RememberSchiff

Never seen it myself, except now via Youtube (thanks packsaddle).

It's called the 'Magic Neckerchief Graduation Ceremony" brought to you by

http://www.usscouts.org/clipart/ScoutDoc/PowWow/Books/99_02_YA.pdf

and even mentioned here

http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=145201

So it's been around, I doubt going to Council will help.

Done indoors? Dripping acetone on the floor? Doesn't sound safe.

I bet your town fire chief would be interested in hearing about this.

My town fire chief would require that this ceremony be done outside in a fire pit with a hose or extinguisher handy, like the flag retirement ceremony. If he sees this Youtube video, he may now require a burn permit too!

You have a teaching opportunity here. Redo the ceremony but safely - outside, firepit, fire extinguisher, etc. Explain the magic formula and why it is considered a safe controlled magic act or not, and that using rubbing alcohol or gasoline would definitely not be safe. There should be many firemen willing to help teach.(This message has been edited by RememberSchiff)

Postal worker, police, EMT, and military uniforms are still made in US.

Here are some manufacturers that I am aware

Aspen Mills

Patriot Uniforms

SEKRI (Southeastern Kentucky Rehabilitation Industries)

Elbeco

Augusta Mills?

Melgamatic - I like a scout can do attitude

I would be interested in what US manufacturers did the BSA look at? Did any US manufacturers (with US plants) bid? What happened with the US manufacturer(s) for our last US made uniform?

No excuse for embroidered patches or American flags being made offshore.

I still wear my old made in USA scout uniform. No Jamboree for me.

I can't recall these embellishments existing at my ECOH back in the days of yore. I wonder when and why they originated? I just recited the Scout Oath and Law slowly and purposefully. Worked for me.

But whatever the scout and his family wants.

Well said DeanRx.

In "teaching safety", we have to develop awareness -"Am I safe? Are my friends safe? Is the situation safe?" "Think Safety" is a very difficult skill to develop. Kids consider themselves immune to harm. And as for adults well the plethora of excuses is why there are for many accident investigation boards.

Recognize the possible dangers. Should we be doing this? What can go wrong here? Where will the fire go? Where will the knife go if I slip? Is the pot hot? Safety is not just about rules and guidelines, it is about consequences.

If the situation is not safe, STOP, SPEAK UP LOUD and CLEAR. Granted this can be hard, particularly if an older scout or adult is the culprit.

If you cannot fix the safety issue don't become a victim, WALK AWAY to safety and COMMUNICATE to a responsible adult. Walking away is harder as our curiosity takes over, but our attendance implies consent and encourages the unsafe act - WALK AWAY and COMMUNICATE. Let your scouts know you will support them as I have done on unsafe occasions at summer camp.

As scout leaders, I do not believe we should shield our scouts from all harm by taking away knives, matches, swimming...rather teach them (again and again) how to safely handle those situations and then keep an eye on each other - safety is everyone's responsibility.

My $0.02

simple Neckerchief slides. Basswood is easy to work.

Teach Safety.

March 21, 2009

http://www.kval.com/news/local/41509887.html

By Associated Press

TOMS RIVER, N.J. (AP) - It was a hot July night at Boy Scout camp. Six boys, including Eagle Scout Brian Lenz, were clad in shorts and T-shirts, looking for something to do.

One of them was going to die, in a case that would shine an uncomfortable spotlight on the Scouts' safety and supervision policies.

Lenz, an 18-year-old camp counselor, decided to show the younger boys a trick: the "circle of fire," in which he would squirt rubbing alcohol in a pattern on a table and set it aflame.

It would look cool. And it would quickly burn out.

When Lenz tried to reignite what he thought was a dying flame, fire leapt from the table along the stream of liquid, back into the squeeze bottle he was holding.

Instinctively, he shook his hand, flinging the burning bottle away and inadvertently spraying flaming alcohol onto the other Scouts at the Joseph A. Citta Reservation in Waretown, N.J., last year on July 6.

In an instant, Sean Whitley, a 17-year-old nearing his own Eagle Scout rank, was horribly burned on his legs and abdomen. He died four days later at a Philadelphia hospital. Two other Scouts, including Whitley's twin brother and a 14-year-old Scout, were also burned but soon recovered.

Lenz appeared in court Thursday to plead not guilty to aggravated assault and was admitted into a pretrial intervention program that will enable him to avoid jail time or even a criminal record.

The case came nearly three years after the organization reached an out-of-court settlement with the family of a New Jersey Scout who was killed by lightning at a Pennsylvania camp.

Boy Scout policies prohibit the use or possession of flammable liquids, and the leader of the local Scout council said two adults are supposed to be present "in all situations."

"Even one incident like this is one too many," said Craig Shelley, Scout executive for the Jersey Shore Council. "We have redoubled our efforts to ensure the safety of every child in our care. Fire safety is something we are having increased discussions about."

Whitley's family sued Lenz and the Boy Scouts about a month ago, seeking unspecified damages and alleging that negligence led to Whitley's wrongful death.

"The loss of Sean has been a tragedy for all involved," the victim's family said in a statement provided to The Associated Press on Wednesday by its lawyer. They did not attend Lenz's court appearance and would not speak to reporters.

"We hope this incident helps focus attention to the need for increased fire safety training and supervision of minor counselors," they said. "The love Sean had for the camp and his friends on staff demands that every effort be taken to ensure their absolute safety."

Lenz, tall and pale with close-cropped brown hair, did not speak in court other than to answer, "Yes, sir" to a series of technical questions the judge asked. Outside the courtroom, Lenz and his parents, other relatives and lawyer all declined to comment.

The Whitleys' lawyer, Joel Rosen, would not say how the family feels about Lenz being admitted to the intervention program. But a prosecutor said the family was consulted before the decision was made to offer it to Lenz.

Pretrial intervention is designed for nonviolent, first-time offenders. It lets them avoid criminal prosecution in return for staying out of trouble for a year, performing community service, and paying fines or restitution.

Whitley, who lived in Evesham in Burlington County, was attending the first day of the weeklong camp in Lenz's hometown. Whitley and his brother Kenneth were staff members at the camp, which they had both attended for years.

A Web site by Whitley's family and friends described him as "a quiet, intelligent kid with a dry sense of humor. He and his twin brother Ken were inseparable and did nearly everything together.

"Not overly athletic or academically driven, Scouting gave him the opportunity to shine and to display the maturity and responsible nature that seemed unusual for his age," they wrote on the site. "His enthusiasm for Scouting and for the friends he made through it were extraordinary."

Lest we forget

Sean P. Whitley, 17, of Marlton died July 10, 2008.

He was a student at Cherokee High School in Marlton. He was a member of Evesham Boy Scout Troop 100, a brotherhood member of the Order of the Arrow, a member of Jersey Shore Council Venture Crew 85 and a staff member at Joseph A. Citta Scout Reservation.

As I recall, his school held an observance in the fall where many classmates wore green - some were scout uniforms but most were civilian. Both Sean and his twin brother Kenneth were working towards Eagle that summer. The remaining scout who was burned was a 14 year old Eagle Scout.

(This message has been edited by RememberSchiff)

Trying resending your Eagle Letters" to government officials who are Eagles, in particular, Robert Gates, Secretary of Defense.

Here's a list for the 110th Congress.

http://www.scouting.org/Media/FactSheets/02-571.aspx

I hope your U.S. Senator, who did not respond appropriately, is not on the above list.

Another tactic - contact your local MADD chapter

www.madd.org

about this situation. They may be able to help your Senator correct his response.

Sorry to hear of your loss.

In my day... A scout, in order to broaden his scout experience, had more restrictions on elective merit badges. He had to "elect" six merit badges from certain Merit Badge Groups. I think there were 15 groups.

1 from Conservation group

3 from Citizenship group.

1 from Outdoor sports

1 from any of the following:

Animal Husbandry,

Plant Cultivation,

Communication,

Transportation, or

Building

With 10 required merit badges, that left just 5 truly elective merit badges for a scout to earn for Eagle. Seemed a good system then, exposed me to some tech trades and kept fellow scouts from seeking the 11 "easiest" merit badges to fulfill electives.

Another point, merit badge requirements then were decided with little consideration towards summer camp marketing. Then, it was common that Canoeing, Rowing, Marksmanship (real scouts shoot offhand), Archery, Lifesaving, etc. would take more than a week or even season to complete. Then, go back to summer camp to complete partials of hard mb's. Now, go back to summer camp and get more easy mb's, in fact, we will even add classroom mb's at summer camp as a further draw.

My $0.02

Don't know but I'll state an opinion or two.

Robotics would be cool, some of scouts get involved in FIRST and NASA robot competitions. Could replace Electronics mb which is a joke.

Personally, I think GPS should go in Backpacking or some yet to be created Treking mb. Wilderness Survival needs rework too, maybe GPS and wilderness first aid could be added to that.

SCUBA certification would be my preference.

My $0.02

Yes. His award, his call. Respect his wishes.

Here's a thread on that subject from last fall

http://www.scouter.com/Forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=209105

hope it helps

The Great Depression started 1929 and lasted until mid 1930's or until the ramp-up for WW2

During this time, the BSA expanded the program and membership. Scouts were highly visible doing community service - clothes collecting, scrap drives (called recycling today). Health and Safety programs were developed and received national recognitions. Catholic Churches start chartering scout units.

1930: Cub Scout started, opening scouting to younger boys

1932: Schiff Scout Reservation at Mendham, N.J. opened.

National Council adopted 10 year growth plan.

1938: Waite Phillips donates Philmont

Membership went up:

1929: 833,897

1930: 847,051

1932: 878,461

1933: 904,240

1935: 25th Anniversary. Membership over a million 1,027,833

online reference from Post 369:

http://post369.columbus.oh.us/scouting.d/fact.sheets.d/history.d/

Lessons for success, in my opinion:

1. Scouting was in sync with current American values and needs.

2. Keep the bar high, stick to BP basics.

3. Scouts were highly visible in the community helping others. You actually saw firsthand, scouts in uniform around town performing community service.

4. On the radio and in other public speeches, the President of the United States asked Scouts for their help, while our own BSA president was more in the background.

5. Scout run, scout-centric program. Far, far fewer adults involved. More adventure.

6. Thrifty. As mentioned, make your own gear and re-use uniforms. Plan. Camp locally.

I don't want to give the impression that the program was perfect back then. It was mostly a white, upper middle-class youth group. Also, I would suggest there may have been more competition to scouting back then than now, namely JOBS. My dad would make the rounds on his bike after school to see who needed help sweeping, loading, gopher,...odd jobs. More time and energy was expended in the search than the actual work; he had no time left for scouting. At age 16, he tried to join another "youth group" - the U.S. Navy In time, he was allowed to enlist.

Mr. Peabody: Sherman set the Wayback Machine for Sept, 1972.

Sherman: Where are we going Mr. Peabody?

Mr. Peabody: To the Improved Scouting Program

Sherman: Ah, can't we go to the Titanic maiden voyage instead?

Say let's have an Improved Scouting Program to attract a certain demographic... And drop Camping merit badge as Eagle required as after all it is 'not necessarily a big thing' to some people.

Been through this stupidity (I am greatly sugar-coating my opinion here) before. 'Green Bar' Bill Hillcourt came back, but even he could not repair all the damage and restore membership levels. I think by the time Green Bar Bill wrote a new handbook, "scout" membership had dropped more than 2 million - more than the current "scout" membership now.

Good excuse to be irrational today.

Be prepared. Teaching first aid, emergency preparedness, and safety are cornerstones of our troop scouting program. So far, no complaints from our parents.

My previous response was about troop first aid kits, but count me in the "few" that want scouts to make and carry their own personal first aid kits as well. It is also Second Class requirement 6b.

Each of our scouts carries his own "personal" first aid kit whose contents are mostly those on p289 of the Scout handbook "Personal First Aid Kit". Some kits are store bought, but most scouts make their own very lightweight (5 to 8oz), inexpensive, quart size ziploc or equivalent bag.

"Personal" as in stuff the scout will likely need himself - their own correct-size gloves (one size does not fit all in this age group), bandaids, MOLESKIN (blisters happen), scissors, sterile dressing, small tape roll,...

My $0.02

First consider what you will carry and then size the container for that plus room for growth.

Here's a good article on a backpacking first aid kit

http://www.backpacker.com/april_2000_health_first_aid_kit/skills/150?page=1

Strongly consider investing in SAM-splints and the new trauma, quick clotting dressings, ace bandages,...

For wilderness activities, generally you want a folding, high-visibility, light weight soft pack with supplies organized in transparent pockets. You want to be able to unfold it and see everything that you have so you can quickly retrieve needed items. You also want to see what needs to be replenished.

To make it waterproof, place in a seal-able dry bag, or place it in a hard clear plastic Pelican or Otterbox (see Campmor and other suppliers). In my experience, plastic bags and even ziplocks leak, particularly if they get knocked around.

As mentioned, Adventure Medical kits http://www.adventuremedicalkits.com/ are good examples to look at to get ideas, you probably want to look at the Mountain or Sportsman medical kit lines for a troop-level first aid kit. I would encourage scouts to make their own (First Aid merit badge book).

Believe it or not, personal organizer bags work extremely well as wilderness first aid kits. You can get them from LLBean, Campmor, etc. Here's LLBean link (you can get

http://tinyurl.com/c8oa2a

Look at Chinook Medical too for containers and supplies - good prices, good people

http://www.chinookmed.com/cgi-bin/category/containers

Another good resource is Rescue Essentials though their online shopping is a little flaky

http://www.rescue-essentials.com/servlet/Categories?category=Empty+Packs

Hope this helps

(This message has been edited by RememberSchiff)

A scout can get by with sneaks for hiking at many summer camps, but often these problems follow:

- the sneaks were not the cheap Keds of yesteryear, but $$$ top of line NBA with blinking lights that are now ruined. Heh, the soles melted next to the fire?

- the sneaks were the cheap variety and offered no ankle, foot sole support or toe protection and an injury resulted.

- 'Why can't (I, my son) wear sneaks on the (troop campout, backpack, hike)? (I, he) did at summer camp'!

Now my oldest son has taken sneaks to camp for the past two summer as a ploy to get a new pair. When those sneaks come back after a week at camp, uggh, not even the dog wants them

Your mileage may vary.

For Webs/New Scouts, I like the Hi-Tec hiking boots in the $40-60 range - good fit, waterproof, 3-season boot, light terrain usage. Merrell and New Balance also offer walking/light hiking shoes in this price range. Try a pair of Smartwool hiking socks too.

Check out campmor.com

My $0.02

From Courier Post online

http://www.courierpostonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2009902060347

which has photos too.

BERLIN,NJ When tragedy struck a Girl Scout troop here, the girls stepped up to help a fellow scout's family.

Troop leader Jennie Perrottet, 44, of Berlin Township, had a massive heart attack early in the morning on Jan. 14.

"What happened to my troop leader was tragic," said Caitlyn Sullivan, 13, of Berlin Borough. "Earlier that night at our meeting she was fine as can be. We were talking about what to do with the cookie money and where we were going. She was going to take us on a four-day white-water rafting trip."

They quickly decided to sacrifice the proceeds from their annual cookie sales for the rafting trip to help Perrottet's family.

Robert Perrottet, 46, Jennie's husband, found out about the girls raising the money through their cookie sales through a friend.

"I had to hang up because I started to cry," he said. "It was pretty touching. There are good people out there."

Perrottet recently was laid off from a truck driving job and has been depending on his wife's two jobs while he searches for work in an unstable economy.

"She was way too young," said Perrottet. "I'm still in shock three weeks later. I've been with my wife since she was 14 and I was 17 and we've been married 23 years."

Already involved in the Cadette Girl Scout Troop 30975 and ready to take the reins was Caitlyn's mother, Irene Sullivan, a single mother of four and the troop leader of a Brownie Girl Scout troop and a Cub Scout troop. Sullivan, an emergency medical technician who recently was laid off, is also a cheerleading coach.

"We were in shock and didn't know what to do," she said. "I said I'd step up and keep the girls going. The Friday after it happened the girls were at my house making dinner for the (Perrottets). They thought it was a terrific idea to not go on trip and donate the money to the family."

So far, the girls have raised about $1,500, but are hoping to at least double that amount and donate 90 percent of their profits to their scout leader and her family, including their daughter, Paige, who is also a Cadette Girl Scout and member of the troop.

To help raise money, the troop has tripled the amount of Girl Scout Cookie booths they are tending.

"Typically, you usually get three or four -- and we have about 18 booths," Sullivan said. "We're going crazy with the cookies."

They also are accepting monetary donations for the family.

Jennie Perrottet is at Kindred Hospital in Philadelphia, where she is in the respiratory rehabilitation center working to become independent of using a ventilator. As of Thursday afternoon, she was beginning to communicate with her family, according to Sullivan.

Said Robert Perrottet: "She's one of those people that didn't feel good unless doing something for somebody else. I'm definitely appreciating her even more. It's amazing the things she did. Three weeks of trying to raise a 13-year-old and have a wife in the (intensive care unit) have given me a new perspective."

While the scouts work hard to sell cookies and raise money, Sullivan still is hoping to give something back to the girls.

"We just hope she makes it through because we love Ms. Jennie," Caitlyn said. "She's been our troop leader for four years. We're all really close. . . . We're planning to make more meals for the family and make get-well cards."

From scouting.org homepage

Bulletin: Weaver Popcorn Issues a Nationwide Precautionary Voluntary Recall

http://www.fda.gov/oc/po/firmrecalls/weaver02_09.html

We buy 1/4" and 3/8" manila rope in 1200' rolls from E.W. Evans Cordage, Cranston,RI

http://twevans.com/categories.asp?cat=68

Earlier in regards to the BSA official response

http://scouting.org/filestore/pdf/QAHearstmemoedited1-27-09.pdf ,

I stated, "I did not like the spinning in this response, but most of all I am skeptical of the repeated statement (4x) that the BSA is the nation's largest youth organization. I believe both the Boys & Girls Club and 4-H are larger."

I notice today that scouting.org homepage first sentence now correctly states:

"The Boy Scouts of America is one of the nation's largest and most prominent values-based youth development organizations."

Thanks for the correction.

In looking at alternative youth groups for my youngest son, I came across Dog Scouts of America. Good relief from uniform police, bsalegals, over-serious scouters, etc. And it is real!

http://www.dogscouts1.com/

"It is the DOG that becomes a Dog Scout, so the individual at the loop end of the leash can be an adult or a child. We have programs for all ages!"

"The nonprofit Dog Scouts of America was founded by Lonnie Olson in Michigan 14 years ago. It boasts more than 60 troops in 35 states, from California to Alabama to Vermont."

The Dog Scout Parent's Motto: ``Our dog's lives are much shorter than ours -- let's help them enjoy their time with us as much as we can.''

Dogs wear a red neckerchief and cape with earned merit badges.

They are developing a Junior Scout program which may interest my dog-loving, autistic son. 4-H is a possibility but most groups around here are focused on farm animals or horses. However 4-H here does run a dog summer camp program where a child takes his dog along to camp (try getting anywhere with that idea in the BSA).

http://www.dogscouts1.com/Jr_Scout_Program.html

Here's a recent news story.

http://www.miamiherald.com/living/home/story/877441.html

No trees were cut in this story though they may have been marked.

I wonder if the highest rank is Beagle?

Woof

Agreed. This was a "stalking horse". The media used this as a means to press the BSA National into responding to other questions. It worked.

I have seen the results of selective (single tree) and patch cutting at two scout camps. The selective cut was less obvious and more profitable as these were prime hardwoods. The patch cutting looked traumatic (they always do), mostly hemlock and pine, money made there. Luckily, neither camps were cutting due to pest infestation but that will come. The only beefs that I had were lack of notice and coordination with scout conservation projects. Would have been great for a Forestry mb or Soil and Water mb field trip. I think most scouts think 2x4's come from Home Depot.

Do any northern scout camps tap sugar maples? I don't know of any, but just point out another potential forest revenue stream.

"My Scouts are NOT paying Roy Williams salary"

We all pay.

http://scouting.org/filestore/pdf/QAHearstmemoedited1-27-09.pdf

page 2,6, 26

"The national council is funded through membership fees, investments, Scouting and Boys' Life magazine, sale of uniforms and equipment, and contributions of individuals."

p5 - functions of National

- sell program supplies (handbooks, merit badge pamphlets, badges...) and training courses.

- administer high adventure areas (Philmont, Sea Base...) and national events (Jamboree)

p26

councils "pay an annual service fee to national". (Good luck trying to find that amount in your council's annual report.)