dg98adams

I read over this post and decided to post my opinion.

Discipline?

There's 2 choices:

If someone saw him do it and he admits guilt.

#1 - Send him home for a month of meetings.... or

#2 - Hand him sand paper/paint to make it right.

His choice

If no one saw him actually do it, and NO ONE ELSE admits guilt.

Hand every Scout, other than the Patrol whose box it is,

sand paper/paint for some cheerful service.

Also, I'd like to add a Scout doesn't "fail" any portion of a Merit Badge, rather, they can choose to earn it (complete it) or not" right up until they turn 18.

I think my son probably has 45-47 Merit Badges, and maybe a dozen he started and never got back to.... he's turning 17 this summer. I know there were some badges that spanned 2+ years and multiple Counselors.

If the "plan would be lead a series of presentations" and Create opportunities for Cubs to experience what it would take to earn the religious emblem...." then that's a ticket. This is a "plan" not a fixed goal of earning it.

The family or the pastor of that faith would do he heavy lifting.

You cannot hang a ticket on an activity you don't control.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. i.e. anyone going beyond your "plan" and earning an award.

The religious emblems have a program based on several different faiths. Info is availed from the Scout office in your council.

Hmmm,.. some out of whack things in this one.

IMHO the key to the Webelos program is "Transition"... Cub Scout to Webelos Scout.. to preparing for Boy Scouting. I would further suggest more often than not the parent/WDL/CM/SM don't understand it enough to make it work like it's laid out. Some WDL's concentrate on the awards/AOL so much they loose sight of the Transition process, which should happen from the beginning.

(ever hear about the mom/dad that wants the Webelos Scout to "graduate and cross the bridge" - to nowhere, since he is not planning on transferring on to Boy Scouting? As a UC I see it every year. )

Having been there, as a WDL/CM, and now still an ASM... I have had a pretty good spectrum to draw from to see what works and what doesn't. And I do believe, 1 visit to ANY prospective Boy Scout Troop, doesn't even come close to the idea of "shopping a unit".

I think the Troop my son choose (against my judgement - several years ago), with all the growing pains experienced, is getting it right, or at least getting it better every year. They involve many 1st & 2nd year Webelos (and just not in the Cub Pack from the same CO) in several outings/camp outs/activities during the year.

These activities range from Marching together in the Memorial Day Parade, Troop/Community flag Ceremonies, Camperalls, Webelos Skills weekends (taught by 4-5 Boy Scouts), to weekly Troop meetings.

No single outing/Troop meeting would be enough to evaluate the program by an observer, since the PLC plans it and the Scouts execute it, it's not always polished.

Sure, as Scout leaders we lend a hand, offer guidance and sometimes train the SPL/ASPL on keeping it together.

But I tell you what I would not do:

- Allow a Webelos Dad to grill the SPL on a binder of info... in fact I'd encourage a parent to sit in back (talk quietly to an ASM) and allow your son to discover it on his own....

- Try to be all, to all for Webelos/Parents not ready for Boy Scouting.

- Persuade a Webelos to come to our Troop because we did something outrageous the night they showed up - Boy Scouts vote with their feet - no program - no fun - no camping - no new Scouts - can't keep current Scouts.

The Troop has a 5-10% growth every year, and probably normal attrition after Scouts get to high School age.

A Venturing Crew is available for those still wanting activities without association with younger Boy Scouts and more high-adventure opportunities.

But what I said to a transfer (and his Guardian last night) last night who were interested in coming to the Troop...

- You decide your activity level

- That will decide how much fun you have, how often you camp, and your advancement (if you want to advance).

- Your PL is not going to call you every week and tell you what you missed.... if you want to know, you better get his phone number, Facebook page or email address.

- If you decide to hold a POR (position of responsibility - you and your guardian need to agree to the requirements the PLC set out and be held up to them or be removed).

The Troop presents opportunities, more often than not, too much to do everything but enough that some can do a lot of things if they want.

(This message has been edited by dg98adams)

I agree, if it's something that is on the council site or is in the Council Email, point it out or CC me on it, just don't read it to me in the RT.

I have always said RT needs to be info about events/activities before it is made generally available (3 months+).

I also suggested a RT "A-Team" to visit the Leader Meetings or Pack/Troop meetings on those units that don't come to RT. To put a hand-shake out there and let them know ANYONE can come to RT to learn about upcoming events.

A "A-Team" would be 2-3 Experienced Scouters with a Poster or activity or some handouts... not take over any unit meeting, but do a meet/greet, see our poster/flyer/activity 5-10 min. before hand. Course, I would NOT surprise them, but call first and ask if they are up for it. Keep it light and friendly.

Maybe even include the unit Commissioner, to keep it social.

(This message has been edited by dg98adams)

Been there did that....

When you get the list start with highest amount due (probably popcorn, mail them a (registered??) letter with amount/due. If you get no response, CC it to the council for further directions/collections. No Scout is handed a late bill, and avoid: email or phone calls (too easy to ignore).

For dues/T-Shirts/Campout late fees and the like, I would also send a letter a little less formal.

Non-threatening of course, just a "Please catch up on XXX before the next recharter/Campout/etc", with some contact info if they want to discuss it. This is especially helpful for the non-involved parents.

I know in the unit I serve, if a Scout is behind in fees, and $$ are held for the Scout (some call it "Scout account"), that can be used (keep the CC/SM in the loop). But that info needs follow thru with the Parent somehow.

In the future, no payment=no t-shirt, no campout fee = can't go (use the "Grubmaster has to buy food" excuse).

Last minute registration for Summer Camp after your unit cut-off date = have them do it at the council office - not your problem.

Well, I did find the following statement in the BSA Cub Scout Guide for Ceremonies, if you have to have something "official". But I'm sure I covered it in a similar fashion during my time as BALOO Chair in Campfire Planing.

"No Hazing. All ceremonies should refrain from initiating activities that might be interpreted as hazing. Activities such as branding, tattooing, painting on whiskers, forcing boys to wear ears or tails, or similar, should not be used. Never force a boy to do anything that may cause him discomfort or embarrassment."

Course that's directed at youth..... should we not "be" the example?

Personally, I don't like the "Pie-in-the-face" or the "Cold & Creamy skit" routine, and would feel the say way if it was Chocolate cake (as it's my favorite).

I know some leaders frequently challenge Cub/Troop popcorn sellers to reach a "sell goal" and they will accept a "pie-in-the-face".... but would counter there are other effective incentives with a more positive result that is Scouting-related.

I did Popcorn Kernel way back, and would practically volunteer for any other job now and do.... and NO way would I take a pie for any youth met goal.

I'm a NRA RSO/Rifle Instructor and BSA Archery/BB gun cert.

Prone is a bit low to prop up, but I don't see why not as long as he has good shoulder contact.

Strangely enough, when we had Scouts come back from NOAC, they have taken to wearing the OA sash on their belts.

I think I'm the only OA Brotherhood member in the Troop who took the Troop OA rep aside and showed him the statement in the OA handbook about Sash wear.

He still went with the flow.

Welcome , and been there with a small Troop and seen it grow from 5 to 50 (10+ new Scouts every year).

Strongly endorse the SM concentrating on training the SPL/ASPl for Troop Leadership Training so they can turn around train the other Scout leaders and leverage the PLC.

As SM do not take an active role in the Scout Meetings, other than SM minute at the end.

Also promote Patrol identity, don't combine Patrols on outings just because some of Patrol A did not show up...

I might spend a little time discussing how Webelos is different from the previous ranks..more personal responsibility to the Den Leader, and how this rank will expand the Scout experiences to aid in the Transition process to become Boy Scouts.

Not all Webelos go on to Boy Scouting, but they all deserve the opportunity get exposure to it.

Not to weigh in on the overall topic, but "secure ingredients" would mean IMHO going to the store, using the Meal-Plan ingredient list and picking out items that fit the budget.... this is where sometimes the name-brand is outside of the budget, where a cheaper generic would be fine, or scratch ingredients over a packaged item is almost always is cheaper. It's also an opportunity to scrimp on some items and splurge on others and still meet the budget/food list.

I have taken several such trips with Scouts and had that discussion... especially with Scouts from families with more economic freedom or have never experienced the need to make a choice based on the cash in-hand.

Personally, I say the Scout needs to go to the store and either get the items that fit the food list/budget for the outing, or go to the store and write down items/description/quantity/prices that fit the budget.

The latter would require going over it with finer comb, since nothing is ACTUALLY purchased. Seen that done when we had a 15-Scout New Scout Patrol.

I believe this is a something important to learn.(This message has been edited by dg98adams)

Hate to see a Scout hung out because of an Adult interpretation.... but you have had access to the same Eagle requirement info that the SM does...

Did you not serve in ANY approved POR after getting Life?

No, as the MB councilor, you have the right frame of mind.

Get familiar using "no more, no less" If the requirement says do then they "DO", if it says "Discuss" then they "DISCUSS".

Merit Badges are EARNED, not given away.

CMP = Civilian Marksmanship Program

http://www.odcmp.com/

JoeBob,

Just faxed our CMP affiliate application to the CMP office.

Thanks for the tip!

DG

Check out SportKilt.com for summer light kilt, I ordered a couple McLarn skull wraps from them, Cool site.

DG

We now have 2 NRA rifle instructors/Range Safety officers in the Troop (I am one). We actually have added 3 more Range Safety Officers since.

So, we just did 1 Troop .22 rifle shoot last week at our Camp Range.

30 Scouts switched in/out of 9 lanes all day to go thru ~3000 rounds. We qualified 2 older Scouts, and 4-6 are close.

The majority of the Scouts shot at paper plates with "black dots" marked with a sharpie. If they got the sighting rounds to get close, I switched them over to NRA-A-17 or NRA-TQ-1 targets I found online and printed out.

We still used the "quarter" as I believe my PDF's were a bit off to rely on just the score value for all shots. I just ordered several hundred official targets for the next time so we will be better prepared.

What do you use at the range?

I know during summer camp, Scouts shoot at whatever has not gotten chewed up by mice from the shooting building. The Shooting Sports director uses the "quarter method" on those targets.

My sons book lasted because of the Scout Store material cover, and using a zip lock bag on camp outs. He's almost an Eagle and on the same book.

Getting them wet or just damp will cause them to go bad fast.

(This message has been edited by dg98adams)

New Scout Cross over materials (book, necker, slide, packet of Troop info)

Sending a Scout (or 2) to NYLT

Troop Scout Leader Training Weekend - materials/food/patches

Troop Adult Leader Training (some Troops help pay for ACA, Lifeguard, Paddle Craft, Wood Badge, etc...)

Merit Badge Books

Troop Program Books/manuals/guides

Web Site (if you don't use a free one)

Family Night at Summer Camp (We cook in camp, and parents are invited, they bring a side, but Troop buys meat).

Consumables:

Propane Tank Refills

Charcoal

Lantern Mantles

Rope

COH refridge - we get space for it, but had to buy our own.

Canoe tags/registration

Trailer Tags/registration

Trailer insurance (just theft when not being towed).

Troop Van/maintenance - money pit

Better Scouts than mean have coined:

hunger = best teacher

rainy weather, no raincoat = you get wet

solving your own problems = life lesson

I would be surprised if this incident doesn't come back as a reason to plan for the Scouts involved.

No, I think by "giving in" you are just as lax as the last guy. I would not follow a bad tradition.

You got a couple choices:

1 - Make it known, if a Scouter feels they have EARNED (stress EARNED) a knot, then they need to track their own progress and fill out the knot dates/requirement boxes accordingly. It's possible they have never seen the progress card used. There is a simple PDF form for them... hand them out. Let it be known you will have the Comm. Chair or Advancement Person collect and process the knot cards. Scouts are Trustworthy, so it's "On your Honor". And leave it at that. If Council take's 'em hand 'em out.

2 - Let the CC know you are delegating all knot award processing/awarding to them.

3 - Step aside from the knot awards...

In my personal experience, I UC for a Pack who only the CM had any knots... I followed up on the active leadership and discovered no leader paper work ever followed up as the was gonna the outgoing WDL. She had done all the positions form TL to CC, but never registered beyond CC except when I came on board and got her re-registered as the WDL. She balked when I mentioned she did not qualify for the TL/DL/WDL knots she had asked about since she was never officially registered as that position... I had the council record and showed the Committee... she was not alone only 1 of the 5 would qualify for a knot..

Couple weeks later I saw her at the Scout office buying all the knots for her Troop uniform... she wears 'em too. I guess she felt she deserved them, but the troop she went into had some long term Scouters that I think she wanted to show them off to.

The CM is not the ONLY person who can sign a card, which the council must have to get the knot anyway.

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34169-54.pdf

(This message has been edited by dg98adams)

We (bunch of Unit Commissioner types) we told by the Council that if our primary position was not registered with the District, the database (ScoutNet?) that calculates values for Commissioner-to-Units and Council dash-board statistics would be off.

So now most register with the District or Council in their primary position, then multiple in the units.... but SM aren't used for Unit Commissioners, that I know. I'm one of several District registered and active ASM's in my sons Troop/Crew.

A little late to this show, but as a District Advancement member, and a Merit Badge Councilor myself I certainly have a problem with this Merit Badge Councilor.

If it was my son (and he has seen this 1st hand), you are doing the right thing discussing it with him to see where he stands on it.

As others have said, and rightly so, the Merit Badge Councilor is outside the influence of the SM, but should be accountable to the District and the Scout for "no more no less" when it comes to the Merit Badge.

I would also keep an eye out for any more of the "Troop Merit Badges" that are done this way... and encourage your son to question it respectfully, if he feels they are not covering the requirements as written.

Now that my son (and daughter) are on camp staff, they see from my perspective that working with the requirements as written are how the Merit Badge is EARNED and not GIVEN AWAY..... there's always someone (some times not the Scout) who wants to do less or short-cut the process... and need it explained that's not how it works.

God luck on this effort. and I hope your son's wrist heals so he can EARN his badge (Per Fitness is a hard nut for a new Scout).(This message has been edited by dg98adams)

Only other thing I did when I was CM and worked to get DC for the dens, was also show the DC the Award form if they choose to pursue it beyond the Boy Scout tenure for the Cub Scout year, so they would be aware of what I needed.

I also chatted each DC up a couple times during his tenure and gave feedback back to his SM/SPL.