WasE61

Actually, Mom has asked if he was interested a couple times now. Received the big "Nope" for both. So it's been dropped.

This is my worst nightmare.

Send him out on a camp and he doesn't come back. I know I'll blame myself if it ever happens.

I imagine his parents are as well.

Assess with your son his making this new group was indeed a message (as Qwazse suggested) to you that Scouting is now a lower priority that perhaps you want it to be.

I would think that switching troops so he could be engaged in two time-consuming activities might be a bit more load that he is wanting, or can handle.

So incredibly sad.

"Send home flyers" by non-school groups have been banned in our school district for as long as my kids have been in school.

The schools maintain a kiosk in the offices, in which flyers from District-approved groups can be placed.

You have to submit the flyer and an application to the District, who then approve or disapprove it before you can put the flyers in the school.

Of course, there is still a big bias for Scouts. Scouts get to use the school facilities for only the cost of the lights and the janitor. ($20/meeting)

Youth sports programs however, cost three times that.

"BSA is not a police force and isn't in the law enforcement business."

...and as such, suspicions and allegations should be immediately turned over to law enforcement, who are the professionals in investigation.

I really wonder if BSA is doing that even now...post-Oregon and post-PSU ... or is it still same-o, same-o?

Let's not forget that these problems are documented back to 1919...it's not like the 80's showed up and suddenly perverts were everywhere.

Maybe this is another reason why my Dad kept me away from Scouting in the '60s, maybe he knew what was going on.

I mean it really doesn't seem odd to me that friends want to stay together...when you split them up, it probably irritated them...so you got bad (or worse) behavior.

It they really are difficult to deal with, putting them in one patrol limits the damage they can do.

Following up on Tampa's, "Folks from the outside are not always going to bring it up to you if they know you are in scouting. Instead they will steer their kids to other groups and activities."

I think that's the case inside as well. I think there is a real tendency for parents to take a, "Well, that's not happening in *my* troop/league/school/church."

I think it's mostly because they don't want to have to admit to themselves that they might be putting their son or daughter in harms way.

I'd be really surprised if any comment were ever made at any Scout meeting or outing.

Of course, that's what the pedophiles are hoping for, isn't it?

Of course had I been my Dad, they only call would have been to the SM's dentist.

He was a far better Dad than I.(This message has been edited by WasE61)

Being the non-Scout, I can respond as a parent.

There are several rules that I have with my kids....

1) Call if there is a problem. Car dies, get sick, etc.

2) Call if you have something you cannot handle. (Friend stoned, etc.)

3) Call if your plans change. (I was going to A, but we decided B.)

Violation of any of these three gets some serious talk time from ole Dad...at best.

I did already have talk about a canoe trip that was supposed to be a near-shore event that ended up traversing a 2-3 mile lake several times, in winter. The SM understood that he and the CO would be talking to CPS and my attorney if they ever pulled a stunt like that again.

I think that an SM purposefully deceiving parents by holding up plan "A" when they know they the are not going to do it shows complete irresponsibility as a leader and disrespect to the parents (and children).

Worse yet would be if the adults and the kids were both in on the deception. In this case the adults would be coercing the kids to lie to their parents. I would be done with such a troop in an instant ... and be barking at the CO and District ...

Parents, not the adult leaders, are ultimately responsible for the safety and health of their children. Adult leaders that subvert that for thrill seeking have no business being around my or any other kid.

I know that some think the attention levied against BSA on this is unjustified, unfair, unwarranted. Just as there are those that think Penn State has been unjustly attacked.

There are also the statistics that say that family members are the largest group of child abusers. Considering ALL forms of child abuse (neglect, physical, sexual, etc.) that is correct.

But regarding JUST sexual abuse, from http://www.apa.org/pi/families/resources/child-sexual-abuse.aspx

=================================

Most children are abused by someone they know and trust.

An estimated 60% of perpetrators of sexual abuse are known to the child but are not family members, e.g., family friends, babysitters, childcare providers, neighbors.

About 30% of perpetrators are family members, e.g., fathers, brothers, uncles, cousins.

Just 10% of perpetrators are strangers to the child.

==================================

The fact that *any* organization the promotes helping youth would hide information or hinder prosecution of sexual abusers is what has people in the uproar.

Only the top brass of BSA know if YPT is having an effect or not. Just because you have a process...it doesn't mean that it works.

For every parent, every activity is a risk vs. benefits calculation. Some parents make those decisions carefully...some less, and there's probably a set that sticks their head in the sand.

I think only 10% of the troop sells it...it's just not well received. Over priced and under quality.

I probably have two boxes of the stuff in the pantry from the last time we sold it 3-4 years ago.

This happens to Girl Scouts all the time when selling cookies....

"GSA is supported by abortions clinics, and I'm pro-life!"

*Door Slam*

(This message has been edited by WasE61)

Beav,

The issue isn't the instructors, it's the parents ignoring the abilities of their kids, allowing them to do activities that they should not be doing at specific ages.

It's all about the thrills...wipe out that bucket list before age 20...if you live that long.

The "wider world" has nothing to do with Ziplines, SCUBA and ATV's.

"Seems like there might have been an equipment issue of some sort, perhaps. In that case, da BSA is quite correct in its motion and cross-claim. They relied on da equipment and expertise of the dive instructor and dive shop, who owed a duty of care to all parties."

Buzz.. BSA is culpable because they accepted the services, paid or unpaid, of the dive instructor and dive shop.

It's like hiring a general contractor...he hires the subcontractors. If the subs screw up, you sue the general contractor and THEY sue the sub. The Scout parents contract is with BSA, not the dive instructor/shop.

(This message has been edited by WasE61)

"At all times a scuba instructor is only seconds away from any scout should assistance be needed. This is why our dive area is clearly marked and the scouts will stay in that area."

Arizona, especially Phoenix, is notorious for backyard drownings...as the annual campaign says, "Two seconds is too long."(This message has been edited by WasE61)

I say it's the parents responsibility to limit what they let their kids do based on the maturity and ability of their children.

Unfortunately some parents these days are far too permissive in allowing their kids to become thrill junkies. SCUBA, ATV's, Zip lines....

If a parent is stupid enough to allow their kids to learn to SCUBA in a murky lake with instructors they don't know and are not present themselves, then they should have a reasonable expectation that their child will be injured or die.

Since the homophobic (albeit incorrect) attitude is that only homosexual men have sex with boys, I would think a homosexual woman would be the perfect adult leader for Boy Scouts, since there are no girls.

Just sayin.

If there's no A/C, indoor plumbing or cable...then it's camping!

LOL

Having had a Scout for the past 6 years, I've learned that I don't expect anything more from him than what I do my non-scout kids.

Age, maturity, responsibility and doing what's right is about parents.

I'll back fill some details...

I think the camping trip was 3-4 weeks prior to the CoH. So there was plenty of time for someone to inform the AC.

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My wife had planned to step down anyway, it's a big load with this troop and she is having to find a job anyway ... this was just icing on the cake that reaffirmed her decision.

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My son is still in the troop...although with Marching Band and three honors courses he is not active so far this school year. Mom is still pushing for Eagle though. (Because G-pa, Uncle, Cousin, Dad, college, career excuses.)

"My first question would be why are the SM and ASM conducting BORs? That is the job of the Committee Chair, and presumably, the "advancement chair" (technically a "troop committee member") would serve on said BORs."

Apparently there (was a/were) committee member(s) at the campout (I don't know which one(s))...so when Scout XYZ asked for a BOR, they said yuuppp. Neither the CC nor the AC were present.

I am sooo happy we're done with the whole AC thing. Tired of taking the heat when the Troop Leaders screw up.

So, at a recent campout, the SM and ASM decide to hold BoR's for various things, including a couple of Life's.

Not surprisingly, no one informs the AC, so at Monday's CoH, a couple of boys and sets of parents are ticked that boys didn't get the award. Tag team flak attacks occur after CoH.

AC (read: My Wife) has been in a sour mood since...of which only *I* get the brunt of.

Thanks SM's and ASM's!

Truly glad that wife has stepped down...

Since you *aren't* the CM, expect parents to pull kids if you try to go off on this tangent.

It sounds like uniforming is not a priority to the Pack.

Just sayin.

Thank you for your service to our country, BTW.

Nice piece, although I'm sure there were plenty of other non-scouts out there doing the same thing because its the right thing to do...and not getting service hour credit for it.