vol_scouter

Our council approved the proscribed amount and we approved where the money would be raised (some from property and some from council accounts). To my knowledge, there was no final agreement to sign. So our board did not approve the deal but did commit to the requested amount. To my knowledge, nothing else was done. Once again, I am not on the inside of all these issues but it seems reasonable to me that boards will approve the final deal that has not yet been approved. The councils and national council have agreed to the amount.

Just speculation, the National Executive Board (NEB) may have authorized the National Executive Committee (NEC) to authorize an amount up to some limit, perhaps the NEB authorized the Key-3 (CSE, Chair of the NEC/NEB, and the National Commissioner) to authorize up to some amount, or other possible similar scenarios. The NEB could have approved it in a general sense but is awaiting the final wording to approve everything.

In the end of a hearing? Wait until tomorrow.

Is the hearing over?

We are both adults. I am inside the specified age range but my son is not.

I believe that some were contacted and most made aware by commercials. Have no idea how our contact information was obtained or by whom (aggregators or BSA representatives).

My son and I, both Eagles, were both solicited to file suits though neither had claims. The court required the BSA to show that 95% of all men from some age (I think 50 or 55) and older were made aware of the bankruptcy to be able to file by the 16 November 2020 last day to file. They hired a firm to certify to the court that the goal was reached. I do not recall by whom we were contacted.

They were not. Some people were felt to mismanage unit, district, or council funds. There are other categories that I do not recall.

Because that was what was ordered to be released by the court. The BSA did not release information about others in the Ineligible Volunteer Files (IVF). There are many in the IVF that had nothing to do with child sexual abuse.

@CynicalScouter Thank You!!!

@CynicalScouter Might the scheduling indicate that the expectation is that RSA will be acceptable to everyone but perhaps the insurance companies and maybe the CO's? Or do you think that it is just providing the only available time? Obviously, I am hopeful that this will soon move to voting and that it will be over this year.

Yes. As far as privacy, I am terribly concerned. Also, would expect that chronophiles will soon find this out and get Android phones where they can more likely remove any such programs.

Just saw this that could impact Youth Protection in the future for children everywhere: Apple plans to scan U.S. iPhones for child abuse imagery - FT (msn.com)

The next four paragraphs are copied from Wikipedia today: "Pedophilia is a psychiatric disorder in which an adult or older adolescent experiences a primary or exclusive sexual attraction to prepubescent children. Although girls typically begin the process of puberty at age 10 or 11, and boys at age 11 or 12, criteria for pedophilia extend the cut-off point for prepubescence to age 13." "Hebephilia is the strong, persistent sexual interest by adults in pubescent children who are in early adolescence, typically ages 11–14 and showing Tanner stages 2 to 3 of physical development. It differs from pedophilia, and from ephebophilia." "Ephebophilia is the primary sexual interest in mid-to-late adolescents, generally ages 15 to 19. The term was originally used in the late 19th to mid-20th century. It is one of a number of sexual preferences across age groups subsumed under the technical term chronophilia." "The term chronophilia was used by John Money to describe a form of paraphilia in which an individual experiences sexual attraction limited to individuals of particular age ranges. The term has not been widely adopted by sexologists, who instead use terms that refer to the specific age range in question. An arguable historical precursor was Richard von Krafft-Ebing's concept of "age fetishism"." Pedophilia has essentially a 100% recidivism rate. All disorders are serious psychological disorders but I would encourage not lumping all abusers as pedophiles. That should be reserved for people who abuse children before they possess secondary sex characteristics. They are particularly disturbed and it can be argued that they should not ever be released due to the very high recidivism rate.

The representatives of the various religious organizations were likely involved on the CO’s national level but not someone who is a direct decision maker in this process. They likely shared what we see here, that the CO’s are in general still supportive of Scouting though contractual relationships might change. Decision makers and attorneys were not likely present though I could imagine that there might have been a scripted update via zoom. The CO’s are not going to discuss deliberations, discoverable evidence, plans, negotiations, etc in what is essentially a public forum.

@CynicalScouter, Thank you! This helps a lot. Just being informed about the origin and use of the rules is very helpful. We might need more specific information later but this will likely satisfy my needs. Thank you again.

@CynicalScouter, Would you mind educating the non-legal folks about Rules? There are several of these rules being mentioned. Is there a set of rules numbered from 1 to some large number or does it refer to the year? Are these rules for bankruptcy more or less universal or somehow related to just this case. It would be nice to have a short synopsis if you have the time and energy. Thank you for the translation services that you have provided thus far. It has made the proceedings more understandable.

The BSA cannot survive more than a few months (few being poorly defined). It would have to file Chapter 7 and the local councils would soon follow suit. The legal system is badly broken.

In conversations with two different local Scout Executives (SE) many years apart, this is a misunderstood situation. I believe that mrjohns2 is correct that Chartered Organization Representatives (COR) may ask and will be added to the District Committee. Not certain about this though. As to the Local Council Executive Board (CEB), being the COR or Institutional Head (IH) which is the CEO of the Chartered Organization (CO) that for a church is usually the pastor, senior minister, priest, or other descriptive term for the chief religious officer and CEO of the church does not allow one to become a voting member of the CEB. It does allow them to attend CEB meetings but not vote. Being a COR or IH allows one to ask to be nominated for the CEB but does not guarantee that they will be nominated and confirmed. However, if a CO wishes the IH or COR to be on the CEB, it is highly likely that they will be nominated and confirmed at the next election that is typically in January every year. There are very good reasons why just being an IH or COR does not grant CEB membership. States have laws that govern non-profit organizations that usually require some sort of quorum to hold a meeting. If all CO's could assign a voting member, it would be unlikely that the CEB would ever have a quorum to conduct business. The CEB has a smaller subgroup called the Council Executive Committee (CEC) that is the officers and standing committee chairs. The CEC makes proposals to the CEB as to actions to be taken. Usually, the recommendations of the CEC are passed by the CEB [since I first joined my council's CEB in 1994 there has never been a time that the CEC recommendations were not approved though there have been times where there was considerable discussion]. Being a IH or COR who wishes to serve on the CEB will likely be asked to do so but selection of the CEC is more difficult to secure as business leaders are often selected for many of the positions and active volunteers for roles that are best served by active volunteers (Camping committee as an example). Ideally, the CEC reflects sound business decisions and seeks to best serve the council's youth. The National Executive Board (NEB) and National Executive Committee (NEC) reflects the local councils. Typically, the NEB and NEC have representatives that also reflect the interests of the organizations with large numbers of CO's (United Methodist Church, Catholic Church, etc and formerly the LDS). Like all systems, it does not always work as desired but it was devised to represent the volunteers, CO's, and community. Most have a second hand story of it not working well and some have first hand experiences but I have generally witnessed it working rather well when I had all aspects of an issue. It seems that the relationship of the CO's, LC's, and BSA are evolving. Remember that there were good reasons why things are done in the current manner. Changing it may solve some problems but will likely introduce news ones. If the CO's were to take a large interest in the units whom they charter and seek membership on the CEB where they would attend all or nearly all CEB meetings, I feel that it would be to the benefit of all. It remains to be seen that if the CO agreement is only to provide space as to whether it would be so easy to become a member of the CEB.

SilverPalm, Thank you for your post. It expresses my thoughts far better than I would have been able to express. You have captured what so many of us feel. For the US, one needs to make about $500,000 to be in the top 1% of wage earners {How to Be in the Richest 1% Around the World - Bloomberg}. Some of the attorneys appear to be far above that amount.

Just a note, the BSA and Scouting in Great Britain were both founded in 1910 so the claim in 1905 cannot be correct.

I presented the peer reviewed study by Shakeshaft in 2004 of schoolchildren in the USA that was used in at least one official USA government report. There are issues of comparing what has been Jorge a male organization to a coed study. I believe that the rates of abuse difference between males and females is not an order of magnitude whereas the difference between Scouting and the schools is two orders of magnitude. So one is probably safe to say that Scouting is an order of magnitude to maybe two orders of magnitude safer than the schools. This does not absolve the BSA from the harm done but it does put it into perspective.

Yes, both sides could be very close to a mediated settlement and this is signaling that the BSA will deliver on certain things or both sides could be far apart and this is positioning for the next phase in this Chapter 11. While all of us would hope that this is heading to a resolution soon, the second possibility is the more likely the case. The contention on this forum is likely partly due to from our point of view, there has been nearly nothing decided and it seems to proceed with little changing except pointing fingers at one another and some polite name calling. We want some things decided. Perhaps that will happen today.

Most pedophiles and ephebophiles have no prior record as they often get long prison sentences and they are screened out. You defined the problem. Although as another poster said, youth on youth is now the larger problem as youth protection has curbed much of the adult on youth problems.

The statistics from Shakeshaft's paper included coaches who were major offenders. No level of child abuse is acceptable, but what is the standard that society is setting? It seems for the schools that it is 9.6% because there has not been a hue and cry since this was reported in 2004. No outcry, no congressional hearings, some lawsuits, little media attention. Wonder why? Once again, this is not an apology for the BSA but rather a question about the attention paid to the BSA when a worse as in higher incidence and far higher prevalence (from , https://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2019/school-enrollment.html, Census Bureau Reports Nearly 77 Million Students Enrolled in U.S. Schools, "DEC. 3, 2019 — The number of people enrolled in school in the United States reached 76.8 million in 2018 according to the U.S. Census Bureau.") which means if the same rates apply, over 7 million school children have been abused. One more time for CynicalScouter, this is not an apology for the BSA but trying to say where does this fit into organizations that have abuse problems.