Knot Head

Our district will hold up a BOR until they have 4 letters. Letters are mailed to the BOR chair so the scout has to call to check and see if the letters are in. If not he has to call and hound the referenes to send in their letters.

As an aside the Eagle Rock Loop is a great trail for a backpacking trip.

http://www.ouachitamaps.com/Eagle%20Rock.html

Having hiked the Eagle Rock Loop several times I would say they (and their parents) did exactly the right thing(s).

That river is fine when normal but is a fast flowing killer when it rains that much in a short time. There is little to no cell coverage so they were smart and stayed put and waited to be found.

Good job.

We add a gas charge for each scout. With the national avg. at $3.87 per gallon we would charge each scout $0.04 (4 cents) per mile. We round to the nat'l avg. so if gas goes up we will eventually go to $.05 per mile. The money goes in the gas pot. The guy that pulls the trailer (if we take it) gets 100% reimbursed. The remaining drivers split what is left in the gas pot.

Not a perfect system but it helps and whilenot close to what the IRS allows per mile for deductions it helps the same people that drive most of the time.

We have talked about staying closer to home and at $6 a gallon probably will.(This message has been edited by knot head)

>>>> It's not something that can change quickly, but the saying goes "Don't do anything for a scout he can do for himself".

Kudu offers sound advice.

Get the scouts out on the trail and away from the cars. They enjoy it and learn a good bit about probelem solving, leadership, citizenship and camping during the adventure.

It is a joy to see a scout who once upon a time would tried to navigate with a map only teach a new guy "always use a map *and* a compass. They work best together. Don't use a map in isolation!"

Start small and build. You can improvise a small backpaking trip until you can find the gear (Craigslist!) to tackle a 30 miler over a three day weekend or longer even. Get on the trail!

Great to stand back and watch a Philmont veteran eagle scout bring in his gear and begin the process of teaching new webelo crossovers how to backpack then leading them on a backpacking trip 3 miles in and out. Five years back he was the webelo who hung on very word the eagle scout said. Now he is the eagle who all the webelos are listening to.

EDIT: Did not mean to spin off a new thread. If I did please fix. Sorry! Thanks!(This message has been edited by knot head)

Thanks for the replies!

The BOR was Monday night and the scout passed. He is a good kid and a well spoken so I figured he would do well.

I spoke to him briefly yesterday and he told me he was asked to tell the BOR about a local, national and world current event.

Not being in the room I can't tell you too much about what happened but our ASM who attended the BOR emailed the troop leaders and said that the scout did a good job and that it was a well run BOR.

A scout in our unit showed me the letter he got that told him an Eagle BOR has been scheduled for him. I'd never actually seen the letter before and one thing caught my eye.

Here is the language from the letter:

"You must be in full B.S.A. uniform prepared to answer questions about your scouting experiences, the scout oath and law, symbolism of the scout badge, current events and other activities. You should bring your B.S.A handbook."

Just curious... is the discussion of "current events" section common in your areas?

Most of the Merit Badge Colleges around here are run by a troop. They do it as a fund raiser and they make really good money in one day. 100 to 200 boys x $25 is a good payday. Troops need money and fundraisers so I understand that.

I do think the teaching is less than stellar in most of these but it is no worse than summer camp or Scout Base or National Jamboree. It all depends on the teacher.

Counselors that actually make sure the scout knows their stuff before signing off are few and far between.

Just saw your post about the rain issue. In our area we get rained on sometimes when we camp so we just work through it. When we backpack in the rain we use the rainfly for cover as we pitch tents. When we got to Philmont it was no big deal when it rained. The scouts already knew what to do. Two boys will pitch their tent while the others hold the tarp up over their tent site for cover. Then on to the next tent until we are done. If we bring the trailer on a trip we have two of those pop up 12x12 covers we move around until all tents are pitched. Then the pop ups become the card playing and cooking area if it is still raining.

We have cancelled two times in six years that I can remember because there was a severe weather watch and a chance of high wind and/or tornado. If it is just rain (or cold or heat) we just deal with it. If the SM wants to go home I say let him go. The boys can usually deal with weather.

The boys wear the poor weather campouts like a badge of honor! They still talk about the canoe trip a couple of years back where we got 4 inches overnight and a few of them woke up in a mud pit. They learned a good lesson about how to choose a good site for their tent and insist that new young guys move their tents if they have chosen a poor spot. A rainy trip can be a good teaching moment!

Get out there and have some fun!

Sounds like perhaps some or most of the adults just do not like to camp. Maybe because they do too much work or maybe they just hate sleeping on the ground.

Try organizing a parol campout. You only need two adults on a patrol campout (fight the "no adults needed" on a patrol campout battle later). Let the scouts plan it but "coach them" to keep it easy since they have not camped in a while so they can plan and execute. Pretty soon maybe another patrol will want to join you.

Before long the troop will be camping. Then take turns letting each patrol choose the location & be the trip sponsor. Take slow steps month by month and you can become a good camping boy led troop.

The fact you are starting out fresh (no camping for 7 months) really gives you a chance to let the boys plan and execute with you as the safety net. If you teach them right then camping is a relaxing easy outdoor weekend for the adults. If the adults do all the planning, cooking and the cleaning work then it is not much fun for both boys and adults.

EEven the eleven and twelve year olds can cook and clean with a little guidance but you have to fight the urge to do it for them. It may take longer to get it all done but after a few trips they can cook and clean and pitch tents and plan and execute activities with minimal supervision. Over time they become ready for more complicated meals and trips.

Good Luck!! Camping can be fun but it takes a good attitude and a joy in being outdoors!!

(This message has been edited by knot head)

That's inappropriate IMHO

How did she break her ankle?

I've never seen a movie at our summer camp and the PLC still does not want cell phone at summer camp. And yes they do play cards until about 11:30 each night. So maybe we are a throw back troop or something.

We did joke about having the "pimp my ride" (or whatever that show is called) trick out our trailer with a flatscreen but it was just a joke. Hard to believe someone actually did it.

We do allow cell phones and Ipods in the cars if the driver gives the okay. In my car they usually are talking and joking and the ipods never even come out on the way to a campout. On the way home they all fall asleep.(This message has been edited by knot head)

I don't have a problem with her putting her own style on it. She looked like she was trying and so I appreciate the effort and sincerity.

Having forgotten my own cell phone number on occasion and also had a "brain freeze" reciting the Lord's Prayer in front of the congregatin I can relate to (and forgive) forgetting a line in front of that many people as long as it was just stage fright. It's not like she changed the words on purpose to make a political statement or anything (which I would have a problem with).

I agree that the players and coaches could stand still and show a little respect. I make my 7th grade football team stand with helmet under arm and hand over heart. It's not too much to ask.

typically parents that just crossed over

>>>> "You can't go because your doctor said you were overwieght according to the chart. I'm sorry, but if I allow you to go and something were to happen to you I could be sued."

*** If we want to recruit folks and keep them, promise them adventure and keep that promise. ***

That's it in a nutshell.

I did a search and the word "camping" first appears on page 13 of 27 and once more on page 17. I found the word "fun" one time but lost count of the times I found "funds" and "funding".

When we have recruiting meetings what do we talk about and field questions about? Camping. That's why boys join our troop. We camp 11 of 12 months (no July - vacations). We do rock climbing, white water, canoe trips, backpacks.

Ask any scout what they do not like and they will tell you it is the citizenship and academic badges. They do them but they are not fun like a ropes course, wilderness survival or pioneering. Our guys are good citizens because we teach them to be, but to them the academic badges are just more homework. I've heard scouts laugh and tell stories from Philmont and canoe trips dozens of times. I've neve heard a guy yearn for the day they can begin the citizenship in the world badge.

Kids will attend activities that are fun. They like things they do not get to do at school like camp, canoe, cook on a fire, climb rocks, haul a pack 15 miles.

BSA24's post makes several good points.

I just bookmarked the requirements for MBs on my iphone.

Link here: http://www.usscouts.org/mb/worksheets/list.asp

If I need to check a requirement for a merit badge or advancement I just go there via safari.

Sounds like an okay app but for what I need free information on safari is good enough. I'm not going to try to track any scout's progress on my Iphone. If he wants to track progress on his iphone then more power to him.(This message has been edited by knot head)

>>> Just a thought - but WHY such a hatred for PopTarts?

We count service hours at scout camps for all rank advancement except eagle.

If it is a backpack we pack it in and out (except we do dig cat holes) so that is always far less than one 33 gallon trash bag. Sadly we usually pick up enough litter on the trail and at campsites to fill at least one additional 33 gallon bag.

For plop camping scouts are required to bring a water bottle and mess kit so we don't have to use paper plates or plastic utensils. A mess kit can be a cool whip bowl and a spoon from Wendy's but most now use squishy bowls or hand me down old aluminum BSA mess kits. Patrol boxes have spare plates and plastic coffee cups if a scout forgets his mess kit. If you forget your mess kit you get to wash the dishes for your patrol so it seldom happens. We do use foil and stuff like that on a plop camp when cooking. We compact our trash in the Philmont way so it all fits in less than one trash bag.(This message has been edited by knot head)

In our council Polar bear is sleeping in a tent when it goes below 32.

Our troop also has a "red hot pepper" stamp we put on a scout's class B T-shirt for a campout where the heat index goes over 105. Not sure why it is 105 but that's the level and we have done it three years running.

When we have done overnight patrol activities we have two deep adult leadership. Depending on the ages in the patrol you can adjust your level of "oversight".

As an example at Philmont the three adults always hiked in the back, We had a map but when they took a wrong turn we kept silent and hoped they'd figure it out sooner rather than later. During the "after action" phase of the wrong turn we'd ask questions to help them see what they did wrong. Both times it was using the map and not map + compass. It happened twice, was caught after about 1/2 mile and then never again.

On patrol backpacks (which are great fun, kinda like mimi-Philmonts) we hang at the back. I went on one patrol outing with a patrol that had been to Philmont. They showed us the route and we gave them a 15 minute head start. We go to camp (12 miles) a good bit after they did and camped off to the side to give them some space. We planned to keep to ourselves but they insisted we come hang at their campfire (which did make us feel pretty good). Patrol backpacking, canoeing, fishing trips (or any good camping based activity) are great bonding experiences for a patrol.