Trevorum

I fully agree with Bobanon. Schools, public or private, are the perfect CO for Scout units. It's a darn shame that they can't serve in this role any longer, as they successfully did for decades until BSA painted itself into a corner with the Dale case. I gotta believe that the high paid BSA executives and lawyers who weighed, behind closed doors, the strategy of pursuing the Dale case did not fully appreciate all the consequences of their actions. Public funding drying up, membership sliding, losing schools as COs, possibly losing Ft AP Hill for the Jamboree, not to mention the general erosion of public support as BSA is increasingly percieved as an organ of social conservatives. In my mind's eye, I see the representatives of various conservative religious bodies thundering to the executive committee, threatening to withdraw en masse thousands of COs and their units if BSA did not once and for all take a stand against "the sin of homosexuality". I see the BSA demographers and accountants crunching the numbers, coldly calculating the lesser of two evils. Well, what's done is done. I have no doubt that BSA will eventually follow mainstream American values, as opposed to dogmatically conservative ones, and become more inclusive. That will probably take decades. In the meantime, I try to make every scout and every adult feel welcome in our unit because I strongly feel that every boy should be respected for who he is and deserves the opportunity to be a scout.

Greywolf, welcome to the forums! I think it safe to say that the beret enflamed passions - for and against - far more than did the previous overseas hat or the campaign hat. That is wonderful for haute couture but perhaps not the best thing for a uniform part that you want everyone to wear. National finally got the message about the beret. (I wonder how long it will take them to get the message about the rest of the fashionable but non-functional "Oscar" uniform).

The June 2006 issue of the ISCA* Journal has a great new article on Ernest Thompson Seton by David Scott (Miki101 on this forum) and Brendan Murphy. The article is an excerpt from Scott and Murphy's forthcoming book and focuses on Seton's relationship (or lack thereof) with James E. West during the period 1910-1916. I highly recommend the article (and the book, to be published in 2007) to everyone with an interest in Scouting's early years. Scott's research is impeccable, as always, and the writing is lively. I only wish the article had included Scott's sources and endnotes (which were not included due to space constraints), but I'll look forward to the book. Excellent work! * International Scouting Collectors Association

Call me a pessimist, but I'll bet the marraige doesn't last ...

Congratulations to Ed (evmori) on his 5,000th post! (it was about ice cream)

Eamonn, you crack me up! (this message has not yet been edited by a staff member. But watch this space... ) (ain't I a stinker? OGE) (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

For some reason, I am reminded of the scene in "A Few Good Men" in which Lt. Kaffee (played by Tom Cruise) asks Corporal Barnes (played by Noah Wylie) how he knew the way to the mess hall if it was not explained in any official army manual, guidebook, or policy directive.

Ahh - Mike Walton, the Black Eagle! Mike is a terrific Scouter and always has excellent advice! (I sure wish he would join us here now and then!)

Dan, I apologize - I certainly didn't mean to tell you your business! I guesss I had forgotten that you had previously mentioned your professional expertise in this arena.

Dan, That was what "the closet" was all about. In years past, many homosexual persons, men and women, would allow themselves to be pressured by society into conforming to gender role expectations. These people would marry and have children despite their sexual orientation. Some would acknowledge their difference from the norm and strive mightily to fit into social patterns. Others would not understand their innate difference and would be terribly tormented because of their "sinful" thoughts. It was generally only the urbane sophisticates, such as Oscar Wilde, who understood social dynamics enough to afford to act on thier biology, albeit often with disasterous consequences. Today, homosexuality is widely (if not not universally) accepted and being "avowed" is often taken for granted.

Acco, I don't tink anyone of us expecs yu to edit our possts for speling r grammer. But heck, go fr it! What I was primarily referring to are the occasional edits of offensive or patently inaccurate material. I trust these are fairly rare. However, if subsequent posts respond to the unedited statement which then later disappears, the thread becomes disjointed. I imagine there are other situations where a poster would not want his words changed without the edit clearly being marked as such. It is NOT a big deal to be sure, but courtesy to the poster and later readers might suggest such a protocol. In any event, please know that we DO appreciate your "light" touch.

SaintCad, Your premise is faulty. "BSA does not define what constitutes belief in God or the practice of religion" (BSA position statement, 6/2000). Thus, "God" is NOT defined as the Judeo-Christian-Islamic deity. Any god is acceptable. Indeed, even faiths without a supreme deity (as Buddhism) are just fine. Therefore, the remainder of your thought experiment is invalid, since the Bible has no special place in BSA. (ps. welCome to the forums!)

Jeff, five is a big order to fill, but it sounds like your trek coordinator is doing the right things. He needs to get the word out to ALL Scoutmasters and Crew Advisors in your district and council. I'd recommend getting your commish involved pronto! You need to get a council roster of unit leaders and then just sit down and man the phones until everyone knows of the opportunity. And that's what this is! An OPPORTUNITY for four lucky youths and a lucky leader to make the trek they thought they'd never get a chance to experience! Good luck! (ps, welcome to the forums!)

The CO sponsoring our troop is a local host for Operation Interdependence, a DoD program that sends "care" packages to service people overseas. The packages include toiletry articles, candy, small luxuries, etc. and are much appreciated by those far from home. Our scouts have participated in the bag stuffing several times. It's an excellent program. See http://www.oidelivers.org/. At the troop meeting two weeks ago, our scouts wrote personal notes to be included in the next shipment of bags. The SPL had prepared sheets of "troop stationery" (laser printed with the troop logo and CO's address) which looked really sharp. I am sure that the men and women who recieve these thoughtful personal notes of thanks from our scouts will value them.

We've discussed flag burning before, but now fanning the flames (so to speak) is Senator Frist, who says that a constitutional amendment to prohibit flag burning is "... important to the heart and soul of the American people". Cynically, I see this statement as a calculated attempt to create a wedge issue. see http://apnews.excite.com/article/20060528/D8HSTO780.html (and other news reports). As I've said before, I view burning a flag to be a strong political statement It can be either protest or a solemn duty, but either way it is protected speech. We burned upwards of 20 flags on Monday night. Thanks to those of you who offered ceremony ideas! Every Scout had a chance to help retire a flag. We saved the grommets and will distribute them to everyone who participated. The only problem was avoiding the smoke, especially from the nylon flags.

Dear moderators: Thank you for your cheerful service to these forums. We members very much appreciate your quiet work and guiding influences. I would like to make a small request. When editing a post, can you please note your edit in the text in some manner? This protocol would aid later readers understand the context of following posts. A deletion can be indicated in the following manner: The quick brown fox jumped over the [deleted by a staff member] dog. A change can be indicated thusly: The quick brown fox jumped over the [edited by a staff member] /lethargic/ dog./lethargic staff member. Similarly, an insert can be indicated thusly: The quick brown fox jumped over the [inserted by a staff member] /occasionally/ lazy dog. Thanks! Hi Just checking we were able to do it!! It seems we do have the technology - Beam me up OGE!! Eamonn. (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

Bobanon, I agree with Hunt. As I mentioned in another thread, you automatically loose your argument in the arena of public debate by invoking a frivolous reference to Hitler, Nazism, or the Holocaust. This is referred to (only semi-humorously) as Godwin's Law.

I'm sure you'll be well prepared. Good luck!

The way people think about their god and the way they think about their country are often all wrapped up together. It used to make a kind of sense, centuries ago, when each nation state had their own language and own religion and used military power to protect their economy and way of life. Of course it doesn't make sense any more, but there you have it.

Ron, I know Fred and he's good folks. I think of him as our own 'Fredbot', going out onto the web and bringing us stories of mutual interest to discuss, lambast, or just read. He also has said that he posts here on Scouter.com so that the stories will be archived - they often disappear from the original news websites after going stale. However, maybe Terry should create a new forum (fredforum?) for these stories ...

Bobanon is disqualified: Godwins law http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

OK, Ed. Maybe you did mean to be insulting after all.

Ed, that sounds perilously close to saying Bobanon is not morally straight. I'm sure that's not what you intended to imply.

Egad. I thought BSA honoring Oliver North was bad enough. Now this. What's next, nominating Bush for a peace prize?

Michelle, Uniforms and insignia are always good for an argument. As a passionate CSP collector, it's an issue near and dear. (say... um... you don't happen to have an extra one of those to trade, now do you? )