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Changes coming in 2014

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  • Changes coming in 2014

    It appears national will be doing more support for and promotion of the program so perhaps all is not lost with Venturing yet. The awards are being revamped but I don't know of any venturer who actually cares about the awards, unlike the awards focus of the Boy Scout program. (Can you imagine if they revamped BS awards to change Eagle?)

    Clearly a program that is still struggling for an identity, but it is still a relatively young program.

  • #2
    My experience is that the guys coming from scouting don't care about the awards......or the leadership positions. They've been doing that their whole scout life. The girls on the other hand seem to run the crew leadership and do work on awards. I went to a young lady's Silver Award ceremony this weekend.


    • #3
      It's sad that a lot of Venturers don't want to earn the awards. Who wouldn't like to have a nice shiny medal hanging on their uniform? Apparently, a lot of Venturers don't.
      I guess most Boy Scouts are so tired of working on rank requirements that by the time they go to Venturing they just don't care about them anymore. Of course, ranks are, to an extent, required in the Boy Scouts. Comparing percentages between Boy Scout ranks and Venturing awards isn't really fair, they should be comparing percentages of the Boy Scout Hornaday and National Outdoor awards with the Venturing awards.


      • EagleScout441
        EagleScout441 commented
        Editing a comment
        If they don't like the Bronze awards why don't they get the awards they do like: Kayaking BSA, NOVA, LNT, Hornady--the list keeps going. The Bronze award required for the Quest award goes hand in hand with the Quest award, there isn't a Bronze award requirement for the Ranger award, and for the Silver award the Venturer gets to choose which one he/she earns.
        And when it comes to the new awards, the first "level" in each "pillar" will be very simple. But I'm sure that the upper levels will be just as or more complex than the current Gold and Silver awards.
        Last edited by EagleScout441; 08-22-2013, 12:30 PM.

      • BadenP
        BadenP commented
        Editing a comment
        441 I see your buying the National BS on their revamping Venturing which I have no doubt after almost 15 years in Venturing will be a disaster for the program. Second a Venturer though not required to get the Bronze in Outdoors as a prerequisite for Ranger, the Bronze in Sports for Quest, and a Bronze in Religious Life for Trust each Bronze completes at least half of the requirements for those awards so MOST Venturers will do the Bronze to see if the advanced award is something they want to commit to. Your comments on Bronze proves your unfamiliarity with Venturing as a whole so your conclusions are false and misleading. Try reading a Venturing handbook sometime so you will know what you are talking about for a change. instead of just blowing smoke like you usually do.
        Last edited by BadenP; 08-22-2013, 11:04 AM.

      • ScoutNut
        ScoutNut commented
        Editing a comment
        Chill out BadenP - ES441 is a 15 year old YOUTH member. No, he is not a Venturer, but from his past posts it seems he is planning on joining.

        Yes, he is a bit of a fanatic about Venturing, and does spout off quite a bit on a program he has no first hand knowledge of, however - keep in mind - he is 15.

    • #4
      Chill out, besides, how do you know that the new awards will be a train wreck? You're just speculating, all we know about them is the concept and the format.
      Right now the only thing that is a standard in the whole Venturing program is the award system, they are 1. Trying to reorganize part of the award system so that Venturers might actually earn the awards. 2. They trying to unify Venturers by at least having them wear the same Class A uniform, Venturers can design all the Class B's they want.
      From your first comment above I thought that you were saying that Venturers in your crew didn't like the Bronze awards, and by the way, the Bronze in Sports is required for Quest, and the Bronze in Religious Life is required for TRUST, and the Outdoor Bronze is completely finished automatically if the Ranger award is earned.
      I might not have earned any of these awards, but I know a lot more about them than pretty much any Venturer. Just like I know more about the Hornaday awards than the majority of Boy Scouts. I've done my research.
      "he is a bit of a fanatic about Venturing"
      Well, considering fanatic means "filled with "great energy or enthusiasm in pursuit of a cause or an objective," " I'd have to agree with you, I'll take that as a complement.
      My membership might not be official, but I already know which crew I'm going to join and what I plan on focusing on. I like to know exactly what I'm getting into before I join, hence my knowledge regarding the awards.


      • BadenP
        BadenP commented
        Editing a comment
        441 Since you are just a 15 kid you still have a lot to learn about the politics of scouting and how most changes from National to the scouting programs over the years have not been to its benefit. I have been in scouting for 30+ years and seen it all, you still have a lot you need to learn and experience before you pass judgment. Get into a well run and organized crew so you can see firsthand what Venturing is all about.

      • qwazse
        qwazse commented
        Editing a comment
        Since I'm pretty "chill" most days, let me explain BP's leeriness of National from a more ambivalent position.

        A few years ago, Bill Evans came to talk to our council's VOA. He could have talked about anything, but he emphasized how important it was that every venturer strive for gold and silver awards. No matter how much merit his words may have had, it did not resonate with any of those youth in the room. How do I know? Not one of them have since earned them! In fact most of those youth never returned for a VOA meeting or council-wide venturing activity. That's one an indication a that National is out of touch with the boots on the ground.

        Now, I would be thrilled if kids in my crew did work the award program. But, only 1 in the past six years pursued a bronze award. The statistics nationwide support the notion that this is fairly standard. BP's crew is exceptional in its level of advancement. Sounds like you are eyeing is too. But for every one of those, there are a half dozen like mine. They just need me to give them the number of that climbing guide.

        The second bothersome sign: we talk about youth led, but I have not heard a regional officer come out strongly in favor of the new method. In other words, however nifty the powerpoint was, the most experienced youth aren't blogging things like "It's about time!" "Can't wait to switch over to the new advancement track!" (Now some of the regional officers are enthused about the one-oath initiative. Others were thrilled about going to Jambo. So, if something enthuses these youth, they'll tell us about it.) Instead, the vibe I'm getting is a big "Meh!"

        So you see, most of us Advisors on the ground find ourselves working around National to provide the program that our youth are asking for, and they don't seem to be asking for a 13-step personal growth plan.

    • #5
      We have a mix of members: some are cross-registered, some are scouting dropouts (primarily because of the leadership of the local troop), some are female and some are boys who've never been involved in scouting ever or were cubs for a year or two. My son was our first Eagle but 5 of our cross-registered boys are already eagles and 4 or 5 are still planning to work on it. After a year or so of no interest in earning Venturing awards, the kids have decided to work on obtaining ranger awards. They want EVERYONE, from the 14 year olds to the 20 year olds, to earn it and are going to set up a program. Obviously, some of the kids have more skills and experience than others, but they are great peer leaders and mentors to each other. I've never seen a group of kids so wide in age range that is so close. My youngest son and his friends said they didn't fear Freshman hazing this year because they knew their crew buddies in older grades would watch out for them - and they did. We've had only one issue with awards - a young lady joined and wanted to get a ranger award IMMEDIATELY - in time to put it on her college apps. Her brother advanced more quickly and she quit - she was angry that the crew advisor made her demonstrate knowledge of skills and didn't require her brother to do it, She didn't get that her brother's status as a Life Scout (since made Eagle) meant that he had already shown he knew many of the skills.

      I personally could care less about the awards. I was the Tiger den mom whose kids had no beads but had done all of the achievements. To me, the essence of scouting is camaraderie and learning leadership and peer skills. One of the best young men I know went all the way through scouting and left at 18 having earned not one merit badge. He never hesitated to help another scout study or practice a skill, is one of the kindest children I have ever encountered. loved camping and scouting but had zero interest in advancement for its own sake. And, no, he's not my child though I would be proud if he were.

      On the plus side of the awards, my second son was a mediocre college candidate. He was a national merit commended student but had only a C+ average because homework bored him. He was accepted into a college and given a small scholarship because he is an Eagle scout - I know because my daughter attends the same school and works in admissions and the director told her that.


      • #6
        National does surveys all over the place for everything else. Why not, as a stupid suggestion, just survey the current venturers and ASK THEM WHAT THEY want out of the program. Then make up the rules. If they don't want awards, then drop them. If they do, what do THEY think they should be, etc.

        I know such a suggestion will never get any traction, but I would think it would be a good start.



        • #7
          All the Venturing Awards are VOLUNTARY and are NOT considered advancement awards like in boy scouts. In our crew the teens choose whether or not what they want to earn all or none. Crews can organize around any activity allowed by the BSA and should not be run like a troop. It is NOT a matter of badges earned since their is NO advancement in rank in Venturing. National's pencil pushers has NEVER really gotten a hold of what Venturing is all about, maybe they should try reading the Venturing manuals for a change instead of just making sweeping changes to the program, without rhyme or reason.


          • Kristian
            Kristian commented
            Editing a comment
            and that is the problem here. what many of the venture scouts want is just to run their program and organize the activities they enjoy as they see fit. advancement is much less important than actually having an enjoyable program.

            of course this would conflict directly with the corporate types that see the lack of advancement and awards as contrary to their JTE statistical disaster.