Cleveland Rocks

The Supply Division does "Made To Measure" uniform shirts and pants.  They used to have a web page that described it but now that they've redesigned their site it looks like you have to just call them at 1-800-323-0736 for the details.

I believe it's where you measure or have a tailor measure you at various points, and then they make your apparel to those measurements.

I've never had to use them but I know people who have and they've had great success with it and been pleased with the results.  From what they've said the price is only a couple of dollars more than the off-the-rack sizes.

https://www.scoutshop.org/size-charts

Circle up, Scoutmaster's Minute, the squeeze, and dismissal.  We've done Roses, Thorns and Buds a few times, too, but not always.

16 hours ago, ScottishNaomi said:

I'm not sure if you misunderstood me or I'm reading the replies wrong but I would like to say that my daughter does TAKE her jacket to the camps, it's just that she tends to leave it in her tent. 

Anyway, I can not get my Ford Focus to start so it's not a good start to our easter weekend :(. 

It's pretty simple. If she takes her jacket but keeps it in the tent, then when the time comes that she's sitting around the campfire and starts to get cold, she will either (a) shiver, or (b) go back to her tent to retrieve her jacket. She's not going to turn into a popsicle; if she starts getting cold she will figure out a way to get warm.

Sometimes you have to let kids "fail" to learn the lesson. What's better: hovering over a kid because you're worried they might be cold without a jacket, or letting them get cold and learning the lesson that, "hey, maybe I oughta go grab that jacket out of my tent because it's getting cold sitting here by the campfire."

We all make choices. Those choices have consequences, some good, some not-so-good, and we sometimes have to let the kids learn those consequences on their own. Sometimes a gentle nudge from a leader--not you--of, "do you really think it's a good idea to be out here without a jacket on?" will be all that is needed; other times you have to let them learn on their own.

4 hours ago, RebekahTN said:

Council, at least in our area, does NOT get all of the cookie money. The split is very similar to the popcorn. We just earned just under 3000.00 selling cookies this year (18 girls selling).

Not sure which Tennessee council is yours, but the profit breakdown for GS Heart of the South Council, according to their website, shows that for every $4 box of cookies sold, the baker gets $1.03 (25.75%), the troop gets 59 cents (14.75%) and the rest goes to the council ($2.38, or 59.5%).

That's the same breakdown for our council, as well as the other GS councils in Ohio, although troops can earn an additional 3 cents/box in our council if they forego the tchotchke prizes. And in our council, the extra dollar they charge for the S'Mores and ToffeeTastic cookies goes almost entirely to the council. The baker still gets their $1.03 on those $5 cookies, and the amount to the troop goes from 59 cents to 65 cents. The council's portion goes from $2.38 to $3.32.

The other two councils in Tennessee do not publish their cost breakdowns online like GSHOS does so I cannot say how they do their cost breakdowns.

The popcorn breakdowns I've always seen have it roughly a third to the popcorn maker, a third to the council, and a third to the troop. There are some variations, and some councils have been experimenting with plans where the troop gets up to 50% profit (but with a limited selection), but for the most part I think you'll see third-third-third.

32 minutes ago, EmberMike said:

Do they even license their brand out to 3rd party vendors at all?

The BSA has over 120 licensees, everything from the embroidered emblems, logos, and activity shirt (I refuse to call them class B uniforms) vendors, to other areas, like knives, model trains, coins, cookware, scrapbooking supplies, jewelry, even licensed cremation urns.

A person from National I spoke to at the last Jamboree said the licensing division takes in a couple million a year in licensing fees.

9 hours ago, HelpfulTracks said:

So I assume he is referring to the WSJ in 2019. Depending when in 2019 BSA4G starts, there will likely be enough time for them to earn First Class and get registered.

The World Jamboree does not have a rank requirement to attend, only age. WOSM calls the shots on eligibility requirements for participants, not the BSA.

I think there are a number of reasons for the Merit Badge program the way it is today.

The first is the expectations of today's parents--whether it's right or wrong--that when their son goes to Summer Camp, it's now expected that they come back having earned something. It's no longer enough that they got to go swimming, take hikes, shoot guns, climb rocks, spend time with their friends, etc. You have to have EARNED something. I have had many parents show disappointment if their son comes back from camp and he's only earned one or two merit badges, or he only got a couple of requirements towards ranks completed. If you explain that advancement is only part of the reason you do what you do at camp, they just respond that for all the money they're paying, "he'd better have something to show for it!"  I know it's misguided, but that's how today's parents think.

Camps themselves play a part of it. The council-run camps near me almost have a competition to see which camp offers the most merit badges.  One camp advertises that they offer over 100 merit badges. Another offers 75. Our camp, responding to criticism that many older Scouts are opting to not attend after 4+ years (because they've earned all the merit badges they offer), are upping their game and offering new badges to keep up with the Joneses. Some camps are also putting on "Pre-requisite sessions" in the months and weeks leading up to Summer Camp, to allow Scouts to earn merit badges with time requirements, many of them Eagle-required (Cooking, Personal Management, Personal Fitness, to name a few).

You also get merit badge sessions being offered because it's good PR for companies and organizations to offer these badges. Science centers across the country offer science-related merit badge sessions on weekends. The metroparks near me offer the nature-related badges at various times throughout the year. Museums will offer merit badges that pertain to the type of museum they are. The zoo near me offers Veterinary Science as part of an overnight session. And they all offer sessions for Cub Scouts to earn rank requirements. In all of these examples, they work with the local councils to get staff members certified as MB counselors.  Some programs are better than others, but the ones I have attended with my son have generally been good.  The counselors have made sure the Scouts did the work. If there were prerequisites, they Scouts knew what to do ahead of time. If it wasn't done, they got a partial, where they could make an appointment with the counselor to come back at a later time and complete the missing requirements, or schedule with another counselor to finish up what's missing. Years ago, the local plumber's union offered Plumbing Merit Badge to Scouts from our troop. I think it was the best one I've ever been to.  The Scouts had a ball. They got to meet at the union hall which is the training center for new plumbers to learn the craft. The Scouts did all of the requirements and then some, and to top it all, each came away with about $100 in free stuff from the plumber's union, including first aid kits, safety glasses, safety gloves, etc.

In all the cases, those organizations do it because it's good PR, but let's not forget that it's also a easy revenue stream for them. 10-20 Scouts paying $15 to do a merit badge at a science center, museum, park, or zoo is easy money for that organization, and word of mouth helps spread the word if it was a good session.

But I think one of the big reasons that merit badge universities and Troop counselors have become so popular is the dismal state of the merit badge counselor program in many councils and districts. We are fortunate in my council to have a very vigilant program, where our council registrar does an excellent job maintaining the program for our council. Counselors must register annually by the specified date; miss it, and you're off the list and have to do the whole application process over if you want to get back on the list. Those MBs that require additional certification (scuba, shooting sports, etc.) must turn in that paperwork annually. The list is distributed 4 times a year to Scoutmasters and Committee Chairmen, password-protected on the council's website. When we turn in advancement reports we also have to turn in a list with the names of the counselors used for the merit badges we're recording (I know that's not required but no one has ever questioned it in our council). I know that in many councils and districts, they could only hope for such diligence, and I think that's why a lot of troops just begin using their own lists and only sharing that list with their Scouts. If you can't easily find counselors they way you're supposed to, troops will do what they need to do to get counselors. And let's be honest--if you're a Scout and you have the choice of calling up a stranger to ask them to work on a merit badge with you, or just showing up for a day at a merit badge university session, which are you going to choose?

Until there is a concerted push to get the program brought back to what it used to be, I think things like this will continue.

As each of you that has had to order a unit flag the main cost is dependent on the number of letters that are included on the flag.  Flag has to have Unit type which would be Troop  number, City, State and Charter organization name.  The least number that our unit could have on a flag is 22 letters and that would be with listing the Charter org as FFBC in stead of the full name.  At the end of the meeting while the SM had stepped out of the room I was asked by the group to make sure that the flag was not ordered by the SM.  These same parents had already ordered and paid for a Troop Flag.  New flag will have Charter Org full name and complete Council district name which did not have to be included on a unit flag for a total of 64 letters.

I realize this is minor in the grand scheme of this discussion, but that "price is dependent on the number of letters" is a thing of the past.  The new unit flags are nylon and screened with everything printed right on it.  No longer do they sew individual letters and numbers on unit flags.  The size of the flag determines its price.  They'll even add the unit veteran emblem for no extra charge.  When we ordered our Jamboree flags it was the same way--they all cost the same not matter how much or little detail we put on it.

Ever check to see what the GS/USA unit gets as a cut of cookie sales?  Money is the only thing these people know, program be damned.

My daughter's GS troop earns 69 cents on a $4 box of cookies. For those "special" ones that they sell for $4.50 or $5.00 (because, as they say, the production costs are higher, despite the fact the neighboring councils sell the same cookie for no additional cost), they still make 69 cents on those boxes. The council pockets the additional profit. $1.20 goes to the cookie maker.  So, the council pockets the remaining $2.11 on that $4 box.

So my daughter's troop makes 17.25% profit on the $4 box, and only 13.8% on the $5 box.

When the prices went up a few years ago from $3.50 a box to $4.00, the profit to troops only went from 63 cents/box to 69 cents.

You could earn an additional 3 cents profit per box for your troop if you chose (as a troop) to not take the tchochkie prizes.

The annual reports for my daughter's council show that, depending on the year, 70-75% of the council's annual income comes from cookie sales. Things like corporate donations and Friends of Scouting are foreign concepts to them.

Not to mention, you're not allowed to do your own fundraisers if you don't participate in the cookie sales and the fall program sale (magazines, candy & nuts).

Agreed. I work in IT, so I've seen my fair share of cryptic error messages, but that was a new one on me.

Well, after all that, I was able to get in.  It had another, unrelated, email address associated to my username.  Once I switched it to what my email address actually is, I was able to get in (I'm writing this on the new computer).

So I got a new computer last week, and of course you have to remember all the passwords that used to be saved on the old computer to log onto websites.

I trying to log onto here with the new computer, I put in a username and password, and get the following error message:

An extension required to process this request is missing. Please notify the administrator.

So, I notified the administrator.  No reply yet.

I tried resetting my password. It said that it can't find the member account for the name or email address I supplied (even though I can see my username and email address logged in on my old computer).

So, I contacted the community administrator asking for help. No reply yet.

I also tried all of this using Internet Explorer, Chrome and Firefox. Same results.

Anyone else ever had difficulty like this?

do you know if there was much of a price difference between made to measure vs normal ones at the scout shop?

I'm not sure. I've never had to take advantage of this service, so I'm not familiar with their pricing. I'm sure it would be customized depending on the amount of work needed to be done.

You will have separate dens on paper and co-ed dens in real life.  The reality is even if a pack wanted to keep them separate, some meeting places are not big enough to accommodate 10-12 separate den meetings at a time.  The pack we were in already takes up all available rooms with 2 dens sharing the cafeteria area at times.  

There's no rule that says that dens have to all meet together. The Pack that's part of our Troop's CO has their dens all meeting on different days, times and places.

What I find interesting is that girls will be admitted to Cub Scouts in the "2018 program year" (question: Does the "program year" start in January, or September?) but the new girls' Boy Scout-age program "will be announced in 2018 and projected to be available in 2019."  

The program year runs June 1 - May 31.

The answer depends a lot on who's asking and why. The simplest answer is that for most purposes the individual would be considered the owner and could do with the trailer whatever he or she wants, including sell it for their own profit, and they would be liable for any damage caused by the trailer. It's possible that if the trailer was the proximate cause of an injury to someone that then that person could demonstrate in a law suit that the CO was the effective or "equitable" owner of the trailer and therefore liable for the damage caused. Similarly a CO could make a case that they were the equitable owner of the trailer and reclaim it or prevent the sale of it by the individual holding the title. Both scenarios would depend a lot on specific facts and evidence and individual state laws.

 

(edited because without automatic spell check my poor typing makes my posts almost gibberish.)

I was asking in the context of whether the CO had any liability or ownership stake in the case that something happened (it hasn't).

My Troop's trailer was purchased by an individual that used to be a Scouter in the troop. It is registered (the license plate) to him, and the insurance policy is in his name.  Yet, the trailer has the troop name, CO's name, BSA, council, etc., on the trailer.  I was wondering if in the discussion of true ownership of troop assets, if this falls in with the tents, cooking gear, etc., that the troop owns (and is really owned ultimately by the CO).  It sounds like from a liability standpoint if something were to happen that would invoke a claim, whether the troop and CO would be off the hook, so to speak, for liability, since the trailer is not in the CO's name.

What if someone else buys a trailer, it's titled to them, they pay the registration and insurance on it, but it's used by the Troop and has the Troop name and BSA insignia on it. Is it still the CO's trailer, even if it's titled to an individual?

If it sits on the cuff, it sits on the cuff. On some of the smaller-sized short sleeve shirts, it's inevitable.  We have some Scouts in my troop where this same thing happens.  You won't get hauled off to Uniform Jail by the Patch Police if it's on the cuff.

As mentioned above. The CSP should touch the top of the shoulder seam. The Troop numbers should be right below that, touching the bottom of the CSP.  And then, the POR patch should be just below that, touching the bottom of the troop numbers. The "Trained" or "NYLT" patch would go just below that, touching the bottom of the POR patch.

If it's a short-sleeved shirt with the pocket, then the POR patch is centered on the pocket, and the "Trained"/"NYLT" patch would go on the pocket flap.

With the advent of the custom troop numbers patches which are typically larger than the unit numerals sold at the Scout Store, it's led to the pushing down of the POR patch, sometimes onto the cuff.

ILST is a training activity, not advancement, so it wouldn't get recorded in Internet Advancement.  It might get recorded in ScoutNET in a person's training record by the council registrar, although I don't know if ScoutNET keeps track of youth training like it does for us adults.

Perhaps @@Cleveland Rocks will explain with his first post in this topic.

???  I haven't posted any replies on this topic, at least until now.

Many councils have insurance in addition to National's that they charge extra for. On another forum I read someone say that their council charges an additional $25/year for their insurance.

 

 

• The BSA could self-insure but that would be a fools errand.  The majority of claims against the BSA is small scale stuff - a few thousand here, a few thousand there - but enough to add up to significant money.  When there is a claim, of any size, the insurance company takes over - they evaluate the claims, the decide if the claims have enough merit to offer a settlement, they negotiate the settlement terms.  If they decide to deny the claim, they are the ones that go to court if neccessary.  As part of that process, they incur all the costs to evaluate, settle and litigate.  Only in very large losses is it likely that the BSA would have to pony up additional cash.  Most will come from the insurance company whose goal is to keep the payments and expenses on claims lower than the amount of the premiums they've collected.  If the BSA were to self insure, then the BSA is going to have to hire people who have the expertise that the insurance company has to process, settle, negotiate, litigate, etc.  The BSA will have to pay all the settlement amounts out of their operating cash.  Do you really think the BSA could reduce their fees if they self-managed?  They'll still be charging those same fees for insurance - just keeping it so that they can administer it on their own without a loss to operating expenses

 

 

The BSA is self-insured. That's the reason for this proposed increase: the insurance fund is depleting.

Here is the text of what our council sent out regarding this proposed increase:

This increase is due to the number and the size of claims made against the General Liability Insurance Plan (GLIP). As a movement we are self-insured, so every time there is claim or litigation the GLIP takes a hit.

 

 

 

Don't the Girl Scouts wear their badges on a vest?  Of course, I may be a little out of date, both of my daughters quit the Girl Scouts more than 20 years ago.

 

They have the choice (usually done at the troop level--the entire troop wears the same) of either a vest or a sash.  In my daughter's area, most opt for the vest because there's more space to put more badges, particularly the activity/participation ones that go on the back.

I'd just be happy to see Girl Scouts actually wearing their uniform.  It astounds me how few Girl Scouts wear their uniform. Our troop participates in a flag-placement at the National Cemetery near us every Memorial Day. The Cub and Boy Scouts are all dressed in uniform quite nicely, and it amazes me how many Girl Scout troops come to the event and aren't even wearing their vest/sash.

I think GSUSA made a mistake when they basically made their uniform be "wear your vest or sash over whatever else you're wearing at the time".

would the scout's store have it in hand next week, or orders should have been made earlier? 

Our Scout store has a sign that says preorders for the patch need to do so by the 24th. They're not a national scout store, so I don't know if that makes a difference.

Our troop provides the Eagle Kit, an embroidered Eagle square knot (for them to wear later when they turn 18, or to wear now, if they've already turned 18), and a special CSP our council makes and sells that says "Eagle Scout".  The council provides an "I'm Proud Of My Eagle Scout" bumper sticker.

Parents pay for the necker and slide, although we often pick it up for them when we pick up the Eagle Kit at the Scout Shop.