Horizon

Our Troop: Since I became SM: No oversized Sheath Knives (changed from no sheath knives). What is oversized? Bigger than the Buck the Scoutmaster has carried since he was a Scout. I argue with a member of my Committee about this one regularly. I prefer a sheath knife to a folding knife without a lock. Policies from before I became SM that continue: No bottled water, paper towel, paper plates, or other disposable items. No cans of soda UNLESS we are backpacking. If you are willing to carry it, go ahead. Electronics - I don't want to see them, I don't want to hear th

No plastic water bottles, only refillable / refilled. No paper plates or other disposable dishware. No paper towels (in truth - one roll exists on a campout). The boys are to bring dishtowels instead. The patrols (and adults) still waste too much food I think. We are getting better on that.

Ninth district ruled that it is un-Constitutional to require someone to attend AA.

I am Scoutmaster for a Troop of around 80 (and growing). I could not do it without Patrol Method and mixed age patrols. I CAN'T micromanage activities in each patrol site, there are too many of them. Instead, I depend on my SPL and the PLs (the PLC) to keep things going, and focus my mentoring on them. One difference - the Patrols in my Troop are 10+ boys enrolled, since that results in closer to 8 on any given activity. I have one mega-Patrol at 15 or so, but none of them wants to leave or change so I leave them as they are. They have great Esprit de Corps, who am I to argue?

I am on the same path, just ahead on the trail: 1) With 50% participation, I let my patrols go to 15 or so. That still results in a solid 7-8 on a campout from my 5 patrols. 2) I don't do provisional patrols. If two patrols want to work together - that is their choice. 3) 3 ASPLs - one handles Patrols, one handles the staff (QM, Scribe, Historian, Librarian, etc.), one is in charge of activities and planning campouts. 4) Two quartermasters, plus every patrol provides a patrol QM for QM days. 5) We are limited in our camping facilities due to size. We have not s

Our trailer has a steel mesh cage that holds the larger refillable propane tanks (one per patrol). This keeps them outside of a closed container, and protects them as well. We also have racks for hauling poles for pioneering projects (where we camp, no gathering of wood is allowed).

Beavah: Your comment about birth rates is off a bit too. Birth rates in all educated, first world nations are lower than the 3rd and 4th. More specifically, it has been shown that education and work opportunities for women are heavily correlated with a lower birth rate. Obviously, access to various means of contraception also has an impact. Immigrant communities drop their birth rate in the 2nd generation, if not in generation 1.5 (depending on when they entered the US, and how you classify someone born outside, yet raised in the US). However, if all of that was creating a ge

BrentAllen: While it is true (based on some data sets) that people alter their place on the conservative / liberal scale as they age, you are incorrect about the trend regarding the acceptance of homosexuality. The trend continues to show more acceptance of gays and lesbians over time, and the voting polls of California showed that it was those over 65 that were majority opposed, with those under 65 in favor. More data here: http://www.aei.org/docLib/20080603-Homosexuality.pdf "ACCEPTANCE: In 1973, when the National Opinion Research Center at the University of Chicago firs

Again, assuming the local option allows a Troop's Charter partner to choose their leaders, I don't think that we will lose as many as we think. It will have to be emphasized that there is NO forced change being made to the Troops, only that Troops will now have the OPTION of choosing their leaders from a minimally larger pool. A few people have brought up the issue of gay marriage, and used that to discuss the level of support for gay rights. I think it is important to realize that in California, the votes against Proposition 8 have been analyzed. More than two-thirds (67 percent) of v

Local option would become the new system (as Gern put it). Some Troops would do nothing, some would openly accept gays and lesbians, others would specifically forbid them I could see some Charter Orgs suddenly being asked to make the decision. Our relationship to our Charter Org is minimal, without a single member of the congregation a Scout and one Scouter being a member and our COR. There might be some conflict at Camporee type events when the "gay troop" shows up (and you know that certain troops would get that name attached to them). A few Troops might break-up when the decision

His lawsuit seems to be that the school can't allow a discriminatory organization to use the school facilities. That question will probably revolve around usage rules that the school district follows, and determining if the Scouts are given any sort of preferential treatment.

Nope, but we also don't wait on the chits either. I have Instructors (senior level experienced Scouts) in the Troop who ensure that every new Scout is cornered and learns & earns all of their chits ASAP. The safe use of knives, axes, hatchets, fire, and saws is part of our break-in process for new Scouts in the Troop.

"Personally, I'd take the 17 1/2 year old Eagle over the 14...clearly the 14's parents earned the Eagle. " Really? I have seen high levels of parent participation at all levels. My younger Eagles tend to have involved parents - not helicopter, but Assistant Scoutmaster types. This meant that the Scout never missed a meeting or a campout since dad was coming anyways. My own son "benefited" in this way. Since I am at every meeting and campout, he was too. He couldn't HELP but be involved and advancing. My 17 1/2 year olds come in a few different buckets. - There is the one wi

JMHawkins - no sweat. As I mentioned, I do get testy on the subject since I came from a Troop described as an Eagle Mill, and I am a young Eagle as well. My older son earned his at 15, because he did not do the work to earn it at 14 (he delayed action on parts of his project and then discovered that some things don't happen overnight). Should a boy get an Eagle, or any rank, just for showing up? Of course not. But let me tell you how I did it. I did not miss a single Troop meeting. I did not miss a single campout, and we camped every month. I did not miss a single summer camp (plus

When I see the words "Eagle Mill" I tend to take a walk away from my computer until I calm down a bit. The term is offensive and insulting. I EARNED my Eagle a few weeks before my 14th birthday. I will put my ESLP up for review at any time. I will happily discuss my skills, my PORs, my merit badge sash, and my continued dedication to Scouting. Even better - here is an article about my Scoutmaster and my old Troop: http://www.tulsaworld.com/scene/article.aspx?subjectid=370&articleid=20100919_38_D1_CUTLIN380568 He runs what some posters here would call an Eagle Mill. As a

Twocubdad nailed a lot of the issues. To do another comparison, compare to NON school sponsored athletics such as soccer. AYSO has more than 50,000 teams and more than 650,000 players (boys and girls) with brackets from U5 through U19. They offer recreational soccer plus they are experimenting with a competitive bracket. In AYSO EVERYONE plays, regardless of whether they come to practice. Players are guaranteed to play half of every match as long as they show up. Parents can choose to use it as a drop off babysitting operation. Every player makes a team. Every team gets to play. N

Kudu: At every site, I tell the Patrols to get as far away as possible. The Patrols are asked to also have distinct sites, and to have their flag proudly posted. In the past year, at ONE site was the Troop able to get 50 feet between Patrols, and 150 feet from the adults. So, when the territory is available, we spread out to take up the maximum space and distance. That type of camping site is very difficult to get around here, and we like to go somewhere new every month (we have around 18 sites on our rotation).

Accept the Scout. Deny the parents. The boy could use the Troop. The Troop does not need the parents. Tell the parents that you welcome the Scout, but that their input is not needed and not necessary. You just want them to drop off the Scout, and pick him up on time.

Older boys teach? Check Higher ranks signoff? Check Problems with some skills atrophying? Check With pop-up Coleman tents, no wind, and minimal rain - our knot skills are not tested without creating testing conditions. When I was a Scout, we slept in canvas tents and your knots determined your warmth and dryness. This is no longer so for my Troop here in SoCal. If we want to do lashings, we have to add gardening poles to the Troop gear for the campout. There is no gathering of wood at any site we camp at in our area. Lighting fires? Those are prohibited most months of

onevoice - how does being gay make someone in violation of the oath and law?

onevoice: "And please don't resort to leveling the "bigot" charge at anyone that disagrees with you. " I don't. I level the bigot charge at people who are bigots. There are plenty who I disagree with, but when someone decides that my friends have a birth defect that makes them unworthy and unwelcome in Scouting - that person is a bigot. Period. Scout units used to keep blacks out, but over time units integrated. Scout units used to keep Jews out, but over time units integrated. Scout units used to keep women out of leadership positions, but over time this has changed as well.

Penta - it would take years, and that is fine. I doubt there would be a huge shift, and much of it would depend on how each unit deals with it. I know that in my neck of the woods one to two units would be created overnight at my church. Our youth group (mainly a high school group) would add a Venturing Crew component, and we might also start a Boy Scout Troop as well if we had enough boys of the right age. The Crew Advisor would be the same gay male that runs all of our youth programs, who takes the kids on ski trips, and who wrote the letter as the religious leader for my son's Eagle

onevoice: "First off, it's not your organization, its all our organization, and no here cares how many knots you have." The knot comment was there for the posters here who have followed all of the threads on adults wearing knots, etc. Yes, it is our organization, which makes it also my organization. onevoice: "No bigots are trying to chase you anywhere, or ruin BSA. It is you that is trying to change the status quo. I would maintain that it is you who are the bigot. Why is your version of bigotry only when someone else doesn't agree with YOU? You want another organization, you go

We should have the adult volunteer form and the scout registration form available online, with the requirement that a copy be printed and submitted with a wet signature. There could even be an online way for the COR and CC to electronically approve. This is what AYSO does through their eAYSO system, and it makes volunteer registration much easier. The only downside is the need to remember passwords (I always have to have my pw re-sent to me each year when I do my annual update). While we are at it, can we also find a way to add roles for someone already in the system. I hate havin

onevoice: I believe, and science backs me, that there is a biological basis to sexual orientation. Based on that, yes, I equate gay with black - as do many Americans, and as do the laws of many states in the US, as does my congregation, and as does the congregations of of many of my Scouts. Further, I completely disagree with the BSA's interpretation of morally straight to preclude gays. I find it interesting that the BSA allows local control to determine every other aspect of the Scout Oath and Law and how it applies to adult volunteers, but specifically prohibits gays and lesbian a