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"If a person who doesn't recognize the presence of God could benefit from what Scouting offers, is that not worth more than keeping them out?

 

But the opportunity to belong to an organization that values the presence of God and lets you participate with others who feel the same without having to debate or defend your beliefs is one of the benefits scouting offers. What is so unusual about having an organization that is limited to people of like intersts?

 

Try getting to be a police officer if you don't believe in obeying the law. Try to join the army if you wont swear allegiance to defend the country. Try to be Rabbi if you don't embrace the Jewish Faith. See how long you will last in Little League if you don't want to follow the rules. Heck you couldn't join my mom's bridge club if you didn't at least want to learn how to play bridge.

 

Lots of organizations are based on its members sharing interests, beliefs, or characteristics. So is Scouting.

 

 

 

 

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I take no comfort whatsoever in the idea that people are damned to hell for all eternity. It is that exact sort of mentality that made me leave the church a long time ago.

You might not take comfort in this but it is a fact & any church sugar coating this is doing a great disservice to it's members.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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Bob White,

 

It is my understanding that there is still a great deal of debating and defending of beliefs within Scouting (within this forum anyway)regardless of a common value like recognition of God. However, how often do issues like this actually affect real Scouting? When asked, my son told me that religion and beleifs almost never came up. Do Scouts have real concern with the beliefs of other Scouts? Isn't respecting others beliefs a requirement of Scouts as well? You apparently think that no, a non-believer who benefits from Scouting is NOT worth it. In my opinion, positive values are well placed wherever placed they may be.

 

FOG,

 

If I had the time, ambition, funds, knowledge and management skills to do so, maybe I would. However no such organization exists, at least none equal to Scouting.

 

evmori,

 

No, it's not fact. Boy this could get tedious....

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Achilleez,

Yes it is! If one doesn't repent from one's sins then one will spend eternity in hell.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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Ed,

 

 

You said, "If one doesn't repent from one's sins then one will spend eternity in hell."

 

Do you imply that anyone that doesn't believe this or accept this as fact should not be in scouting?

 

SA

 

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"Do Scouts have real concern with the beliefs of other Scouts?"

 

Bad question. What scouts think and what Scouting thinks are not always identical.

 

Scouting thinks that a belief and duty toward God is a key componentent of the program. Do all scouts feel this way? That depends on how well the leaders deliver the program, and as you know from this forum not every leader follows the program. In units that are lead correctly, every scouting ideal is important.

 

To everyone,

What one or more adult leader believes in his personal faith is not relative or reflective of what the BSA stands for. Do not forget that the membership of the BSA is made of many, many, religious beliefs. The BSA is only concerned that the Scout or Scouter have a belief in God and gives service to God. The BSA accepts the fact that those beliefs come in many different forms and allows each to be reverent to God in the manner of their choice and custom.(This message has been edited by Bob White)

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"If I had the time, ambition, funds, knowledge and management skills to do so, maybe I would."

 

So what you're saying is that you really don't want to.

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Do you imply that anyone that doesn't believe this or accept this as fact should not be in scouting?

 

No I am not implying that or anything like that.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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FOG,

 

That's correct. I as an individual don't want to due to a lack of the required traits already listed.

 

evmori,

 

No it isn't!

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BobWhite says:

 

The BSA is only concerned that the Scout or Scouter have a belief in God and gives service to God. The BSA accepts the fact that those beliefs come in many different forms and allows each to be reverent to God in the manner of their choice and custom.

 

Well, most of the time, but not all the time. If your religion happens to believe that God does not want us discriminating against those of his children who happen to be gay, then in fact the BSA does not allow you to be a member and at the same time be reverent to God in the manner of your own choice and custom.

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Achilleez,

So you think you can live a life of sin & still go to heaven?

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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I thought one of the basic tenets of the Christian religion(s) was that man was born in sin, lives a sinful life and yet, yes, may "make it" to heaven because someone in the past "died for our sins." A few stipulations exist, according to what religious doctrine one references, but leading a life free of sin isn't a prerequisite. Thank goodness for me!

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acco40,

I'm not saying one can live a sin-free life. What I as saying is if one continues to sin & never asks for forgiveness for those sins one will go he**.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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NJSC says "If your religion happens to believe that God does not want us discriminating against those of his children who happen to be gay, then in fact the BSA does not allow you to be a member and at the same time be reverent to God in the manner of your own choice and custom."

 

Where does that come from?

 

BSA only prevents the church of this religion to be a Charter Organization since it is incompatible with National policy. It says nothing about the Scout or Scouter who has these beliefs. No one asks me which church I belong to. If they did, I would object as strongly as possible. As long as the scout does his duty to God (personal belief), then he is welcome in BSA.

 

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Ed,

 

I believe as you do. That being said, it is a "fact" for me because I accept it based purely on faith. It can not be proven regardless of how strongly I believe it. The world will never accept your view as "fact" like they will believe something that can be proven empirically. While it may be a fact to YOU, it really is a matter of faith, not fact.

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