does he relate to the boys?  Do they enjoy having him around?  Surrogate grandfather?  Seems to me the other adults can prop him up enough to ensure the troop doesn't take a downward slide while still preserving his dignity.  That weekly scout meeting surrounded by kids may be the only thing keeping him going.  Tell the scouts to go ahead and plan what they want to do, including high adventure.  Other adults can provide support for that.  If the old gentleman still has his faculties, he is more than aware of what his capabilities are and will not want to hold the boys back. 

[cchoat 62]

Ever think about talking to your District Commissioner and seeing if he could be made a Unit Commissioner?  That much experance could be of great value to another struggling unit in need.