Note to Boy Scouters: Your Meetings Look Boring To Cubbers

[Its Me 10]

We visited our fourth troop last night and it was another low in dullness. The previous troop meeting we went to had an old man teaching the aviation merit badge. He lectured and then showed posters. I thought that was dull.

 

Last night we went to a different troop and watched a CPR trianing course. I think a Rotary club meeting would have been more exciting. In a church hall devoid of color, there were no patrol flags, no scout posters, no outdoor stuff anywhere. We heard no patrol yells or troop cheers and saw no presence of troop spirit. No songs, skits or any merry making. Just the business of the night. The kids sat like they were in night school.

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by Its Me)

[Lisabob 13]

UGh! That sounds pretty awful.

 

Ideally, there should be at least two major differences from what you describe. First, a portion of the troop meeting should be dedicated to something fun (usually a game), which is where you'll also see patrol competition/spirit come to the fore. Second, more often than not, the youth - not the adults - should be in charge of skill.

 

Now, youth are not always great teachers and planners. I've seen some pretty awful skill segments presented by youth leaders and also more than a few game segments that didn't work out. So you do have to be patient as they learn from their errors (hopefully), guided (again hopefully!) by the SM and other adult leaders. This is the inefficient side of "boy led" and it can be ugly and even painful to watch. And if things aren't improving over time (not a long time, either) then it is time to start asking some questions of the CC and the SM.

 

The other thing? Some parts of a troop meeting are business - setting a menu, deciding how to arrange patrol sites at the camp, collecting paperwork, etc.. These CAN seem boring to cubs, who are not used to doing the actual work. Most of the time cub den meetings, even webelos, work like this: the adults plan, the adults prepare, the adults direct, the boys just show up and reap the benefit in terms of fun. They have no idea how much work it is behind the scenes.

 

If I were ever to be a webelos DL again, these are two things I'd make sure "my" scouts and their parents understood about differences between cubs and boy scouts, and which I myself did not fully appreciate until close to a year after my son and his den joined the troop (sometimes I'm still working on this!). But, It's Me, you're also right that if cubs view the troop meetings as being "boring," that's no good either and will likely lead many to quit. So troops had better get it right more often than not, as well.

 

 

[tcherven 10]

I had the opposite happen with a troop visit - we happened to hit both of their "Unusual Activity" type nights. No one picked that particular troop, but it was among the favorites of many of the scouts.

 

You're right - Webelos don't know much about planning a meeting. The next time I get to Webelos with son #2, I plan to involve them in some of the planning - I want to take about 15 minutes of a den meeting and take a look at the our next activity, and have them help plan it. Hopefully that will help them when they move to Boy Scouts.

 

My goal would be that over time - they could eventually plan a good portion of a den meeting.

 

Please keep in mind that son #2 is not registered yet - he's in kindergarten.

[Its Me 10]

I sincerely appreciate that lessons need to be taught before activities are under taken. For example, one most know the rules and good practices of canoeing before one actually gets in a canoe.

 

However, after Webelos Readyman, cub scouts summer camps and first aid taught at each rank in Cub scouts, even CPR has been previously taught to my cubbers. It's not new. The instructors did a good job. No complaints there. CPR is a serious issue and needs respect.

 

But that is no excuse to ommit the fun and scout spirit within scouting. More songs. For goodness sakes there isn't enough singing in this world. Jokes, or a opening remark by the scout master. An inspiring quote from a senior patrol leader. Let us yell and cheer. Put a fixture in the room that reminds us of the outdoors such as a bag night count, a totum, anything! Make me want to come and have fun.

 

Boy Scouters where is your passion?

 

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by Its Me)

[Jeffrey H 25]

It's Me,

 

You might get a better response from the Boy Scouters if you took your question to the "Open Discussion" category. I'm not sure how many of them visit the Cub Scout forum to answer your concerns.

 

From what I remember a looooong time ago as a boy scout, every single troop meeting was not exciting. Some were very fun and some were a more boring and business-like as we were looking forward to and getting ready for the many campouts on our calendar (BE PREPARED).

 

The real fun for boy scouts are not the weekly meetings, but the monthly campouts that are planned ahead of time. Cub Scouts, if they camp, only camp a fraction of the amount that Boy Scouts do. That's why there is so much emphasis on FUN MEETINGS at the cub level because that's usually all the Den Leaders have to keep their interest.

[SR540Beaver 116]

Its Me,

 

You were at a Troop meeting.....not a Den meeting. The purpose of each is totally different because they are totally different audiences. Try firing up a song session during a troop meeting and see how well it goes over. You'll most likely be singing a solo. Boy Scouts don't do arts and crafts. They learn skills and make plans for menus, duty rosters and activities for the coming outing.

 

Do Boy Scouts have fun? Sure they do, just not like Cub Scouts.

[Beavah 205]

SR540 beat me to my comment. A wise fellow Beaver as always.

 

Yah, Its Me, adolescent middle schoolers and high school aged young men no longer think that songs and yells are very fun. More like embarrassing or childish. With a certain amount of adult energy and pushin' they will get into it a bit, but only if da songs are more Weird Al than Kumbaya. Patrol names that work are more likely to be "The Farting Cows" (with da appropriate patrol "yell"). But all that's campfire stuff, though, not meetings. Thank goodness, or Pastor John may be wonderin' why exactly he lets the Boy Scouts use the room next to the Ladies Guild.

 

I will agree with you that meetings are the most poorly done things in Boy Scouting most of the time. That's true of cubbing too . It's tough to plan an hour and a half of learning, fun, an jollity week in and week out, that meets the needs of kids age 10-17. Never have I had a lad at Eagle time tell his BOR that meetings were one of the reasons he was a scout. Mostly, the boys honestly confess that meetings kinda suck (to use the kids' vernacular), but they get done what they need to.

 

Outing is what it's about in Boy Scouting.

 

[prairie 10]

If you want fun meetings better call ahead and make sure that night has something fun scheduled.

I heard the flip side of this, troop had been working real hard and had the results to show for it, PLC decided to have a goof off night of card playin and such, Webelo and mom showed up to visit and she blew a gasket cause they were goofin off, nobody could make her understand she had picked the one wrong night.

[Its Me 10]

We sang at woodbadge. A lot. We sing at church. We sing the national athem at sporting events. We sing school fight songs to show spirit. Even saying this, singing was just a part of my overall statement.

 

Are we raising future Rotarians or serving as a fun youth group?

 

I have seen posters on this site state their scouts were doing all sorts of neat things but the neighborhood kids still thumbed their noses at scouts. Could it be that they our weekly meetings snuff a lot of the spirit from other aspects of scouting.

 

I am just surprised at how mondane this troop's meeting was.

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by Its Me)

[Lisabob 13]

Just got back from a blue & gold tonight. We were there to welcome 5 new scouts into our troop (with between 4-9 more coming from other packs). As I watched the night unfold with really excellent hired entertainment and impressive adult-run ceremonies, I thought about this thread. It's true, cub meetings - both pack and den - tend to be more exciting than a lot of troop meetings. This is a factor, if we're honest, in boys quitting scouts shortly after cross over, especially if maybe their first couple of campouts are ah, challenging (read, not the greatest fun for whatever reason). They don't stay long enough to understand that boy scouts is fun, though a different sort of fun. And let's be honest again, most boys who are planning and executing troop meetings cannot compete with some of the extravaganzas that cub meetings can become. If that's the measuring stick, forget it.

 

I think the question is whether the problem that some troops have poorly run meetings? Or is the problem that some cubs have expectations that just don't fit with the troop program.

 

In the case Its Me describes, it could be both (sorry, don't take that wrong - I can't tell for sure from just a post in a forum). It certainly doesn't sound like the troop showed much spark.

 

Its Me, I'm sure you know this. But consider visiting troops in other settings (like during a campout) too, so that your boys will understand where the "fun" in boy scouting is to be found. Oh and about singing. There are some troops in our area that do more singing - at campouts. I don't think I've seen any sing as part of a regular troop meeting. Jokes, laughter, etc., sure, but not singing.

[CubScoutJo 10]

My name is still CubScoutJo, but both my boys are now in Boy Scouts.

 

I always thought it was kind of sad that Boy Scout meetings don't involve more "fun". At least maybe have a patrol do a skit or two. Yeah, yeah, I know some of you will say, "that's cub scout stuff", but the boy scouts do skits at summer camp and they really get into it and also enjoy watching the others perform.

 

Courts of Honor are similarly boring in my sons' troop. No ceremony, just hand out the badge. Yawn. These are the days I miss cub scouts!

 

Jo

 

(This message has been edited by CubScoutJo)

[John-in-KC 311]

Counterpoint:

 

What are we trying to do in Boy Scouts? PREPARE THEM FOR ADULTHOOD.

 

We're supposed to be teaching, through the Methods, that there is a time for play and a time for work.

 

BTW, if CPR is being taught as a skill to be "oriented upon" as in TF-1C 1st aid, I've no problems seeing it taught by boys. If it's being taught for certification, I want the boy (probably 16 or 17 years) to have a CPR trainer card, else I want a true CPR trainer without regard to age doing it.

 

I don't condone the "sit around and listen" troop meeting. Pre-opening and activity segments should keep them busy, and send them home tired. Skill development and business portions of the meeting, Scouts need to learn the sadly essential skill of adulthood: Shut up, be still, and listen.

 

In fact, see Beavah's post up there? It really is kinda sorta ground truth.

 

See how the Troop operates in camp. That's the better place (This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

[resqman 108]

Cub Scouts is NOT Boys Scouts. The maturity level of the boys is different as well as the activities allowed/expected.

 

We visited two troops this fall. One planned a Webelos introduction meeting. They showed dutch oven cooking as a presentation. Some cobbler was cooking while the Boy Scouts demonstrated how to assemble a cobbler. It was put to cook while the other cobbler was served.

 

The other troop just my boy and I visited on a regular meeting night. Meeting opened with a flag ceremony and repeating of the oath, pledge, and law. The older boys taught an astronomy class with overheads, handouts and break out sessions. After that, the boys going on the snow skiing trip that weekend had a break out session to confirm details while the remainder of the troop played a game outdoors. All returned for flag retirement and scoutmaster minute.

 

We also attended two different campouts with two different troops. One was the annual "New Scout Campout" or "First Class First Year Requirements" campout where the older boys ran multiple classroom stations. Knots & Ropes, Knife, Axe & Saw, First Aid, Fire Starting, Map & Compass, 5 mile hike with nature identification, dutch oven & hobo meal cooking, etc. My Webelo 1 was ready to sign up right then.

 

Second troop it was their Webelos Invitational/Thanksgiving campout. It was held at the scout camp. Saturdays activities including half day access to the climbing wall with instruction, half day access to the COPE course, tour of the camp for the Webelos including mess hall, waterfront, shooting range, etc. Sat nite the adults prepared 3 smoked turkeys, two dutch oven turkeys, mashed potatoes, sweet potates, cranberries, dutch oven breads/rolls, green veggies, and dutch oven desserts.

 

Both campouts had campfires with skits. Meals were prepared by patrols. Webelos and Scouts set up troop tents. It was all the things boys want from Boy Scouts. No boring adults yammering on endlessly.

 

I explained to my boys before hand that a Troop meeting is half den meeting and half Pack meeting. Starts out like a Pack meeting with everyone in one room for flag and opening ceremony. It will have a Pack style program or activity with everyone. Then it breaks up into den/patrol meetings. Everyone comes back together for a Pack style closing with CubMaster/ScoutMaster minute, flag retirement and release.

 

My Webelos were getting bored of Cub Scouts. We have an active Pack and I lead an active den. We camped as a Den and I had them participate in partially running their den meetings the last year of Webelos. They were looking for something different from Cub Scouts. Webelos 1s may not be ready for a troop meeting.

[dan 10]

Boy Scouts do not like to sing?

I would say that Boy Scouts who have not been in a troop that sings does not know that most likely they would enjoy singing if they where taught how much fun it can be.

Driving on a High Adventure trip I had 3 17 year old scouts and 3 14 year old scouts in my van. The 17 year olds sang for hours on the drive. After this trip some of the 14 year olds also started singing. The 17 year old taught the younger scouts some fun song and how to have fun with them.

 

Its Me I hope you have some other troops to visit.

Meetings do not have to be boring.

I would join a troop where it seems the scouts where a little out of control than join a troop where it is a class room learning. I know of no boy scout learning that should not be hands on learning.

No patrol flags, yells, sounds like the troop is using the troop method and not the patrol method.

Good Luck. But remember there are no perfect troops out there, try to find ones that a least try to be a boy scout troop.

[local1400 10]

resqman, sounds to me you got a tough choice between two great programs. Flip a coin.