NJCubScouter

7 minutes ago, ItsBrian said:

Agrreeeed. My first term I was “guided” to choose the runner up. It. Was. Horrible. If you saw my other posts about the parent always trying to blame something on me, that was her son I had to choose. (I didn’t have the courage to say no then) 2nd term? I picked whoever I wanted, and it is great. 

Funny thing is at our recent meeting, I asked what date we should have elections and each leader out of the 3, said one month further than usual. I don’t think they realize I have a medical terminology college class & more next year...

They know you can juggle everything.  And if you have to miss a meeting or two that month, hey, I hear you've got a great assistant. 

16 hours ago, qwazse said:

"of all scouts"? No idea why we dropped "true." But it makes sense to me. By virtue of point one of the Scout Law, if one is not true, then one is not a scout. And the Master is lord of lapsed scouts as well as upright ones.

I suspect that "true" is in there mainly because the person who wrote it decided it sounded better with that syllable in there, and did not engage in the level of grammatical analysis that you have.    As for one of your other points, some people in our troop may be saying "May the..." at the beginning.  As I said earlier, in our troop it is meant to be said quietly, while looking down in contemplation, and what people are saying is generally audible only to those standing nearby, and maybe not even that in some cases.  So the SPL is not really "leading" it in the sense of prescribing the words to be said by everybody else.  I guess it is inevitable (and harmless) that some variations creep in.

51 minutes ago, Saltface said:

Stay prepared, my friends.

That may be the best line yet. 

6 minutes ago, qwazse said:

So interesting that rain checks his schedule to see when he's camping!

I think rain checks my schedule too... so it can rain.

46 minutes ago, The Latin Scot said:

I can't tell if you are using Eagle in the nominal adjectival sense, or heaven forbid, as a verb, lol.

I think he is using it as a verb, but he wouldn't be the first person to do so in this forum. 

26 minutes ago, blw2 said:

let's say the troop is bedded down for the night in tents.  2 AM you are awakened by frog choking rain, thunder booming and lightning flashing.....

So am I seriously supposed to get out of the tent, round up the whole troop, and trudge a half mile through the woods and falling trees in the dark, trying to find the dining hall?

12 minutes ago, jjlash said:

No - you're supposed to round up the whole Troop and get someplace safe.  At our camp we now have concrete, wind-rated storm shelters near each campsite.  Prior to building these, the rule was "hit the ditch".  In fact, I would never go to our dining hall for a severe storm because it has high ceilings and lots of glass.

There certainly are storms that are so bad that, yes, you get everybody out of the tents and go to the designated shelter, whatever that may be in that particular camp.  And I would think that in these days of greater hazardous-weather-awareness, nobody has to be "looking" for anything in the middle of a storm because, before you put up the tents, you (meaning the adult leaders and boy leaders, at least) already know what and where the designated shelter is.  I have not taken the hazardous weather course, but I hope that is part of it.

6 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

Although I bet how the LDS troops do it, i.e. 11 year old Scout Patrol, caused national to create NSPs.

Yes, I don't think it was our CO, an unaffiliated property-owners association with one troop and one pack, that caused National to change anything.     I think it just sort of happened in our troop, that the SM was suddenly confronted with this "new thing" of the Webelos den (from the same CO's pack) crossing over all at once (this is 1972), and I am guessing (based on subsequent experience) that National probably provided little or no guidance to the units on how to handle a whole den crossing over at once.  So he had a choice between keeping them together and splitting them up, and he decided to keep them together.  It was probably just a personal preference as to what he thought would work the best.  (For those who have read my posts about my father/my Scoutmaster, the SM in this story was not him, it was the SM before him.)

1 hour ago, Eagledad said:

The program has become quite complicated. Another proposal I would personally suggest from my experiences in scouting is stop the den group crossovers and start sending boys to the troops by age or completion of Webelos rank requirements. This would end the need for NSPs and Troop Guides. 

Crossovers by dens became a tradition when National concluded that NSPs would help first year scout membership dropouts because the scouts are joining with their friends and feel more confident in the group.

I am not sure when the terminology of "New Scout Patrol" started - I assume that, like many other changes that greeted me when my son crossed over, it happened sometime between the end of my brief tenure as an 18-year-old ASM in 1976, and my son's crossover in 2003.  But "group crossovers" started before the "NSP" terminology did.  I believe it was around 1972 when the Boy Scout membership requirement was changed from age 11 (in which you crossed over all by yourself, as I did in 1969) to something similar to what it is now (but not exactly the same, I don't think), resulting in a whole den crossing over at once.  I was what would now be called a Troop Guide, without a title, for about six months, with a patrol composed entirely of a den that had crossed over about six months before I became involved with them.  (There is a reason for the odd timing,  but it is beyond the scope of this trip down memory lane.)  Then, when the next "class" crossed over, I became a patrol leader:  Seven or eight brand-new crossovers, with 14-year-old me as their PL.  Was that a New Scout Patrol, or a mixed-aged patrol?  I don't know, we just called it a patrol.

18 minutes ago, Oldscout448 said:

The dad was on the  Glen Beck radio program this morning.  

Hmm.  Well, everybody's got to be somewhere.

15 minutes ago, David CO said:

I do think there is something inherently wrong it.

My parish doesn't give any public recognition for donations. Tithing is private matter. 

I am not an expert in the practices of religious organizations, but I know something about non-religious non-profit organizations.  Most (if not the overwhelming majority) of organizations that seek donations from the public give public recognition for donations of a certain amount.  If I walk into my local hospital there are plaques in the lobby saying who gave at the Gold, Silver, Bronze, etc. (or whatever) levels in the last expansion drive.  I think the highest level is $100,000.  Give a few million and you can get the whole wing named after you (and some have.)  I just looked at the web site for the Red Cross, and if you give $1,000 to 10,000 in a year you are publicly recognized as a member of the Clara Barton Society, or you can give $1 million or more over your lifetime and become a member of the Chairman's Council, and several other levels in between.  If I go to a play at my local community theater and open up the program, I will see a listing of donors at various levels.  Some choose to be listed as "Anonymous."  Most don't.  If you donate more than $5,000 to FIRST Robotics (or at least that used to be the amount) you're a "V.I.P."  And so forth.  The BSA is no different, except that it is an organization that wears a uniform, and therefore they give you a recognition to put on your uniform if you want to.

1 hour ago, KevinPMajka said:

I have two shirts in my closet with West knots. One for me and one for my wife. Are you all seriously going to troll a family that gives to Scouting? 
We decided to do it while we were in our 30's so we could see what the council does with the interest (the part they get to spend) for 30+ years.

We don't make bank at all. We made a choice to do a Payment plan for them and sacrifice a little to help grow the endowment fund to ensure a future of Scouting. Like the great leaders I had before me, and the people who donated before them.... 

Where in the Scout law is it to be turds to the people that support the program with money? It's important. Most people give time. Most people give treasure. Some give talent. Some give 2 of those, few give all 3. I don't crap on any giving of any kind. We need more of all 3 of those. 

The plain fact of the matter is that there are a number of people in this forum who are jaded and cynical about various Scouting-related topics.  And the top item on the jaded-and-cynical hit parade is the general subject of Scouting and money.  I might even possibly be in that group myself sometimes.  But you make a good point.  If the BSA makes a recognition available and you do whatever it is you have to do to wear the recognition, there is nothing wrong with wearing it.

3 hours ago, Cyclone said:

Troop C meets about once a month or so. They camp about 7 or 8 times a month and have about 10-14 scouts.

I doubt that Troop C camps 7-8 times a month.     I think you meant they camp 7-8 times a year.

I thing qwasze makes some good points.  In which troop is your son going to have the best experience?

Having said that, I would ask my son to think very long and hard before joining a troop that does not go to summer camp every year.  That would be a dealbreaker for me.

I have known some people who traveled considerable distances to troop meetings, passing a number of troops closer to their home, for various reasons.  As quasze says, it kind of depends.  I would look it at in terms of average driving minutes (at that time of day) rather than miles.  Thirty miles in northern New Jersey is not the same as 30 miles in Montana... to say nothing of 30 miles on opposite sides of Los Angeles.     And in my area, there is considerably more traffic in driving to a meeting that starts at 7:00 than one that starts at 7:30 - as I learned when my troop experimented with starting meetings at 7:00 rather than 7:30.  In a troop that draws from a considerable area with very few in walking distance, that's a factor too.  (The experiment lasted about 4 months as I recall.) 

3 hours ago, The Latin Scot said:

Wait ... haven't you said earlier that you're 16?! Mercy, I used to think being 5'8 (5'9 with good shoes) was pretty average, but in the past few years I have come to feel downright SHORT at times, lol. 

My son was about 5'11" in 7th grade, and we were kind of wondering where this would end.  But he "only" grew two inches after that - just enough to surpass his father by 1".  

Don't worry, Latin Scot, between 5'9" and 10" is still the average for adult males in the U.S. (depending on which web site you ask.)  And it has apparently "flattened out" after a long period of increase.

2 hours ago, blw2 said:

I have no memory really of what my troop did as a scout.

Neither do I.  And I was SPL for a year, so one might think I might remember something about what I did.  I have a number of Scouting memories, but not about the opening or closing ceremonies.  Go figure.

Line up by patrol, SPL at center court (we meet in a gym); announcements*; sign's up, SPL leads the troop in the Scout Law (we do the Scout Oath in the opening, though some SPL's have reversed them, sometimes intentionally and sometimes not); fold your arms and repeat the Scoutmaster's Benediction**; troop salute, retire the colors, two, troop dismissed.

*Sometimes the Scoutmaster's announcement will double as a Scoutmaster's Minute.  We do not have a tradition of SM Minutes on a regular basis.

**In our troop it is meant to be said quietly while looking down at your folded arms.  I have noticed that people are saying two slightly different versions. I was taught (in this troop) to say "Oh great Master of all true Scouts be with us till we meet again."  I notice that some other people are saying "Scoutmaster" instead of "Master."  To me, "Master" makes more sense because it better evokes the idea that we are analogizing the Lord to a Scoutmaster, and not talking about an actual Scoutmaster.  But maybe that's just because that's the way I learned it.

2 hours ago, ianwilkins said:

Aaah, two countries divided by a common language.

Very true, you have quiz nights in pubs, we have trivia contests in bars, and its all the same thing in the same place.  (At least I think they still have trivia contests in bars.  I know that was a big thing at one time.  I don't really go to bars.  Or to make a lawyer joke out of it, I usually pass the bar.)

21 minutes ago, CalicoPenn said:

Sorry - I have no idea how that happened - I think I'm going to blame Microsoft 10

That would make sense, Windows 10 is the root of all evil.

If you would like I can edit out/delete the repetition, and then I guess I would delete all of these responses regarding it.  Let me know.

9 minutes ago, ItsBrian said:

Agreed. Even though people don’t always say “council” at the end of it doesn’t mean it doesn’t belong there. When I googled it, it did come up under “Patriots Path” but the trail was first. 

Right, the trail was first, the council was second, and the first time I looked at it I thought the third was also about the council, but now I see it is about an unrelated organization based in North Carolina that assists military veterans.  The other seven hits on the first page are for the trail.

18 minutes ago, HashTagScouts said:

It wouldn't be totally unique to move in that direction of local branding... In the greater Boston area, Boston Minuteman Council and Yankee Clipper Council merged, and the new name selected is Spirit of Adventure.  You really won't see much of the use of "Council" next to that name.  Even reflected in their website: www.scoutspirit.org

But there are other things named Spirit of Adventure.  I also don't think my council could simply drop "Council."  If you google "Patriots Path" the majority of hits on the first page are about the hiking trail (which existed before the council did.)  "Patriots Path Scouting"?  I don't know.  I don't see any benefit to it.  Maybe they should just focus on the program and making this transition a smooth one, rather than the branding, but I guess that's just me.

13 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

In case you missed it...Scouting is ALL about FAMILIES!!

To be fair, this is one of a number of programs at Philmont.  The "core" program (treks) is still about the Scouts themselves. And hopefully always will be.

My initial glance at the words "leather lace" in the heading suggested a far more interesting thread than what we have here... not one that would be suitable for this forum though...

My fingers and hands hurt just from reading this thread.

OldScout, what I would do, just to go along with the fun (and possibly bring closure to this episode as far as the boys are concerned), is get a Totin' Chip card, issue it to myself, stand up in front of the boys, and cut a corner off it myself.

With kindgergarten safety scissors.

If that goes along with your sense of humor.  It goes along with mine, which is why I thought of it.  That's all the "Help" you'll get from me on this subject. 

3 hours ago, fred johnson said:

From what I've read, the family wanted to use the scouting program without actually being a scout, using registered MBCs or following the expectations for rank advancement.

That doesn't seem to be what the BSA is saying.  The latest statement that has been linked to in this forum:

https://www.scoutingnewsroom.org/blog/bsa-clears-misconceptions-path-eagle-scout-rank-utah-scout-down-syndrome/ 

includes the following:

Quote

FAQ

"Were Logan’s merit badges revoked?

No, Logan still has the merit badges he worked on.

 

Was Logan demoted to a Cub Scout?

No, Logan is still registered as a Boy Scout."

It does not say how long he has been registered as a Boy Scout, but it does say he has been registered as a Boy Scout for at least some period of time.  And normally, he would not still have the MB's he worked on if he had not been registered when he earned them, and there is no indication in the statement that any exception to that rule has been made in this situation.  The statement does not say that registration is the problem, and seems to say the opposite.

Which still leaves the question:  What was the problem?  The BSA statement is completely silent on that point.  It says what the problem isn't, but it does not say what the problem is.

6 hours ago, SouthernTierScouter said:

Now that's just silly, we all know those evil aliens from outer space don't deserve our consideration.

That’s right, those other planets don’t send their best. 😇

1 hour ago, David CO said:

Why stop there? How about Citizen of the Galaxy? 

 

If you want to send that suggestion to National, I’m sure they will give it due consideration.