Jeffrey H

In my Pack, the responsibility to plan the AoL awards falls to the Webelos Den Leader with the assistance of the Cubmaster. In our Pack, the cost to obtain any extra AoL supplies typically falls to the Webelos Den families since the costs can vary greatly. The Den families make the final decision on how much recognition "stuff" they want their boys to have. As Cubmaster, I will assist the DL to obtain supplies and resources if needed. I will also assist the DL to help ensure they have an impressive AoL ceremony. For an impressive ceremony, our District has a very active Order of the Arrow chapter and they will come and give a nice Arrow of Light ceremony.

Now stepping back, what a sad state the troop must be in if he is bragging about that amount of camping. 5 nights a year that is pathetic. The new scout patrol most are not 11 years old yet, has 15 nights already under their belt, and this weekend it will be 17.....and they joined in February. I agree. 5 nights a year is poor, but he met the written requirements as laid out by the BSA national program. Most of the camping he did was in his early years with the Troop and he did not attend any campouts in his final 2 years with the Troop. His Troop is in good shape and has an active camping program, but this young man chose not to camp much. He camped just enough to make it through the written requirements for Eagle. That's not his fault but a BSA program that does not see the value in camping for advancement to Eagle. In my calculation, one could make it to Eagle on just 23 camping nights under the current written requirements: 3 seperate overnighters required for First Class and 20 nights camping required for the Camping merit badge. Even if my calculation is a little off, it would still be a pathetic number.

We advance our Webelos at our Blue and Gold Meeting at the end of February. That's our tradition and it's well accepted. Our reasons are the same as Fred8033 stated. However, if a Webelo turns 11 years old before Blue and Gold and is ready to go to a Troop, he is free to do so.

Simply return Scouting to camping? That would be great. I would like to see more Troops simply camp for the sake of camping, for the enjoyment of camping, to sharpen outdoor skills. I was at an Eagle COH last week and included in the program was the Eagle Scout's accomplishments. It noted that he had 31 camping nights during his six year tenure as a boy scout. For me, Thirty-one nights of camping is something I would not list as a Scouting accomplishment. However, that's where we are today in Scouting. You can make Eagle and pretty much keep camping at a minimum.

Most of our Webelos and parents see it as an ending point for cub scouts and a transition point to begin Boy Scouts. Our Pack emphasizes that Webelos is a transition period from Cub Scouts to Boy Scouts and most (if not all) are ready to move on to Boys Scouts after earning AOL. I can't recall a time during the past 5 years when one of our Webelos stopped at AOL. Even with the enthusiasm to move on to Boy Scouts, about two-thirds of my original Webelos Scouts dropped out of the program within two years after crossing over. The reasons they left are too many reasons too list here and that's another discussion. My Webelos Den crossed over more than 2 years ago and only about one-third of the original group is still active with the Troop.

"We allowed resident camping for Tigers as long as their adult partner came along as one of the adult leaders. Don't know if thats "officially ok" by national rules, but that was allowed by Council." My Council has parents n' lad a twice a year at our resident camp and Tigers are allowed. As long as your Council allows it, then enjoy it while it lasts. Let your Council debate the camping rule interpretation with National. I've tended to err to much on the side of caution when it comes to interpreting Cub Scout camping rules in G2SS. The best thing our Pack did when dealing with unclear guidelines from G2SS was to ask our DE.

I concur with the others that there are no restrictions on the number of night Tigers can camp or at any age level in Cubs.

"...MOST packs don't camp, To be honest I am not sure they should." Some packs do camp. I don't have any statistics, but packs in our area doing "family camps" once or twice a year is notunheard of. In my Pack, families bring their own tents, camping gear and supplies. How you do the meals is up to the Pack. You can make it a simple event or unnecessarily complicated. I prefer simple. Not everyone in my Pack attends but we have drawn large crowds in the past. We don't worry about obtaining campsite approval from our Council because we always go toState Parks with public restrooms and showers. State Parks and National Parks are approved by default in my council. We have someone who is BALOO trained so we can say we have one, but a BALOO trained leader is not needed in a State Park. To be honest, I'm not sure why anyone would avoid going camping at the Cub level...unless they just hate camping or just don't have the resources to do it. If resources are a concern, we help families that want to camp but may not have a tent or other supplies.

As a Cubmaster myself, I've really enjoyed the summer off and I can realate to AnnLaurelB's "brain on vacation." Yes, my Pack does the summertime pack award events but those are easy to plan and only once a month. Now that my oldest son has left Boy Scouts, my summer scout activities are much quieter. I sympathize with you for the poor response for your "Camp In". I have found that families in my Pack do not respond well to last minute announcements during the Summer. In fact, the turnouts for our summertime pack events have been about 25%. Family vacations tend to occur througout the summer.

"It might be a Council interpretation, but my Council says that a Pack earns the Award if they plan and hold one activity a month regardless how many go. If any boy attends all 3, he gets the pin. Any den that has 50% participation at each activity, gets a den ribbon. Therefore, in my Pack, under my council's interpretation, the poster's son would get his pin. They could be wrong, but that is what they say and it has been that way for awhile" Our Council interprets the same way as well. There is no attendance requirement % for a Pack event to qualify as an "event." In fact, the Summertime Pack Award Form does not mention or require an attendance % for the Pack.

An FOS presenter needs to be concise, to the point, and do it within 5 minutes. His presentation should be done within a positive context on how donations benefit the entire Scouting program within your Council. He/She needs to be honest and say that your donation will likely may not directly benefit your Troop or Pack, but could offer indirect benefits. Also, the presenter needs to mention that your donation is tax deductible and can be paid out over the course of the year rather than in one lump sum. An finally, it should mentioned that any amount that you can give, regardless of a how small, is greatly appreciated. To my last point, some people balk at the "suggested minumum donation" to FOS and they end up not giving anything. Folks who believe in Scouting want to contribute, but as others have mentioned, you have to give them reasons to contribute beyond any gifts they are making to their local unit. I have two boys in the Scouting program and it can be costly at times. When I count the other charitable contributions I make to other oranizations, there's not much room for the "suggested dontation" for FOS.

The causes of an Eagle Mill? It's easier for adults to take the boys to merit badge colleges or merit badge classes than to take them camping every month. It's a watered-down program that minimizes the outdoors. Troops in this category will do some camping, but only to the extent to satisfy the camping requirements for First Class and the Eagle-required Camping merit badge. The mentality today is different than it was when I was a Scout in the 70's. When I was 2nd Class Scout, I had better camping, fire-building, and outdoor skills than some of the Star and Life Scouts I've witnessed today. I was in a troop that did alot of primitive camping and rushing through the ranks was not an emphasis of our program. I learned alot from frequent hands-on experience rather than checking off requirements on a completion list.

"...We need to follow the rules and regs." Agree. Otherwise, things would get out of hand and the uniform would become a joke lacking any purpose for wearing it. That said, taking a few liberties wearing a little extra "bling" at your local Pack Meeting or Den Meeting is not going to hurt anything. As a Cubmaster, I realize there are times to be very serious and times to havefun. In more public settings at aDistrict, Council, or civic event, I encourage the Cubs to remove any unnecessary "extras" from their uniforms and keep only to the basic insignia and rank badges.

In Cub Scouts, we love those temporary patches that hang off your pocket buttons. I know the guide says the right pocket but I don't care if anyone wears them on the left pocket. If a leader wants to wear one on each pocket or several, just for fun, then that's okay with me. I generally follow the insignia guide to the letter, but it's only a guide and not military law. Have fun wearing those temp patches! They show off where you have been and what you have been doing in the Scouting program.

I have boy that's joining our Pack this fall and he is repeating the first grade. However, he will be joining the Wolf Den 2nd graders because of his age and to be with his friends. His mom and dad are good with this decision.

In my very large council, it's standard practice to have parents and non-members observe OA ceremonies. It was that way when I was a scout in the 1970's and it's still that way today. When I did my brotherhood ordeal, we had our final ceremony in park with public access. Even though we were in a discreet location of the park, it would have been possible for anyone walking by to stop and observe. No secret organizations and I like that.

My recommendation for any Roundtable Commissioner is to ensure that you deliver what you have promised for the Roundtable meeting. In the past, I stopped attending RT's because they were never prepared and it turned out to be a waste of time. The reason I come to Roundtable is for any of the following: Event information, updated program information, pick up supplies/materials, or share ideas (roundtable concept). Finally, make sure the "corporal's guard of attendees" are welcoming to new faces and new attendees.

I can't believe what I am reading. The thought never occurred to me that using squirt guns could even remotely violate G2SS. I concur with others that there is no real safety risk here. A squirt gun does not even qualify as a "simulated firearm." In Cub Scouting, we are often trained to "keep it simple, make it fun." In my Pack, water guns are a simple and enjoyable active outlet for the boys. Until I receive a "stop doing that" order from my District or Council official, I will continue to allow squirt guns as an outdoor option.

American Heritage Girls (AHG) was started as an alternative to the Girl Scouts USA. They are a scout-like organization but cannot use the name "Scout" because the BSA and the GSUSA have exclusive rights to that name granted to them by their Federal Charters. As you can see, their creed is very much in line with the ideals of the BSA. http://www.ahgonline.org/pages/page.asp?page_id=19319 The AHG Creed: As an American Heritage Girl, I promise to be: Compassionate - Understanding others in fellowship, empathy, kindness, and caring. Respect others' opinions and emotions. Helpful - Willingly serve others. Honest - Always tell the truth and keep my promise. Loyal - True to God, family, friends, community and country. Perseverant - Continuing to strive toward a goal despite obstacles. Pure - Keep my mind and body pure. Resourceful - Wisely use my time, materials and talents. Respectful - Honor my country, be obedient to those in authority and courteous to all. Responsible - Accountable for my own actions. Reliable in all situations. Reverent - Faithful and honoring to God. Respectful to the beliefs of others.

"...is whether such a group can have a symbiotic relationship with an organization such as BSA that is pluralistic in nature." Sure it can. The BSA is filled with charter organizations that are exclusive in their religious beliefs and yet believe in what the BSA stands for and represents. The Scout Oath and Law does a great job of bringing different religious and community groups together for one common goal - character development for our youth.

"...BSA uniforming guidelines aren't enforceable, in any significant way that I can see." Agree. The uniform is not required to be member in the BSA. That said, I have yet to see any Scout that was active in a Troop that did not own at least a uniform shirt.

"...and it is also more understandable that parents who are new to an organization like the BSA (as most cub parents are), may be more reluctant to buy their 8 year old a pair of $50 pants to be worn once a week." Actually, the Cub Scout Switchback (zip-off) Pants are $24.99 and double as pants and shorts. A much better value than in the past when the shorts by themselves were about $22.

The shirt has a nice design but it appears that it's only available in 100%polyester fiber per the ScoutStuff website. No thanks at this time. Cotton or Cotton/Poly is my preference.

I will be awarding pins to the boys based on the den/age group (Tiger, Wolf, Bear, etc.) they were promoted to after June 1st. Yes, if a Webelo has earned it once then it is possible to earn it again as a Webelo. While their is room for interpretation, I believe awarding based on their current Den is the way to go.

We avoid snacks at Pack Meetings unless it's a special event. We like to keep our Church's CO facilities clean and want to avoid any stains on the carpet and any clean up that would be needed afterwards.