Hal_Crawford

Merlyn:

I do believe that is the first time I have ever heard someone call Ike a religious fanatic.

Hal

Liz:

Please remember that costumes refers to more than just the cheap stuff they sell at Halloween. Call your clothes garb if you want but please don't disparage the word "costume".

I work in the theatre and supervise a couple of highly skilled costumers who do all the things you describe and then some. They are well versed in the design and construction of a wide variety of period styles from the ancient Egyptians, Greeks and Romans to the clothing of today. One has a Master of Fine Arts in Costume Design, the other has a professional wardrobe background in film and TV including including major motion pictures and work for HBO. Both have made careers of costuming. I have nothing but respect for them and their craft.

Sometimes even professional costumes are cheap (a movie might use thousands and not everyone is in the foreground) but they are often quite elaborate, expensive and have to be built to withstand more abuse than would happen in real life. Sometimes they are wrong, Showtime's the Tudors while entertaining messes up the costumes as badly as they do the history. Good costumes should be historically correct in every way (unless they are required to do things that historical garments would not like quick changes) and often actually antique garments. Costumes are rarely cheap.

Some parts of a costume might be called regalia, at least by the dictionary definition but I've never met anyone in the industry who called what they make garb; never heard of anyone earning an MFA in garb; never heard of anyone winning an Oscar, a Tony or an Emmy for garb and I've never seen the word garb in a theatre program or in the credit crawl.

Sorry about the rant.

YIS,

Hal

THE GOSHEN GRACE

(Goshen Scout Reservation)

For Goodness

For Opportunity

For Strength

For Happiness

For Enjoyment

For Nourishment

We thank Thee, O God.

(Yes, it spells out GOSHEN!)

PHILMONT GRACE

For Food

For Raiment

For Life

For Opportunity

For Friendship and Fellowship

We thank Thee, O Lord

(Doesn't spell out anything unless FRLOFF is a word.)

For a sheet containing these and other graces, go to the following link:

http://www.boyscouts-ncac.org/openrosters/DocDownload.asp?orgkey=1933&id=32899

Apologies for double posting. I have no idea why my post from the this morning reappeared tonight.

Apologies for double posting. I have no idea why my post from the this morning reappeared tonight.

I saw this in the morning paper and it seems appropriate:

http://news.yahoo.com/comics/brevity;_ylt=AtEZJsSfZnb6RM4bsaeWUrwDwLAF

YIS:

Hal

I saw this in the morning paper and it seems appropriate:

http://news.yahoo.com/comics/brevity;_ylt=AtEZJsSfZnb6RM4bsaeWUrwDwLAF

YIS:

Hal

Nice chart but it begs the question: why do they make Battle Dress Uniforms in child sizes?

Seriously, I have thought for a long time (based on strongly worded feedback from our scouts) that if the scout pants were either BDU or zip off cargos they would be a lot more popular. Glad BSA finally got the memo.

From the current (2008) Eagle application (bottom of second page, in red):

EDITIONS OF THIS APPLICATION PREVIOUS TO THE 2008 REVISION SHOULD NOT BE USED.

Also on the application:

Any Venturer who achieved the First Class rank as a Boy Scout in a troop or Varsity Scout in a team may continue working for the Star, Life, and Eagle Scout ranks and Eagle Palms while registered as a Venturer up to his 18th birthday.

I would suggest that you put this form in front of them and ask them to read to you the part that shows that they are right and you are wrong. If need be, highlight the above passages. You might also highlight the unit number blank where it says, "Troop, Team, Crew or Ship.

Good luck.

MMH:

The new health form says the same thing. If you have insurance they want a copy of the card; if not, write "None".

309:

Speaking of the Army's H/W standards, there is an article on line today about the Army considering a fat camp because they are losing so many recruits because of obesity:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090112/ap_on_re_us/military_recruiting_obesity

Not suggesting that BSA open a Philmont Phat Pharm but....

I think the reason that it is not spelled out on the membership form is that the policy isn't same from council to council. The form and the (soon to be obsolete) Class 1 are used nationwide. It would seem to be a good idea to have a consistent policy nationwide but there may be good reasons that it is what it is.

Hal

Our council provides the insurance with the $1 charge (not optional) at rechartering. It serves as secondary insurance for those that have their own and primary for those that don't. Good peace of mind. Because of this coverage, I strongly encourage all parents participating in any troop activity to register so they are covered.

One Hour (aptly named considering the topic) has the right idea. In fact if someone published "how to do a Blue and Gold" this should be the model. I would change one thing, do the slide-show before the Webelos 2 acknowledgment. Show the slides while they eat dessert and then one last goodbye to the big guys.

One thing I have learned in over thirty years in theatre... if only one thing is going to get a standing ovation, end with it.

This looks VERY cool. When we go to district camporees we can't have fire rings or pits in our sites so we either use stoves (fine for cooking but not a place to gather after dark) or we put a trash can lid on bricks and build a fire. This looks like a much more artful approach. The compatibility with a Dutch Oven is a real plus.

Thanks for the tip!

Hal

The Boy Scout Songbook

http://www.scoutstuff.org/BSASupply/ItemDetail.aspx?cat=01RTL&ctgy=PRODUCTS&c2=BOOKS_LIT&C3=BK_MISC&C4=&LV=3&item=33224&prodid=33224^8^01RTL&

has a lot of campfire appropriate songs, many with chords. Some are not in guitar friendly keys so it will help if he know how to transpose using a capo. Waltzing Matilda, for instance is in E-Flat which is no fun but transposed to C it isn't hard at all. If he hasn't learned to do this yet he should; it will expand the range of songs he can play.

I found out that with G, Em, C and D7 (or C-Am-F-G7, if he can handle a barre chord) you can fake your way through almost any folk song. I don't recommend trying the process in front of the troop but with a little work at home he can probably develop a pretty good repertoire.

The other folk music tip I learned as a teen (doing co-ed camping with my church group) is there is always a girl who can sing looking for a guy with a guitar.

Best of luck to your young troubadour.

Hal

Where are the cutoffs for blood pressure and cholesterol? The Jamboree and Philmont both have standards for BP and they will check it when you arrive. I suspect that if they had cholesterol limits there would be no one left to check anyone's BP. To me it makes sense to have standards for specific risk factors for specific activities/locations. The application of the height/weight charts is just too broad. One size does not fit all.

Liz is right that the presence of AEDs and other medical resources could change the equation. As I have said before, our council scout reservation is right on the edge of the evacuation limit. It depends on where you put the end of the tape measure and how fast an ambulance can travel on mountain roads as to whether they have would have to enforce the H/W rules. But they have a better than average health lodge with an MD. Each camp first aid room has an AED (there are 6 camps in addition to the headquarters camp with the health lodge) . Should this change the rules? BSA is encouraging all council camps to purchase and maintain AEDs. Should the camps that do that get a waiver on the evacuation distance? I think so but what the heck do I know?

I hope that these are discussions that are being had between the councils and national and that the information hasn't yet been shared with us mere mortals. Full implementation is a year away so there is time to study impact and perhaps adjust the policy to fit the realities.

BTW, our SM showed the new form to our troop committee last week. I wasn't there but I sense that "ballistic" describes the reaction. It wasn't the H/W table that raised their ire. I don't think anyone in the room has a kid who would be affected. The issue was the SS# and the insurance cards. They are going to research whether the SS# might be required by hospitals in Virginia. I can see the concern about the insurance card if it still uses the SS# but I think most companies have moved away from that. Personally, I always wanted my son to be in close proximity to his insurance card and he started carrying a copy of it as soon as he started carrying a wallet. I wonder if the committee members remember that they put their SS numbers on their adult applications? Oh, well.

Point well taken. I apologize to both of you if I my questions were poorly worded or misconstrued as criticism. I still don't know if I would approve unsupervised backpacking but I am open to hear how others deal with the issues so that we can make informed decisions if and when the subject comes up.

Hal

So pack your troop on a bus, come to Washington and march down Constitution Avenue with the rest of us. I actually have no authority to issue such an invite but I don't the NCAC or National would object to even more scouts marching past the White House (especially since there will be a guy from your home state living there).

YIS,

Hal

So pack your troop on a bus, come to Washington and march down Constitution Avenue with the rest of us. I actually have no authority to issue such an invite but I don't the NCAC or National would object to even more scouts marching past the White House (especially since there will be a guy from your home state living there).

YIS,

Hal

Barry:

Arrogance is dangerous. You assume that because you have never seen your scouts do anything stupid that they are smarter then adults. You assume that because you let your scouts backpack alone that they are better trained. Better experienced to be sure but better trained? I read something recently that said that an expert may just be someone who's mistakes haven't caught up with them yet. Do you know for sure how close they may have come to disaster when you weren't there? Would they tell you? Really?

As a kid my parents gave me a lot of freedom. I walked to school by myself when I was 6... in Ankara, Turkey. When I was 11 or 12 I had a BB range in my basement that my friends and I used pretty much unsupervised (to some of their parents' horror). When I was a teen ager, I was free to travel on my own around Rio de Janeiro... not as dangerous a city then as it is now but it wasn't Disney World either. I can tell you that I did a some really stupid things as a teenager that nearly got me killed and no grown-up ever knew. I didn't want to tell them because I didn't want to them to limit my freedom. I have no doubts that my son (who is an Eagle scout and was generally a good kid) did things that would make me shudder. I doubt that your scouts would be any more open with you than I was with my parents.

Yes, you have been an SM; yes, you have had more sons than I. I respect that but it does not necessarily mean that your scouts are better trained than those in my troop or safe on their own. They might just be lucky.

I am working with a troop that for too long has thought that scouting meant car camping and a week of summer camp. That has changed in the last couple of years through the efforts of the scouts, another ASM and myself. We now do more backpacking and we had crew do a high adventure trek last summer. The SM is supportive of this change though he has not seen it as a priority in the past. He may be stepping down soon and I may be moving up. The troop has started to regain lost membership in the last year, perhaps because of these changes.

I have taken every training course offered short of Woodbadge and I have never heard anyone advocate sending scouts backpacking unsupervised. I'm not saying that makes it wrong. I am trying to figure out how to do this within the BSA rules. The devil is always in the details. I have asked specific questions which you have not answered. I'm trying to find the ground between "Go forth, you are the masters of your destiny" and "no-you'll put someone's eye out". I am trying to figure out how you and others deal with these issues. Just saying "training" is not enough. I am trying to understand how to give scouts this level of freedom and independence while still managing risk and ensuring safety. If I asked the same questions of scouts planning an outing I would want better answers. You haven't really been very helpful; defensive and critical of others is more like it.

I gather that you train the boys the best you can, ignore the parts of G2SS that are inconvenient, tell the parents its all good, then cross your fingers and pray you're right. Did I miss anything?

Hal

Sounds like the European measurement is based on a meter...about 39"

Hal

Proud Eagle:

NCAC is also including Cubs so I guess exceptions are being sanctioned. Our camporee will be held at Goshen Scout Reservation which has 6 camps: 2 CS, 3 BS and a High Adventure base camp. In addition there is a headquarters camp that can be used for reservation wide gatherings. I suspect that with tens of thousands of scouts spread out around a large lake, the cubs and boy scouts will have mostly separate activities.

This will be the first NCAC council wide gathering since 1975.

Best wishes for your Camporee in Kentucky.

Hal

Barry:

This question has not come up in our troop. I am a ASM so it is not ultimately my call. That may change. I am not sure which way I would go if the this was proposed so I am very interested in how others resolve these issues. I feel that safety is extremely important and I take my responsibility for the scouts safety very seriously... more than I would have for my own son when he was a boy (he was mine to mess up, they aren't). If scouts asked tomorrow I would vote no based on where they are in terms of age and experience... a year from now I might feel differently but first I need to be convinced that they are ready and then the parents need to be convinced. I'm trying to lean into my discomfort here and understand how you deal with issues of safety and where BSA says supervision is required. The first rule in BSA Trek Safely is "qualified supervision". I am trying to figure out how to justify ignoring rule number one.

But what do you do when G2SS or other BSA policies/rules get in the way? The stove is one example, I am sure that there are others that seem to contradict the idea of patrol backpacking. I personally think the need to supervise the use of stoves is a chickens**t rule but that's not my call to make. BSA says that it's the rule and a scout (or scouter) is obedient. What kind of example do I set if I say "sure you are supposed to do this under adult supervision but I won't tell if you won't"?

On the up side, the scouts would hike faster and farther without having to constantly stop to allow adult leaders to catch up.

Hal

Hal

I stand corrected.

It is pretty much a formality in our district. Our council delegates that approval process to the district advancement committee's Eagle board which essentially delegates it to the the Eagle board member working with the scout. Approval has been close enough to automatic to not be noticeable.

Our district does expect letters of recommendation. In our troop the SM sends out a form to the references. We have held EBORs with as few as three letters having been received.

In our district the EBORs are scheduled and organized by the troop with one or more Eagle reps. It seems to facilitate the process of getting the EBOR done in a timely manner.

Hal