resqman

12 miles a day for 180 days (6 months) is the norm for thru hikers.  Very obtainable by most people.  20 miles a day for 110 days (about 4 months) is quickly becoming a more common experience for thru hikers.  50 miles a day for 50 days is only for about 5 people in the world.  50 for 50 is a sprint with the hiker carrying little but water and snacks during the day and a support crew providing food and sleep accommodations at end of day. 

Shelters are about 12 miles apart.  On the trail by 8:30, a couple short breaks, a 20-30 minute lunch and off trail by 5. Head off trail about once a week to gather food, do some laundry or replace worn gear.  Figure in a "zero day" about once every couple weeks.  Zero days are those days where no miles are attempted to give the body a chance to rest and recuperate.  Enjoy the surroundings.  Maybe spend the night in a hostel or hotel, get a shower, eat in a restaurant, etc.  They really add to the enjoyment of the trip.

Everybody has a bad day every so often.  Part way thru day, your mind and body need a rest.  Sunny spot looks enticing, or maybe there are two shelters in a 16 mile stretch.  So you only get in 8 that day.  Correspondingly, you have some high mileage days.  One day I accomplished the 11 miles between shelters by 4 pm. Was feeling in great mental and physical shape.  It was only 4 miles to the road and the next day I had to go into town to pick up food.  Pushed on completed the last 4 miles in 2 hours. Basically a sprint downhill on a smooth trail.  Hitch hiked into town, got a hotel, hot shower, real meal and was able to get to the Post Office when they opened at 8am to get my food supplies.  Was back on the trail by 10am and heading to the next shelter.  

Towards the end of my trip, one day I skipped a planned shelter stop and pushed on to the next.  Climbed two mountains.  Lots of elevation gain and loss.  Tough day but really a sense of accomplishment.  Shaved a day of my trip plan.  

Hiking the AT is similar to hiking any trail.  Carry everything you need.  Meet nice people.  Spend time in the woods.

I solo hiked Tennessee to GA Sept 2015.  About 325 miles in 28 days.  Son and his buddy did all of GA July 2015, about 100 miles in 8 days.  

Backpacking is backpacking.  Water sources are abundant on the AT but often just little trickles.  Enough for a hiker to easy fill a quart or two in a few minutes.  Camping sites are limited because the trail often follows along ridges so you cant just stop and flop whenever you want.  Shelters are spaced about every 12 miles apart.  Sometimes closer, sometimes further.  Hostels are available occasionally.  Cheap and clean.  Great experience.

You can mail food to post offices ahead of time and go off trail to resupply from towns or PO.  In some places the trail goes right thru town on main street and others it is a 15 mile drive.  Hitchhiking and uber are ways to get to town. 

Weekends, weeks, months or longer are easy since the trail often crosses roads.  Communities along the trail are used to hikers and their needs. Finding help, supplies and support along the trail is relatively easy.  

Don't recommend a hiking party larger than about 8.  Due to size of campsites, there is just no real way for larger groups to be comfortable. 

The theory is that is you have a trailer, you only do drop and plop camping.   The second premise is the only real camping is backpacking.   I say false to both.

We use a trailer to haul gear that doesn't into the micro sedans of today.  Moms don't want dirt in the trunk of their Lexus so are unwilling to shuttle little jimmy to the camp out.  Troop has 6 or 7  twelve inch cast iron dutch ovens.  Couple bags of charcoal, few charcoal chimneys and couple of shovels to move around the coals.  Load that in the trailer and each patrol has an oven and supplies to cook for the weekend.  Troop has a cooking competition every camp out.   Most of the ASMs have full size pickups/SUVs and pull the trailer.   

Every campout has a planned activity.  Canoeing, rock climbing, hiking, or specific mini adventure (National White Water Center, etc.)

Troop sends a full crew to a high adventure base every year.  Rotates thru Philmont, Northern Tier, Seabase and Bechtel.  Depending on the trip that year, campouts include hiking, backpacking, or canoeing to get the crew ready and begin to train the younger scouts in those skills.  Drop and plop provides a base camp to sleep and eat while giving more time to do the planned activity.   Camp outs are not so much about camping but the activity. Pitching a tent, cooking, fire building etc is presumed to be simple and all troop members should be able to participate in those skills with confidence within 6 months of joining.  After that time, lets get on to the adventurous stuff. 

Toad in the Hole:  Set large pancake griddle on two burner stove or preheat a fry pan.  

Butter one side of bread.  Use cap from the Pam Spray as cookie cutter and cut hole from center of bread slice.  Place bread butter side down on griddle/pan.  Crack egg into the hole in the center of the bread.  Dab butter on side of bread that is up.  Cook on medium heat until egg is firm and bread is toasted.  Flip and cook other side.  At same time, cook bread holes as toast.  

Didn't see where anyone suggested Boil-in-Bag Eggs.   Write name on outside of quart ziplock with magic marker.  Crack 2 eggs into ziplock bag.     Zip up bag.  Scout squishes the bag until the eggs are thoroughly mixed.  Open bag and add grated cheese, diced tomatoes, diced onions, bacon crumbles, diced ham, diced peppers, sausage crumbles, diced mushrooms, etc.  Usually have several bowls of supplies with spoons on table.  Scouts add their own toppings to their bag.  Add salt and pepper to taste.   Tricky part: Burp bag of as much air as possible and zip.   Throw in pot of boiling water.  Wait a few minutes.  Retrieve with tongs and place bag into a bowl or cup.  Food and bag will be hot.   Scout eats from bag with a spoon.  Throw away bag.  Use the boiling water to clean the toppings bowls and spoons.   

Cheese will make the eggs runny and they will never quite firm up completely.   That's OK.  Just monitor the eggs to make sure they are cooked.  

At a Webelos den meeting, I showed the den a completed box oven.  I split the den and gave one half a box, foil, a stapler, some coat hangers and a pair of pliers.  Told them to make a box oven. The other half I gave them a bowl, some milk, a measuring cup, muffin pan and a Martha White muffin mix.  You add 1/2 cup milk, stir, put in muffin pan and bake for 12-15 minutes.   While they were making the oven and muffins, I got the coals going.  

Had the scouts put the pan of muffins in the pre-made box oven, set a timer and close the box.  Showed them the thermometer stuck in the box at 425. Waited 15 minutes and 6 muffins done.  Amazing!  Scouts learned how to read directions, mix ingredients, and make a simple baked item.

Then had the box makers add coals to their box and placed store bought refrigerated cookie dough on pan and cook.  Again 12-15 minutes and warm cookies.

The only thing I did as an adult was to start the coals, move the coals, and provide the materials.   Next Pack campout, the den did a presentation and taught the rest of the Pack how to make box ovens.  While one half was demonstrating the box oven creation, the other half were baking cookies. At end of presentation, they distributed cookies to the rest of the Pack.  Parents and scouts were equally amazed you could cook in a cardboard box. 

Muffin mix is about $1. Cookie dough $2-$3. Couple of copier paper boxes from the office, roll of foil and a stapler, and coat hangers (to make the shelf).  $5 for food and foil.  Cheap den meeting with a big impact. 

How about 7-10 days backpacking the Pacific Crest or Appalachian trails?

Son just spent a week kayaking around the Florida Keys.  His cost was about $500 for food, lodging, travel and kayak rental.  Stayed in Hostel, one night in friends home, and the rest camping.  

Back in the 70"s, my explorer post spent a week hiking every trail at the Chickamauga GA. Civil War Battlefield.   Earned a patch and medal.  

As a lad, my explorer post did a number of weekend or long weekend Mini High Adventure treks.  

- Camp for the weekend.  One day went white water rafting and the next went glider plane soaring.  

- Overnight spent in cave after spending half a day spelunking

- Long weekend snow skiing

Monthly camping trips run $35 per month, dues $100 a year.  Summer camp $250-$275.  Uniform $100 twice between age 11 & 18.  Personal camping gear: $50 sleeping bag, $75 pack, $20 mess kit, + rain gear.   

Well the same two scouts mentioned in the original post are at it again.  This time they are driving to the Florida Keys and kayak for a week around and between the various keys.  They are renting kayaks locally and paddling for a week.  They will spend evenings in a hostel, various camp grounds/state parks, and one night with a family friend who lives in the area.  

Both have attended Northern Tier so are familiar with paddling and living out of a small craft for a week or more.  Granted Canadian lakes are vastly different from open water in the Keys but they felt a need to ramp up the challenge level.  Both spent a week scuba diving in the Bahamas a few years ago so are familiar with tropical water conditions. 

Son graduated from EMT school on Monday and Friday they headed out.  Son has been a lifeguard at the county pool for the last 3 summers.  As long as he is not the one who tries to drown or get hurt, the two should be OK.  They plan on dragging fishing lines while paddling so hope to have fresh fish for a few meals.  Spiny lobster is in season so also hope to gather a few while snorkeling. 

I am so jealous.  Can hardly wait to hear the tale of this adventure.  

Well I do trust them all day while they are off running around the camp and taking classes.  Sharing a meal you get a chance to ask them about their experience with the camp, staff, and their week.  I eat with a different group of scouts every meal to get a general pulse.  You see which kids are not eating and understand why they are sluggish, grumpy, etc.  You get to hear stories about staff and if they are providing a valid program.  Once meal time is over, then you can enjoy your cuppa joe if you must.  20 minutes three times a day is not asking much. 

Our troop rotates through about 5-6 camps so it is the first time for most of the scouts to attend this particular camp.  There are always specific concerns at each camp that they have not experienced before.  Some of the concerns need to be addressed at the adult level.  Most of the scouts enjoy a chance to tell stories about their day to someone who will listen.  Reminiscent of the old family meal. 

I did a solo hike from Tennessee to Ga southbound.  About 325 miles in 28 days last September.  Averaged 12 miles a day.  Had two or three days where I only did about 8 miles due to weather, waiting for post office to open to get food drop, etc.  Hiked 2 weeks, took a zero mileage rest day, and then two more weeks.  Towards the end I was covering 16+ a day with ease.  55 year old solo is different from group of teenage scouts.

Was covering 10 miles a day at home with full pack in 4 hours during training.  Took 8 hours on the trail.  I live in Ga where it is hilly.  Thought I was ready.  Nope.  Trail taught me differently.  But by the end of week one was able to hike 12 a day with relative ease.  On trail by 8-8:30, 12 miles covered by 4-5pm.  Shelters are about 12 miles apart. 

Hydrate and calories.  Make sure everyone is taking in calories on a regular basis.  I carried trail mix, granola bars, peanuts/cashews and jerky.  Each was about 100-150 calories per serving.  Eat any two at breakfast, any two after 1.5-2 hours, 4 choices at lunch, another two after 1.5-2 hours and then a dehydrated meal of ~700 calories for evening meal.  Drank at least 1 gallon of water a day plus water for cooking.   Drank a measured 1/2 liter every two hours plus sucking on my camelback. 

Did not eat enough calories often enough during first few days.  Crashed on the trail about 3-4 one afternoon.  Make the lads eat even if not hungry.  Lost my appetite and had to force myself to eat.  Make lads drink.  Lack of fluids and calories will show quickly.  Once I ate and drank enough, body did a lot better quickly.  Figure at least 2000 calories per person per day.  Cliff bars are about 350-450 calories and take up same space as above choices.  Eat at least one a day to boost the calorie intake.  Body needs protein when exercising all day.  Jerky is pure protein.  Some days eating a 100 calorie package of jerky I could physically feel my body respond to the protein while eating.  Not terribly tasty but your body will do much better with it. 

I carried individual snak pak mandarin oranges as a prize for myself.  Usually ate during the afternoon break with the above two choices.  Heavy but the sugar was a great afternoon boost and the liquid helped.  Not everyone is willing to carry the extra weight but I loved them.

The only way to get lost on the AT is to actively walk off the trail.  The GA section is relatively easy hiking.  Trails are relatively flat, fewer rocks, wider, just plain easier than NC or Tennessee.   When planning the hike, look at elevation change, not just distance.  Climbing 2000 feet is much more challenging then 500 feet.  Smoky Mountains have a 3000 ft. change at both ends.  That is a long day of nothing but uphill.  Set your treadmill to steepest incline, set a concrete block under the front, put on 35 lb. pack and then walk for 8 hours.  Tough day.

A day of 300 up, 200 down, 500 up, 200 down, 300 up, 200 down is much easier than 1100 up.  Same amount of Up but it is spread out over the day.  The more elevation change, the less distance you should plan to cover.  Everyone will have a bad day at some point.  Everyone will have a super easy day.  Expect it and allow for it.  Someone will always be ready to race down the trail one day and next day struggle to make it half the distance. 

One day I covered my planned 11 miles by 4pm.   Had to get into town the next day to get food.  Pulled out map and it was 4 more miles to the road.  Got lucky and it was all down hill with virtually rock free dirt trail.  Covered 4 miles in 2 hours, hitch hiked into town, and got a room for the night by 6:30.  Great day.  One day my body gave out by 4pm.  Thought I would sit and rest.  Passed out for 45 minutes.  Fortunately water source was only 300 yards up the trail.  Topped off water, ate some food and camped right there, 5 miles short of my 12 mile plan.   That day was lots of elevation and too little calories early on in the trek. 

Never used trekking poles prior to this trip.  Wow.  They make a huge difference.  The adults will really appreciate them.  Boys are too full of themselves and may not like them.  You transfer some of the hiking to your upper body and ease the strain on the lower body.  Hands don't swell and prevent falls.  You can hike farther and easier with them.  Get some.  Really.  Get some.

Water.  You can carry and you can fill along the way.  I carried 1 gallon.  I would drink and every time I passed a water source would top off.  That's 8 pounds.  That's a lot.  1/3 my total pack weight.  Most thru hikers carry only 1 litter to 2 liters at most.  Different times of the year some water sources dry up.  I never had problem finding water where the maps said it was.  Often nothing more than a trickle.  You do need to purify.  Lots of options.  Keep your purification handy cause you will be gathering water at least three to six times a day.   Rule, everyone tops off water containers when at water source.

Hiking the AT is not really much different that Philmont.  Except you plan you own food and there are no planned activities each afternoon.  Philmont treks average about 6-8 miles a day.  Little tougher on the AT due to spacing of shelters.  Instead of mining for gold, lumberjacking, rappelling or other Philmont activities, you just hike further.   Philmont provides food drops every 3 days.  AT you might go 4 days between sources.  You can go into town and buy food or mail food to yourself.  Mailing food can be tricky if you show up to Post Office and they are closed due to weekend/holiday or your package doesn't arrive until next day.   Not that difficult to plan.  I mailed my food to the PO and picked up about every 3-5 days depending on trail and PO locations.

Was nice to eat "real food" in town once a week or so.  You can plan that into your trek as well.  Some places the trail goes thru town and other places town is 10-15 miles away.  Trail towns often have shuttles and similar low $ rides.  As a solo hiker, would hitch hike into town and get shuttles/trail rides back to the trail.  With group, hitch hiking will not likely work. 

Staying in Shelters.  In many areas along the trail there is area to pitch a camp so you need to plan on staying in the shelter area.  Shelters vary in capacity from 6-12 people.  Required to sleep in the shelters in the Smokies and must have a permit.   I would recommend keeping the group size to under 12 total.  Just not a lot of space to set up large camps. 

Cell service is pretty good meaning at least 80% of the time you can get a signal.  But don't rely on having cell service. 

Tough to get lost on the trail.  The white blazes are frequent enough.  The trail itself is well worn in most places.  Occasionally there are little side trails but really just go 50 ft to a scenic overlook or rocks to climb on.  

The larger problem is water.  How much to carry and how frequently can you refill.  Many trail maps show water locations.  Just need to carry purification methods and gather water during the day.   Some water sites are just little dribbles from the side of a rock up to running creeks.  Refill everytime you find water and no problem.  Carry at least 1 litter per hiker. 

There are many many many books about the AT.   Lots of trails stories but also lots of how to books.

Most BOR comments were the scout was unprepared for the review and requested to come back better prepared.  Troop policy is full uniform and book.  Partial uniform or lack of book, you get bounced. 

Me thinks you are spending too much effort on this.  The boys pick a name de plum.  It is funny or weird or boring or stupid.  After a while they get bored with it and pick a new one.  Or they take on a fierce love and protection of the name.  Some relish in the fact that the name is meaningless. 

Lots of No Name patrols thru history.  There are blank patrol patches available.  There are patches that have the word NAME with the red circle and diagonal stripe across it.

Agree this is playground bickering.  Troop policy is you can only change patrol names once a year.  Just because of the cost.  Troop paid for the patrol patches.  I guess if the patrol was to pay for the patches directly, we would let them change more often.  Good sign of initiative. 

Lads pick the patrol name.  SM would veto if deemed somehow inappropriate or un-scoutlike.  Patrols are run by the boys.  They make poor choices and live with them.  That is part of scouting.  The patrol name only has to last as long as they want.  Next week they could vote to change again. 

Keep in mind this a good learning lesson for the boys who don't like the name.  Next time a patrol decision is to be made, they will likely be more vocal about what they want weather it is food choice for the campout or who shares a tent.

Had an adult enter a patrol room and tell the scouts to stop rocking back in their chairs.  The boys took it as a challenge.  Changed their patrol name to The Chairs.  While it may have made that adult mad, nothing about the name is inappropriate.  The Chairs kept the name for at least 3 years.  Only they knew why they choose the name.  No one else in the troop really cared. 

Had a Pioneering MB Kit.    I built the rope making machine in the mb book.  Had two other methods to make rope using examples from the Cub scout books.  We had 4 boxes that held poles in the correct position so lads could lash.   Had about dozen or so "hiking staffs" from the scout store which are just wood dowels about 1.5 inches in diameter and 5 feet long.  Small enough to practice the various knots and lashing but too small to really build much of anything.  Included a box of ropes cut to about 15 feet with the ends whipped to use for the various lashings.   Had a 300ft spool of binders twine to use with the various rope machines. 

The unwritten rule in our troop is you discipline other kids scouts but not your own.  If you kid is acting up, you go and get another ASM. 

I tried to make sure that my sons were aware of upcoming events.  I let them make the decision to attend or not.  I made sure that they had all the needed gear or supplies for the event available to them but left it up to them to pack and select what they actually took with them.  They learned some lessons by leaving equipment at home.  Only can think of one or two times they came to me mid event asking for some gear/equipment to cover their anatomy.  They sucked it up an suffered thru rather than have me bale them out.  Probably because they figured I would tell them tough.    

I was the designated NSP patrol advisor and spent most of my time reviewing their activities. I was available to my sons if they needed me.  I would usually stroll by once during a slow period to just say Hi.  Got a few brief words, a occasional hug or more likely a nod or the head and was off.   While scouting is "my thing", I let them know that it was up to them to advance as they saw fit.   Well, once they became Life scouts I did check the calendar to see if it was possible to earn Eagle.  I did remind the older boy a few times since he was pushing the age limit. 

New parents are requested to serve on the troop committee for 1 year prior to becoming ASM.  Time to learn troop culture, transition from Pack to Troop mentality, keep them away from the their son, etc. 

As mentioned, within a campout or two, you can spot those that will work well in the field with direct contact and those that are better suited for troop committee work.  SM can and has waived the 1 year committee work for those he felt would be do their best work as ASM.  The troop pays all fees for any costs for all adult training including IOLS, SM specific, and Woodbadge.  Troop culture encourages adults to get trained in their position.  Several of the ASMs are council trainers and regularly teach.  Each year at least 2 adults take WFA so they can attend high adventure trips.

SM has an unofficially designated ASM that will take over the SM role if the SM is not available for an event.  Not an heir apparent, just the ASM that works well as the designated temporary SM.  Troop varies between 5-6 patrols and we have about 8-10 ASM.  About 5 or 6 attend virtually every troop function.  The others are more like 25%-50% or as needed.  At least 1/3 are wood badge trained.  The "regulars" have deep and broad outdoor skill sets.  All the regulars have attended at least 1 high adventure with many attending multiple high adventure bases. 

Typically only ASMs drive scouts to campouts and the troop only takes as many as needed to shuttle all the scouts to the event.  We are a fully uniformed troop and typically the ASMs wear full uniforms 100% of the time.  Yes, the entire weekend of camping.  If particularly hot or if doing manual labor, will remove uniform shirt and wear a BSA related T-shirt but still wear uniform socks and pants. 

Don't be afraid to let the boys lead.  They will surprise you.

The troop is under no obligation to transfer any credits to anyone, anytime, anywhere.  The money technically is owned by the sponsoring organization not the troop. 

While I understand your perceived right to some portion of the money/credits, it doesn't work that way.  Let it go.  You will only cause yourself heartache.  The money will go to help fund scouting, just not your son.

What is the goal of reorganizing the patrols?  It is to make the adults happy?   If the adults think something needs to change, then I recommend offering the topic to the troop.  Make it a project where the existing patrols meet, discuss and come back with their own ideas 2 weeks later.  Then the boys will have buy in with the final decision. 

If the adults are going to pick and decide without boys input, then just do it now. 

FCFY implies that the scout will be active enough to complete all the necessary requirements.  FCFY should not be a patrol/troop/adult goal.  The real goal should be an active troop.  Scouts stay if the there are fun, cool, different, challenging things to do.  Boring meetings, lack of outings will drive away scouts.  Fill meetings with learning and/or fun activities, the scouts will stay.  Offer at least one campout a month year round, scouts will stay.  If the "monthly campout" is really an activity where scouts happen to stay in a tent, so much the better.  IE; A weekend canoe trip where they campout overnight.  A hiking/backpacking trip, Rock climbing/rappelling, mountain biking, wilderness survival, No pot cooking etc.  If there is some activity or goal, the scouts will attend.  Even the older, jaded scouts will show up to do the activity.

We try to get the crossovers to attend at least 2 but preferably all 4 campouts between Feb crossover and June summer camp.  If we can get them thru a week of summer camp, they build strong friendship and patrol bonds.  They form a true team bond during the week of summer camp.  The few crossovers who don't attend summer camp, don't form the bond and often feel left out of the cliché.  Usually gone within 2 months.

To some degree it seems to be the actual Eagle scout.  Some speak well and others stand there like a sullen teenage forced to go through an ordeal.  If the Eagle is truly appreciative of the help he received along the way, and shows enthusiasm for the award, I see the younger scouts begin to think it is possible.  If the Eagle shuffles around and looks bored, then the younger scouts get the idea that earning Eagle is not very worthwhile.

Troop buys the eagle award kit consisting of  the patch, medal, mentor pin.  Adults agree to attend the ECOH.   Troop has a box of COH and ECOH decorations.  Usual stuff: candles, tablecloths, stuff to put on the podium, etc.  If the ECOH is held separately from the standard COH, the eagle family can borrow the box of decorations for the ceremony.

Your ID is council specific.  I moved and the new council cant pull my records because they are not national records.  BSA record keeping is horrible.  Print your records before they get lost.  When you re-apply, you can show your print out to council to make sure they update your records.