Now I'm the Troop's Treasurer

[blw2 433]

another thread, about adult interference, made me think of reviving this thread....

 

The handoff of the treasury stuff hasn't gone so smoothly, well really it's only slow....mostly because they're trying to close out all the stuff currently in the works for a smooth hand-off.... which honestly I think makes lots of sense and I'm thankful for it.

 

Currently, my inside the head voice is screaming at the top off my lungs though, since the money thing is very adult driven and adult handled.  I have already discussed with the CC and the committee that i plan on transitioning a lot of this stuff to the scouts.... they say that they agree and get it, but then again I'm not so sure.

 

Anyway, I've stepped back so as not to meddle things up in the mean time

BUT the handoff is coming soon I think, and honestly I'm a bit concerned about how I should best handle the switch.

 

As I mentioned before we have troopwebhost, which has some seemingly great financial tools, but they historically have not had success in getting the troop as a whole to log in and work through it.... so it's currently not being used.  My guess is that the parents wouldn't do it, but I'm wondering if we can get the parents to understand that it's up to their scouts to do it, maybe they'll be a little more inclined for it.

 

Anyway

I sure do wish I had an experienced treasurer to brainstorm with!

 

Currently, our activity permission slips are collected and used sort of a log of who has paid for the upcoming campout, by notation in the margins (check number, pull form scout accounts, etc..) .... it's a very committee member to parent to committee member thing....

 

Anyway, i see the permission slip as a totally separate job function from treasurer, really more to the outdoor activities chair (if we had one), or maybe the secretary

and these things probably should be handled between the scribe, the Patrol Leaders, and the Scout.... who would then approach their own individual parents to get the money, signatures, etc..., then it would climb back up to the scribe, who would work with the outdoor activities committee member for the permission slips

....and work with the treasurer (me) for the money.

 

Here's my loose plan.  Tell me your thoughts....

 

I'll start by running things more or less how they have been for a very short time, just to get myself more up to speed, give me time to get our accounts set up and running in troopwebhost, etc... and for the appearance that i gave it a shot the "old way"

Then I figure that I'll

approach the SM, and ask permission to talk with the SPL, and then perhaps the PLC

basically explain that I have a problem because of parents doing too much and "confusing the issue"

and ask (or suggest) that in an effort to move more to boy lead (which is something they all SAY that they want), I would like to rely on them

basically, that I want to support the scouts taking their troop back from the adults

• That all forms and payments would come to me from the scribe, or at least from the scout, & not from their parents....
• and that the scribe would be helping the scouts to remember what is needed. (if you owe money, owe a form, etc..) i.e Servant Leadership
• and that I will be willing to work with the scribe to keep the web info up to date regarding stuff received, and that the individual scout could then become more involved with their own destiny in indicating if they plan to attend, being able to look before a meeting to see if they need to bring something, owe money, etc...
• and to see if they want this, or if they have other ideas....

[Sentinel947 1205]

 

another thread, about adult interference, made me think of reviving this thread....

 

The handoff of the treasury stuff hasn't gone so smoothly, well really it's only slow....mostly because they're trying to close out all the stuff currently in the works for a smooth hand-off.... which honestly I think makes lots of sense and I'm thankful for it.

 

Currently, my inside the head voice is screaming at the top off my lungs though, since the money thing is very adult driven and adult handled.  I have already discussed with the CC and the committee that i plan on transitioning a lot of this stuff to the scouts.... they say that they agree and get it, but then again I'm not so sure.

 

Anyway, I've stepped back so as not to meddle things up in the mean time

BUT the handoff is coming soon I think, and honestly I'm a bit concerned about how I should best handle the switch.

 

As I mentioned before we have troopwebhost, which has some seemingly great financial tools, but they historically have not had success in getting the troop as a whole to log in and work through it.... so it's currently not being used.  My guess is that the parents wouldn't do it, but I'm wondering if we can get the parents to understand that it's up to their scouts to do it, maybe they'll be a little more inclined for it.

 

Anyway

I sure do wish I had an experienced treasurer to brainstorm with!

 

Currently, our activity permission slips are collected and used sort of a log of who has paid for the upcoming campout, by notation in the margins (check number, pull form scout accounts, etc..) .... it's a very committee member to parent to committee member thing....

 

Anyway, i see the permission slip as a totally separate job function from treasurer, really more to the outdoor activities chair (if we had one), or maybe the secretary

and these things probably should be handled between the scribe, the Patrol Leaders, and the Scout.... who would then approach their own individual parents to get the money, signatures, etc..., then it would climb back up to the scribe, who would work with the outdoor activities committee member for the permission slips

....and work with the treasurer (me) for the money.

 

Here's my loose plan.  Tell me your thoughts....

 

I'll start by running things more or less how they have been for a very short time, just to get myself more up to speed, give me time to get our accounts set up and running in troopwebhost, etc... and for the appearance that i gave it a shot the "old way"

Then I figure that I'll

approach the SM, and ask permission to talk with the SPL, and then perhaps the PLC

basically explain that I have a problem because of parents doing too much and "confusing the issue"

and ask (or suggest) that in an effort to move more to boy lead (which is something they all SAY that they want), I would like to rely on them

basically, that I want to support the scouts taking their troop back from the adults

• That all forms and payments would come to me from the scribe, or at least from the scout, & not from their parents....
• and that the scribe would be helping the scouts to remember what is needed. (if you owe money, owe a form, etc..) i.e Servant Leadership
• and that I will be willing to work with the scribe to keep the web info up to date regarding stuff received, and that the individual scout could then become more involved with their own destiny in indicating if they plan to attend, being able to look before a meeting to see if they need to bring something, owe money, etc...
• and to see if they want this, or if they have other ideas....

 

I'd offer to connect you with my Troops treasurer, but in that area we are very similar spot to your troop. 

Edited April 6, 2016 by Sentinel947

[blw2 433]

Do you think that your treasurer is making any effort to change more to a model like I describe, or to change in some other direction?

[Sentinel947 1205]

Do you think that your treasurer is making any effort to change more to a model like I describe, or to change in some other direction?

No. I don't think anybody in my troop thought about including the Scribe in with the treasurers duties, including myself.   

 

For me it's pretty outside of my lane. It's something I'd have to bring up to the CC, who has been really supportive of the whole boy led, patrol method stuff. 

[Stosh 3452]

 

another thread, about adult interference, made me think of reviving this thread....

 

The handoff of the treasury stuff hasn't gone so smoothly, well really it's only slow....mostly because they're trying to close out all the stuff currently in the works for a smooth hand-off.... which honestly I think makes lots of sense and I'm thankful for it.

 

Currently, my inside the head voice is screaming at the top off my lungs though, since the money thing is very adult driven and adult handled.  I have already discussed with the CC and the committee that i plan on transitioning a lot of this stuff to the scouts.... they say that they agree and get it, but then again I'm not so sure.  Time will tell.  They agreed, you just need to hold them to it.  "Gee, Guys, I thought you were with me on this one!"

 

Anyway, I've stepped back so as not to meddle things up in the mean time  Nothing wrong with adding, "Yep, that's a good way of doing it." and "Oh?  I guess that would be okay." 

BUT the handoff is coming soon I think, and honestly I'm a bit concerned about how I should best handle the switch.

 

As I mentioned before we have troopwebhost, which has some seemingly great financial tools, but they historically have not had success in getting the troop as a whole to log in and work through it.... so it's currently not being used.  Where's your Troop WebMaster in all this?   If he isn't just "in Name Only" POR, one might want to get him involved and figuring out how to make it work.  He just might like the "Big Boy Pants" job of playing around with the software.  He's probably an inquisitive geek to get the job in the first place. My guess is that the parents wouldn't do it, but I'm wondering if we can get the parents to understand that it's up to their scouts to do it, maybe they'll be a little more inclined for it.  My guess is your guess is correct. 

 

Anyway

I sure do wish I had an experienced treasurer to brainstorm with!

 

Currently, our activity permission slips are collected and used sort of a log of who has paid for the upcoming campout, by notation in the margins (check number, pull form scout accounts, etc..) .... it's a very committee member to parent to committee member thing....

 

Anyway, i see the permission slip as a totally separate job function from treasurer, really more to the outdoor activities chair (if we had one), or maybe the secretary  Nothing says the Scribe works only with the Treasurer, he should have a working relationship with the Secretary and ASM for Advancement as well.

and these things probably should be handled between the scribe, the Patrol Leaders, and the Scout.... who would then approach their own individual parents to get the money, signatures, etc..., then it would climb back up to the scribe, who would work with the outdoor activities committee member for the permission slips

....and work with the treasurer (me) for the money.  Yep, your head is in the right place!  Before ya know it, you'll be having all kinds of scouts ASSOCIATING with the adults on a regular basis.

 

Here's my loose plan.  Tell me your thoughts....

 

I'll start by running things more or less how they have been for a very short time, just to get myself AND SCRIBE more up to speed, give me US  time to get our accounts set up and running in troopwebhost, with help from the WebMaster  etc... and for the appearance that i gave it a shot the "old way" And if nothing more on the part of the boys as observers, they can begin to grasp the idea of what the jobs are going to entail.  They don't need to be DOING anything but LEARNING THE ROPES of what's necessary to get done.

Then I figure that I'll

approach the SM, and ask permission to talk with the SPL, and then perhaps the PLC OR.... You, the Scribe and Webmaster have coffee and cocoa with the SM and share what the three of you have come up with and find out if this is something the SM and SPL and probably all the PL's need to know more about.

basically explain that I have a problem because of parents doing too much and "confusing the issue"  or basically explain how the boys have worked this out to streamline it so that things run a bit less confusing for everyone concerned.

and ask (or suggest) that in an effort to move more to boy lead (which is something they all SAY that they want), I would like to rely on them

basically, that I want to support the scouts taking their troop back from the adults  Or instead be less confrontational and ask what SM thinks about the boys' plan that they have worked out with you, because you are really excited about their ideas.  They have merit and show some promising opportunities for both the adults and boys to share the responsibilities.

• That all forms and payments would come to me from the scribe, or at least from the scout, & not from their parents....  With the emphasis of the boys heavily involved in their own program and taking responsibility for getting the work done.  The first contact should be with the PL and patrol Scribe and then working with the Troop Scribe and you.  That way everyone from PL to Committee Treasurer liasoned by Troop Scribe knows who's paid and who hasn't for an activity.  No more one-on-one "he said, she said" kind of discussions.

• and that the PL with the help of the patrol scribe would be helping the scouts to remember what is needed. (if you owe money, owe a form, etc..) i.e Servant Leadership of the PL taking care of his boys.
• and that I will be willing to work with the Troop Scribe and the Troop WebMaster  AND PLC to keep the web info up to date regarding stuff received, and that the individual scout could then become more involved with their own destiny in indicating if they plan to attend, being able to look before a meeting to see if they need to bring something, owe money, etc...  Maybe the PLC can even coordinate the troop's annual calendar and patrol calendars  into all of this showing due dates for financial obligations, permission slips, etc. all into one coordinated communication effort

• and to see if they want this, or if they have other ideas....

 

 

 

Then when you come to the monthly committee meeting with your report, you can let the committee know all the finances, all the activities and whether or not they are being financially supported, all the equipment needs of the troop/patrols, because you probably will eventually be working with the Troop QM as Treasurer as well.

 

If you can take a lot of this paperwork, finances, communications, off the hands of the SM so all he has to do is work with the boys knowing all this is taken care of by you and your contacts with the boys, I for one as SM would welcome this with open arms. 

 

Eventually your example could also encourage the Advancement committee member to work with the boys on making sure everyone is advancing and keeping tabs on who needs what, etc.  Advancement committee member may need to work with the WebMaster to have the advancement needs posted on the web contact.

 

Maybe your Activity committee member would work with the PLC members coordinating with finances, advancements, and summer camp so the boys get the MB's they want, the advancement they need, and help with the finances that will surely take place.

 

The goal of the program is to associate and coordinate with the adults the boys' needs, wants, and wishes.  The committee members cannot be supportive leaders of the boys unless they are actively associating with them, i.e. making contact and staying in communication with them.  Notice I didn't say anything about guiding, directing, mentoring, etc., just knowing what's going on and being there to help the boys be successful when they ask.

[Krampus 696]

 

Here's my loose plan.  Tell me your thoughts....

 

I'll start by running things more or less how they have been for a very short time, just to get myself more up to speed, give me time to get our accounts set up and running in troopwebhost, etc... and for the appearance that i gave it a shot the "old way"

Then I figure that I'll

approach the SM, and ask permission to talk with the SPL, and then perhaps the PLC

basically explain that I have a problem because of parents doing too much and "confusing the issue"

and ask (or suggest) that in an effort to move more to boy lead (which is something they all SAY that they want), I would like to rely on them

basically, that I want to support the scouts taking their troop back from the adults

• That all forms and payments would come to me from the scribe, or at least from the scout, & not from their parents....
• and that the scribe would be helping the scouts to remember what is needed. (if you owe money, owe a form, etc..) i.e Servant Leadership
• and that I will be willing to work with the scribe to keep the web info up to date regarding stuff received, and that the individual scout could then become more involved with their own destiny in indicating if they plan to attend, being able to look before a meeting to see if they need to bring something, owe money, etc...
• and to see if they want this, or if they have other ideas....

 

 

A few great points. I can tell you what we did when we struggled with the same issues:

• Website & Logins: We put EVERYTHING on the website. The calendar can sync with phones, tablets, etc. Files, forms, rank status, registrations, etc., are all online. Most of our parents have the latest and greatest smart phone, so we tell them that they (and their Scouts) need to check the website for all information. It took a year and you cannot hand hold. A few folks resisted but when Timmy missed a camp out because mom refused to log in and check the website, mom eventually learned.
• Permission Slips: We do one for each event. Scribes collect them from their patrol and turn them in to the event coordinator on the TC...NOT the treasurer. The treasurer sits next to the events person and accepted the checks or confirms if the Scout paid online (we use MyTroop and accept online payments). If there are any issues the Scribe is sent to get the boys who need to clear up stuff (e.g., Timmy turned in a permission slip but no payment).

You process of putting this on the Scout is correct. Just like in school, the teacher assigns the homework to the student, sends reports or notes home to the parents through the student. Since first grade these kids have been given stuff to discuss with mom and dad by adults, why should Scouts be any different?

 

Good luck. It is a long process but once you change it the boys pick it up REAL fast. It is the parents that take longer to train.

[blw2 433]

Hey, thanks guys.  I really appreciate the affirmation that I'm on the right track more or less.

 

Stosh, i especially like some of your edits... really great points

except that some of your suggested track presupposes that I'm working already with the scribe webmaster, etc... to pull together something to present to the PLC, SPL, SM, or whatever...

 

In my thinking, there is a chain authority of sorts, of courtesy if for no other reason.... that I or any adult shouldn't initiate conversation or activity with a scout without at least a nod of approval from the SM....  Not that this is in any way how we are doing things, I still see no reason not to....

for example

I should ask the SM if I can speak with the SPL.... or perhaps describe what i need from the SPL.

The SM would then either a) approve my going around him, or b) relay the message

The SPL would then relay the message to the appropriate folks.... the PLC, an individual PL, the scribe, etc...

 

This line of thinking is based on my desire to not unintentionally derail something the SM may be doing, or that he's about to do... and so that there are no mixed messages that might mess up the SM's "program" (or the SPL's, etc...)

 

But then after I get rolling with teh scribe, etc... I'm seeing it pretty much as you are outlining Stosh

[blw2 433]

Krampus

I'm hoping to quickly get to where you've described too.  We already have the calendar going... unfortunately maintained more or less by an adult though.  I honestly don't know if the scouts have a webmaster at all!  Something I need to find out...

but honestly I've got to say that the webmaster job to me seems like something the scribe should be doing.

 

regardless, I'm hoping very soon to have all of this stuff online, so the scribe can see what needs to be done himself, without my telling him....and the PL can too for that matter.

[Stosh 3452]

@@blw2

 

In no way would I suggest you "bypass" anything in the "chain of command".  For one thing, my "chain of command" is different than most.  I have the PL's at the top of the chain and the adults at the bottom, holding up the foundation of the troop in a supporting position. 

 

While I'm not in favor of adult interference, there is nothing wrong with adult association.  Being the SM is not a one-man-band.  It takes a supportive team of adults (committee) to associate at varying levels in a variety of different roles to make the team work possible.  Each member of the patrol has a job to do, same for the committees.  The CC and SM need to be on the same page when it comes to the Treasurer working with the Scribe, and the Activity Committee person and SPL getting together with the WebMaster to get the annual calendar up on-line doesn't happen in a vacuum either.  The Scribe might be turning in monies to the Treasurer at the beginning of the meeting and then working with the QM on the proposed new equipment he has identified from each of the PL's. 

 

In military and business organizations there are organizational charts to show who's "running the show".  But when the bomber comes under attack from air and ground forces, the pilot does his best to keep the plane in the air with the help of the co-pilot, the bombardier does his best to hit the target, the gunners do their best to ward off the fighters, the radioman does his best to keep in communication with everyone, the navigator does his best to keep them on course, the flight engineer does his best to keep the equipment working.  So.  Who's in charge?     No one.  They are all too busy doing their job to worry about who's in charge.

 

This is the goal I work for in the patrol, in the troop, among the adults, etc.  everyone minds their own business, tends to their own business, work with everyone that needs their expertise and in the end, everyone has played an important part in the success of the activities.  Who's the hero?  the one person who was able to do the most supporting the success of others.

 

Whenever there's an activity available to be done the question is always: "Who wants to take lead on this?"  Never is it asked, "Who want to be in charge of this?"  Big difference.

 

So, then.  If one is going to be the Committee Treasurer of a boy-led program. who is the treasurer accountable to?  Doing what the CC says or working with the QM to make sure the boys have the equipment they are asking for? 

[Krampus 696]

Krampus

I'm hoping to quickly get to where you've described too.  We already have the calendar going... unfortunately maintained more or less by an adult though.  I honestly don't know if the scouts have a webmaster at all!  Something I need to find out...

but honestly I've got to say that the webmaster job to me seems like something the scribe should be doing.

 

regardless, I'm hoping very soon to have all of this stuff online, so the scribe can see what needs to be done himself, without my telling him....and the PL can too for that matter.

 

Some troops have them BUT it is usually in conjunction with an adult; simply from the perspective that you don't want a youth 100% responsible for your unit's "brand" online. We have a youth webmaster but he has junior admin rights. Anything he changes goes in to a queue for review before published online. On our FB page he has a generic account that is not tied to him, but to the unit. We get his parent's approval before he can take the role. Anything he posts must also be approved by the FB admin.

 

Took two years to get to this point but worth it when you get there.

[blw2 433]

Some troops have them BUT it is usually in conjunction with an adult; simply from the perspective that you don't want a youth 100% responsible for your unit's "brand" online. We have a youth webmaster but he has junior admin rights. Anything he changes goes in to a queue for review before published online. On our FB page he has a generic account that is not tied to him, but to the unit. We get his parent's approval before he can take the role. Anything he posts must also be approved by the FB admin.

 

Took two years to get to this point but worth it when you get there.

junior admin rights.... now that's an interesting idea.

don't think troopwebhost has anything like that, but I'm gonna look into it.  Eventually I think it makes sense for the scouts to go about entering and tabulating the information.... not just being the hand-off person.

but having some sort of review/approval process would alleviate a lot of concern (re $$$)

[Beavah 205]

Yah, interestin' thread, @@blw2.

 

There are probably as many ways of handlin' da finance and treasury procedures as there are troops, eh?

 

First rule:  Don't start out rockin' da boat.   The troop has a method and approach it's used to, that folks trust and buy into (at least, I hope it does!  If you're participatin' in a "rescue" that's a different kettle of fish).  Havin' somethin' in place that folks trust is a good thing.  Start with that, figure out how it works, just keep da train on da tracks for 6 months to a year.   That's enough time for yeh to see the good things as well as the bad.  Then make changes gradually, with buy-in.

 

I think if a Star Scout or above can't be trusted with his friends' money or confidential information then there are other things in da troop that need to be fixed before yeh think about youth treasurers.  By and large the boys are at least as sound as da adults that way.  They might make more ordinary sorts of mistakes, and if yeh aren't careful that will set some parents off, but they aren't goin' to be stealin' or squealin'.  Besides, they pretty much know da financial circumstances of their friends anyways.   The embezzlement risks are adults who are experiencin' personal or financial stress, not kids.

 

That havin' been said, nuthin' can start causin' adult dysfunction like messin' up the money.   So yeh have to be very careful about puttin' kids in that line of fire.  Helpin' with online bookkeepin' where you're lookin' over their shoulder seems like a great way to go.   Even moreso if yeh can run any campership stuff separately.   The kids may not mind, but by and large parents don't want other kids or other parents to know that sort of stuff. 

 

In answer to your other questions, I'd say most troops do not do anything with "petty cash".   Checks and check reimbursements I'd say are most common, followed by debit cards.   Adult leaders advancin' funds on their personal credit cards and gettin' reimbursed is also really common, especially in middle/upper-middle class areas.

 

Beavah

[blw2 433]

That pretty much echoes most of the other advice I've gotten.... and how my gut is telling me to go too!

 

As a follow-up to my earlier post about Junior Admin rights

I contacted troopwebhost and asked.  Apparently a new idea that hasn't been asked before, but he did say it was an interesting idea.  The more I think of it, I think it's an outstanding idea for a great tool..... the sandbox / approval process

For all things "paperwork".... such as attendance, money, permission slips, etc....