Scouter99

Serendipity.

 

Eagle Courts of Honor are not a BSA-scripted ceremony; they're whatever you make them and should reflect the things your son values; if that's a druid prayer, that's a druid prayer. If the CO is imposing some kind of rule they have, fine, do it at the closest park and invite the people who aren't morons (less meatballs in your budget, that way, too )

There's no BSA-sanctioned script or anything like that for ECoH's, if you don't want them there, you don't have to have them. If the troop leadership is uncomfortable with that, do it at the park. If he's already earned the badge, it's his, and they can't keep it from him or direct who hands it to him or how.

So someone is wrong about the uniform, the question is whether or not the insignia guide is correct, or if it needs an update.

NJ,

 

Boonie hats are good, BSA even made one briefly. If my fat head could fit in it, the CS version would at the local distributor would be mine. But IMHO, the best all purpose hat is , and I may be committing sacrilege saying it, is the Expedition, aka Brimmed Hat. It's waterproof and crushable. I'm on #2 as the first one was stolen. I've gone through multiple storms, inlcuding hurricanes with them.

 

BUT, I love my SMOKEYS!

99,

 

I do hope that's sarcasm. I am an advocate for training. BUT I do not want to waste people's time either.

 

So I will play Devil's Advocate.

 

I don't think the Eagle Scout whose been to Philmont 3 times needs IOLS.

 

I don't think the Eagle Scout, summer camp staffer, who's prior military and is a Camping, Cooking, Hiking, ad nauseum MBC who's been to WB AND staffed it, hence a 3 beader, needs IOLS.

 

I don't think the Eagle Scout who's been to Brownsea 22, the equivalent of today's NYLT and hence WB, needs outdoor skills training. Especially since BA22 was created by Green Bar Bill, and has a heavier dose of outdoor skills than today's IOLS course.

 

And if national didn't allow local folks to recognize older training,

 

I don't think the 50+ year veteran SM, who went through all the training for the SM Key, is a 3 Beader from the 70s, served on training staff , and still camps on a regular basis with the troop, albeit with a cot instead of on the ground due to age needs to redo training.

 

That's why I am glad testing out is allowed and the district/council training chairs being allowed to recognize older training.

I agree and disagree on your point. I strongly agree that every registered leader needs training in his position, and I believe that regardless of his previous life- or scouting experience. I'm a 20-yr vet who never did This is Scouting, IOLS, etc, but when my council required, I went gladly. Eagle Scout doesn't teach me how to run a troop committee, and not even really how to be a SM or ASM, nor a committee chair or treasurer, etc. Was IOLS silly, yeah, but I also learned things.

As for older guys who've done this or that training in 1970, that's great, but BSA's programs and policies change, and a competent person need not be intimidated by new material.

As for successful corporate, military, outdoors people, that's great and I respect their accomplishments in the military, corporate world, or outdoors--but none of that is Scouting. I've seen many more successful businessmen completely destroy a Boy Scout troop trying to run it like a business team than I have ever seen even an incompetent scouter ruin a troop running it like a scout troop.

I have seen scouts(Boy Scouts) with patches above the right pocket' date=' such as NYLT. They are in the same place as the purple fluer-de-lis is on the left side. Is that allowed or are they putting it there because their Scoutmaster(for some reason) said they could?[/quote']

 

If you see it on scouts from multiple troops who would nonetheless be going to the same NYLT course (since they're all in the same council) I'd figure that some dummy at the course tells them to put it there. If they're all from the same troop, it's probably the SM, and he probably has 27 activity patches hanging on his breast pocket button.

Serendipity.

 

Eagle Courts of Honor are not a BSA-scripted ceremony; they're whatever you make them and should reflect the things your son values; if that's a druid prayer, that's a druid prayer. If the CO is imposing some kind of rule they have, fine, do it at the closest park and invite the people who aren't morons (less meatballs in your budget, that way, too )

You must live in the worst council on the planet, I have to remember to be less rough when replying to you in the future

I'm thinking of using Story of the Boy Scouts by Wyatt Blassingame as a basic primer when I offer this badge; any opinions on the book? I like it because it acknowledges Seton and Beard's pre-BP roots (though it does neglect to even give events' years with those two while meticulously dating BP's actions).

Serendipity.

Eagle Courts of Honor are not a BSA-scripted ceremony; they're whatever you make them and should reflect the things your son values; if that's a druid prayer, that's a druid prayer. If the CO is imposing some kind of rule they have, fine, do it at the closest park and invite the people who aren't morons (less meatballs in your budget, that way, too )

Tim, per your council, Tidewater Council, they require all TOP UNIT LEADERS, and COMMITTEE CHAIRS, to be fully trained for the 2014 charter year. A top unit leader for Venturing is defined as the Crew Advisor. This does not include Crew Associate Advisors, or Committee Members (although having all adult members trained would certainly be a very good thing for the program).

 

To be considered trained for a Venturing Crew, Tidewater Council council requires Venturing Youth Specific Training, and Position Specific Training.

 

Please note that Committee Training can be done online, and there is a different Youth Protection training for Venturing (also online).

 

Personally, I feel that, although it is not required by BSA National, or (apparently) by Tidewater Council, it is a very GOOD thing if the Charter Organization Representative (COR) is trained for their position. Many COR's have no clue what they are responsible (and not responsible) for, and many could care less. When starting a brand new unit it is a good thing to start it out on the right foot with the COR knowing about the program THEY are responsible for.

 

Tidewater has Venturing Specific Training coming up 08/24, and COR training coming up on 10/22.

 

For clarification, and more information, I would contact your District Commissioner (who should be included in the unit formation process anyway), and your District Training Chair.

 

Also, see the following -

 

http://www.tidewaterbsa.com/training/index.html#FULLY_TRAINED

 

http://www.tidewaterbsa.com/training/TrainingPolicyFAQs.pdf

Hello, welcome!

I didn't leave the house yesterday; however, it wouldn't have mattered if I did, because despite seeing several posts on Facebook about World Scout Scarf Day, none of them mentioned what it is, so I wouldn't have worn mine out. And, anyway, it's not a "scarf."

I'm still not sure what you're advocating; you say you're not advocating becoming para-military, but that we should put greater emphasis on military skills. How can we get any closer than what we already are in that regard?

Your historical couch is also off by several decades; Scouting has denied that it's junior military since its first decade of existence, it's BP who popularized the label "peace scouts."

I like some of them.

Why are you punishing the boys because of an issue with your council???

 

If the council does not train it's MB Counselors properly and ensure that the requirements are fulfilled at camp the backlash should be directed at the Council and the Camp Director, not the boy. By holding the boy accountable and doing nothing about the poor quality of MB Counselors at Camp you are only perpetuating they system.

 

I spent many hours with a lad working on the Forestry MB at camp this summer because the camp staff in charge of nature couldn't identify 5 trees, let alone 15 & know their uses! And the kid couldn't identify a tree based off just a wood sample either. That MB is complete only because I spent 6 hours working with the boy. Every kid in the class got a complete even though some of them had field notebooks that contained 5 samples of the SAME Tree. The issue is not the boys slacking off; the issue is that council doesn't hire people with knowledge in the area they are expected to work in.

I think frustration is that everyone who wants to go on a weekend campout with their kid now has to be trained. When we filled out the trip permit for the 50 miler the question were "Do all adults have Youth Protection?" and "Do all adults have Swim Defense & Safety Afloat?" Not everyone wants to be a leader or has time to be leader. I have no problem with BSA requiring training of it's leaders' date=' but we have had parents would have been happy to attend a weekend event change their minds when they realized they would have to put in 2 or 3 hours of training first.[/quote']

 

Less than 2 hours, actually. Anyone that says they don't have 1.5 hours for 3 training modules is either the President of the US or a liar, anyone that won't didn't want to go in the first place.

The part where I lived in a rural area for 2 years and the library had cable. Does the mail run in your rural area? Maybe the service center could mail things to you. The rural area where I lived had mail service, so if yours doesn't I may not understand that part of rural, either.

my 0.02..

I think sewing is an important skill however the results from most boys not interested in sewing should not be on a dress uniform. using a needle and thread for a pack or a tent is one thing insignia that is misaligned and sewn haphazardly while at a consulate discussing world citizenship another.

 

 

I agree with you on pins, Schiff; too difficult with the thick goop plastic backing. Sometimes just getting the needle through is almost impossible.

That reminds me we are about due for a sewing night instruction......I did it a year ago...Need to schedule a refresher course.

 

Conduct uniform inspections......For every lad that has a uniform that is perfect they get an ice cream sandwich, for the patrol with the highest score they get a pizza party in front of the other patrol in patrol corners....... I give a couple of week notice.... Peer pressure is a good thing.....Last time I noticed the patrol leaders doing inspections during patrol corners....Everybody wants the pizza...... In the case of all perfects....I don't mind buying the troop the Ginormica Pizza from the local establishment....9 square feet of pizza.

Posted prematurely...might I ask your interest????? I can send one.....just need to wait for another one to fall off him. Kinda award asking a family to root around their house looking for the Godzilla of bed bugs

My Parent-Leaders wear their parent pins on their uniform with pride, and no one "calls them out" on it. If someone did, they'd be told to "pound sand" loudly and proudly, and I'd back them up as COR.

 

You can call it "improper uniforming" and point to the Insignia Guide all you want, and preach how it's a "bad example for the Scouts" but....

 

How many of your Scouts have a copy of and know the contents of the Insignia Guide? My guess: somewhere near or equal to zero.

 

Our boys wear their rank pins on their lapels! It's just something they started doing---if they're all the same, we think that's OK.

 

Is being picayune about something as small as a parent pin really "a hill worth dying for"?

 

Just Food For Thought.

I'm having a bit of fun poking at your crass defense of an improper practice. I am a dedicated contrarian. If the Scout Law has guided you to drop it, though, I'm happy to oblige.

I'm old school, so not for not for me. I won't wear them because A) not for uniform wear and B) I remember when they were called "Mother's Pins."

 

Now if I ever get a Eagle Scout Dad tie tac, as well as one of the old green uniform ties, I may wear the tie tac with the tie. But again I'm old school and prefer neckers.

You can get the green ties (which I would call old school) on eBay pretty reasonably priced (more reasonable, I think, for a 40-yr-old piece of history than what you pay for even a cheap tie in a dept store nowadays).

I didnt realize the Eagle Rank Pin was so small... that would just look silly on a hat, so I'm stuck with the Universal Hat Pin. Fine. I will somewhat begrudgingly pick mine up today at the local scout store. I'll pass on the leather hat band as I've never been one to stick by the uniform requirements entirely- I've yet to retire my Green Bar Bill-autographed OA Sash and I've worn it with the legend strip since day one. I'm sure that's a forum topic on here somewhere.

My Parent-Leaders wear their parent pins on their uniform with pride, and no one "calls them out" on it. If someone did, they'd be told to "pound sand" loudly and proudly, and I'd back them up as COR.

 

You can call it "improper uniforming" and point to the Insignia Guide all you want, and preach how it's a "bad example for the Scouts" but....

 

How many of your Scouts have a copy of and know the contents of the Insignia Guide? My guess: somewhere near or equal to zero.

 

Our boys wear their rank pins on their lapels! It's just something they started doing---if they're all the same, we think that's OK.

 

Is being picayune about something as small as a parent pin really "a hill worth dying for"?

 

Just Food For Thought.

Why are you punishing the boys because of an issue with your council???

 

If the council does not train it's MB Counselors properly and ensure that the requirements are fulfilled at camp the backlash should be directed at the Council and the Camp Director, not the boy. By holding the boy accountable and doing nothing about the poor quality of MB Counselors at Camp you are only perpetuating they system.

 

I spent many hours with a lad working on the Forestry MB at camp this summer because the camp staff in charge of nature couldn't identify 5 trees, let alone 15 & know their uses! And the kid couldn't identify a tree based off just a wood sample either. That MB is complete only because I spent 6 hours working with the boy. Every kid in the class got a complete even though some of them had field notebooks that contained 5 samples of the SAME Tree. The issue is not the boys slacking off; the issue is that council doesn't hire people with knowledge in the area they are expected to work in.

Ok, so it's still up to you to get the application fee, the voucher is just a sort of notice to the council that money has changed hands?

Uhhhh, bed bugs don't stay in people's hair. If they're that thick, call social services.