WAKWIB

Eagledad, Your earthquakes got quite a bit of press up here in Kansas City. People reported feeling the tremors in our area, particularly the Saturday night event.

Just for kicks, I went to the BeAScout.org site, typed in my zip code and saw a list of 20 Packs. About 7 of these were chartered to a "Friends of..." or "Parents of..." type organization. I was a bit surprised, really. I guess it is more of a trend than I thought.

For my two-cents, I think I would prefer a more stable, traditional type of CO. Also a CO that is willing to charter both a Pack and Troop as this should provide good program continuity for the benefit of the youth served.

When one of the most notable "public faces" on the discussion of climate change is Al Gore, it's easy to see why the topic suffers from a public relations problem. As Beavah points out, there really seems to be a lack of good mainstream scientific journalism. Maybe I just don't dig deep enough, or maybe I've gone past the point of caring because the topic has been so politicized my trust factor of the information stream has shut down.

None of the celebrity/politico types who preach the end-of-the-world via climate change seem to be radically altering their lifestyle. In turn, I feel no strong compulsion to fear this boogey-man either.

The "old" abuse cases will continue to resurface and BSA will continue to spend all the popcorn money defending ourselves in court. Too little, to late. The chickens have come home to roost.

YPT for adults is excellent, but what about YPT for the Scouts.

Molestation seldom occurs at a meeting or campout. It's more often off-site with one-on-one contact that has often be approved by the parents.

Kids NEED to be trained how to recognize this stuff before they find themselves at the point of no return.

Sadly, showing the YPT videos to our Scouts is not done with much frequency. The leaders are not comfortable with it. They would rather sweep the notion under the rug. Not much has changed since the days of the "old" cases in that respect.

I can only hope the when the stuff hits the fan, Councils really follow-up and treat it as a serious legal issue in the present instead of trying to do damage control and let others deal with it in future decades. And I would hope that BSA would place a far greater emphasis on training our youth to be prepared to recognize, resist and report abuse.

GAWD!...it has been an overworked topic, hasn't it. I think there has been some thread about it going on these forums since I joined in 2003. It's not just a controversial topic, it's a flippin' obsession!

Now, should I click on that banner ad for Brokeback Mountain Dude Ranch or not??

I think the whole "lasting value" thing will take a good long while to shake from the heads of Scouters in my part of the woods. The DAC seems pretty hung-up on building materials, tools, and hardware. I know of only one exception of a project that didn't require a blueprint and construction crew. The Scout did an amazing job of research and preparation and sold his project like a pro. I saw his write-up, but was still amazed that it was approved simply because of the "built" mentality. I'm glad he broke the mold, but I'm still not convinced that the DAC is very open-minded overall.

What a tragedy. I think that the synthetic stuff has been banned pretty much nationwide by now, or is in the process. It was made illegal here in Missouri in August. Too late for this poor kid and his family.

Just an FYI, as we move forward in the on-going issue of "gay-rights vs. BSA discrimination" we will eventually encounter the entire LGBTQ spectrum of stuff. I doesn't simply end with the occasional homosexual male wanting to be a Scout/Scout Leader. So, if tomorrow National says "Gay is OK" that really will not be the end of the ride.

I knew there was something odd about that trip to the ER when I was 12. That lady nurse....well, she did have a really deep voice and sailor tattoos. It's all clear to me now. I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body!!!!

I knew there was something odd about that trip to the ER when I was 12. That lady nurse....well, she did have a really deep voice and sailor tattoos. It's all clear to me now. I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body!!!!

Well, for me, many moons will come and go before I see grandchildren.

For my two-cents:

In some ways the Scouting program seems a bit better than in the days of my youth in terms of opportunities and equipment. Kids do "high-adventure" stuff almost as a routine. Back in the day, Philmont was the place to go for that, and it seemed like a major undertaking to get there. That's just one example.

Kids like the outdoors but seem to need a key activity to get them there. My Boy Scout campouts were little more than pitching a tent and cooking over a fire, exploring the same woods every month, maybe a game of capture-the-flag. Unless it was a Camporee, or summer camp, we had (by today's standards) a fairly boring routine. Now, there are a lot of opportunities for fishing, shooting, caving, canoeing, cope-course,cycling trips,etc...all of which the troop I serve has done in the last couple of years.

With the current economic climate troops may have to revert a bit to Scouting that those of us in the 50+ age group did. The same econ. realities will definitely alter the professional structure of the organization. And, I expect, in a scramble to keep membership numbers up, many things could change in how National sells the program....and a few things will be good, but I think most will just look like an attempt to please the masses (however you want to spin that!)

Scouting at a local level does seem to replicate itself from past experiences and tradition. Those who were in the program as boys, want the same experience or better for their kids. That is a plus. "Tradition" and continuity is a huge factor in our council, anyway. I know dozens of men in leadership at district and council volunteer positions who drive our program from a platform of "I had a great time as a Scout, and I want to keep it going strong!" We still have a lot of volunteers in it for the long-haul, but as Eamonn noted, that may change with the next generation which in my opinion would be the biggest change-agent and we could likely end up with the type of program SeattlePioneer describes!!

Calico,

I really like your take on that. Honestly, it would be great if we actually did invite more "regular" citizens to take part in EBOR's. Folks outside the program hear about Eagle Scouts. They know they do a lot of camping and service project stuff, but do they really get to meet many face to face fresh from the field, so to speak? I would love for more nonScouters to see the kind of young men I've met and learn from them what they have received and given to the program.

Was this what you were looking for?

http://www.scouting.org/training/youth/dencheftraining.aspx

I didn't look it over yet, so no clue as to it's usefulness.

Looks great. Hopefully it will be well used and helpful in keeping Boards of Review on task.

Yep, God ordered the Israelites to do some very rough things to the Canaanites who were disobedient to Him. Later in the Old Testament, He turns and does much of same treatment to the wayward Israelites. And so it goes. Contrary to popular opinion, the God of the Bible is not a cosmic good fairy. But, we are going off topic and I would suggest a new thread if folks wish to discuss the Bible, etc.

fred8033: Topics frequently worked on these forums to the point that they appear like an obsession? Yes. A systematic political agenda? No.

Like all internet discussion boards, our Issues and Politics section is a safe place for folks to rant and rave about stuff. I mentioned in another thread that the BSA homosexual policy doesn't, in my experience at least, get a lot of discussion in real life conversation. I suppose that folks feel more freedom to discuss such things in a forum like this, and I would bet that very few of the folks here have personally taken up the issue with National.

It is a foregone conclusion that there has been a quite a cultural change in America over the last 40 years, and most of the forum members are good Scouters trying to understand how it all, one way or the other, affects a program that we invest a lot of time in.

Moosetracker sez:Which does show the bible does have a statement against homosexuality.. Well here is the original law for that citation... "Which is that there is no penalty for men who have sexual relations with boys under the age of nine years and one day.".. So if the biblical beliefs have been fine for all for many a century as Seattle claims.. We should re-establish the law as it was implied.. Or accept that beliefs in morality have changed over time, the more enlightened we become..

The part of the above statement that is in quotes seems to imply that the Mosaic law permitted sex with boys under the age of nine.??? Maybe I am misunderstanding the statement.

Following MomToEli's point, I would think it should be your Committee Chair's job to deal with applications, recharter, etc. As a Cubmaster your job is program for the Pack, period.

The business of the DE is pretty much that of a glorified customer service rep., and what they do should be fairly transparent to you as the Cub/Scout Master.

The District committee bunch may have a little more impact on your job from time-to-time, but you can pretty much pick and choose your battles with them as well.

Perhaps you don't have a good Pack committee to help carry the load with some of this stuff, and if that's the case, I totally get your frustration level.

I think the negative impact of this policy on recruitment has been continually and constantly exaggerated on this forum. I'm sure, like the original post, there are some examples, but a ripple is not a tidal wave. In my 11 years as an adult Scouter, this forum is the only place I have heard this subject of the ongoing crises of National's policy killing the Scouting movement come up(over,and over, and over, and...). Never in formal scouter meetings, never among our troop leaders, never in private bull sessions with the many scouters I know in the area, never in conversations with non scouting folks. That may seem odd to some of you, and...really, I don't live under a rock!

I'm not really sure why Scouting needs to be throwing money into the public school system anyway. Fifty-Five Grand could fix up a camp facility or program, or help a lot a poor kids go to camp.

I've seen some crazy stuff done. I worked at a Scout Camp for 6 summers, and we did a lot to break the monotony and to make the campers laugh.

Scoutfish, so far this takes first place on the list.

Now, if your Committee Chair made you do this, we might have to call it hazing!!

And if you did it more than once a year, we might have to call the police!!

LeCastor

Folks who criticize OA ceremonies as being un-christian must first understand that they are a highly symbolic,and completely theatrical presentation designed to inspire service in the context of Scouting. They are not designed to impart scriptural truth as such, nor do they suggest allegiance to a particular deity or religion.

Now, as a Christian one needs to avoid the notion that service alone puts you in a right standing with God or His Son Jesus Christ as far as that right standing is communicated in Scripture. That's very clear in your Lutheran Confessions and in the faith statements of many other Christian groups: that is, salvation is only by grace alone and through faith in Christ and his atoning work.

As SR540Beaver points out, there are some believers more interested in finding demons than in proclaiming the Gospel.

BP-

Our latest SE, Kendrick Miller, started in February and came to us as a former Deputy Director of the Central Region. He is now top-dog in the Heart of America Council (Kansas City metro area).

As blade said, there is a bit of trying to compare apples with watermelons going on between two adults. Sounds more like sibling squabbling than informed adult conversation, as well.

How can Mr.Woodbadge say he's never seen the OA do anything and somehow holds the Vigil Honor degree???? That's one of the oddest statements I've ever heard.

My two cents: I think that a good OA lodge offers a lot of leadership training and opportunities for youth. I have not taken the Wood Badge course. Back when I was a scout and young adult circa 1970's-1980's, WB was highly acclaimed in the Scouting community. I don't recall ever hearing a negative comment about it. It's "graduates" were looked up to and seemed to walk-the-talk. Currently, I have heard good things about it from folks I've talked to in person. On this forum is where I've heard mostly comments of luke-warm like, to utter distaste, with a few enthusiastic supporters.

Well, some.

There has been a well known flight to other Presbyterian organizations for those who haven't changed their mind.

The article references that this migration is what turned the tide in the voting in one particular group.

"The Presbyterian News Service estimates that approximately 100 congregations have left the Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.) in the last five years. Several were large congregations, which could help explain why the vote in some presbyteries switched from 2009."

It may still be too early in the game to predict exactly how an openly gay clergy effects a denomination. Perhaps in a decade or so. My bet is that those denominations will continue to experience a decline in membership. There has been a large exodus from many mainline denominations for years for a variety of reasons. This step, IMHO, doesn't do much to help that decline.