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  • BSA Favor Change In WV Constitution

    To maintain tax-exempt status while renting Summit facilities, including an 80,000 seat stadium, to non-charitable groups, the BSA would need an amendment to the West Virginia Constitution

    "Current state law would only allow charitable institutions to use it for a charitable purpose.

    A bill calling for a vote on a proposed constitutional amendment passed the state Senate earlier this year but was not taken up in the House of Delegates." =

    IMO, it is a stretch to get it both ways when it comes to taxes, particularly when you start competing with tax paying businesses, but maybe we'll see Monster Trunks Derbies at the Summit?

  • #2
    Sure why not....

    In my opinion it is an everyone wins kind of proposal....

    Our facilities get rented, the state gets taxes on what is going on.......


    • teginder81
      teginder81 commented
      Editing a comment
      truly agree

  • #3
    So, what exactly is a "monster trunk derby"? Large boxes on wheels with remote controls; or maybe very large elephants? Just wondering.


    • #4
      Ha you got me , pre-coffee posts are offten subjeck to tpyos...

      I heard some local group(s) had some interest in booking rock concerts at the Summit's 80,000 seat "amphitheater on grass.

      But some stupid with a flare gun,
      Burned the place to the ground.
      Smoke on the water and fire in the sky.

      (This message has been edited by RememberSchiff)


      • #5
        Sounds bizarre to me.

        My council, a nonprofit entity, can rent its facilities to outside groups, including commercial businesses, without this concern. Does W.Va. have something screwy in its constitution?

        I imagine that would affect a huge number of other NPs, too - like the art museum opening its galleries up for a speed dating service, or a private college renting its auditorium for a corporate retreat.


        • #6
          From Charleston Gazette
          "There's already talk that Bridge Day festival organizers might be interested in leasing the Boy Scouts' new stadium for concerts. But the Scouts can't lease out the amphitheater and other facilities to outside groups without jeopardizing its tax-exempt status.

          McGowan said the Summit would host only a small number of public events -- mostly concerts -- each year.

          The Scouts also may temporarily lease out other Summit facilities, including camping sites, a "Leadership Excellence Center," "Better Body Health Center," and technology center, McGowan said."

          More info


          • #7
            If they are allowed to rent to outside groups will they be allowed to pick and choose who they rent to? They could find themselves faced with rental applications from groups that would not be seen as consistent with the image of the BSA. They could be exposed to lawsuits if they discriminate. There is plenty of money to be made but they could be opening a Pandora's box.


            • #8
              Non-profits rent things all the time. This is regularly presumed in the IRS publications. Churches and religious organizations, like other tax exempt organizations, may engage in income-producing activities unrelated to their tax-exempt purposes, as long as the unrelated activities are not a substantial part of the organizations activities.I'm curious about what part of the WV constitution would jeopardize this. The IRS says that an organization can jeopardize its tax-exempt status, and that there are several requirements to maintain it.must not operate for the primary purpose of conducting a trade or business that is not related to its exempt purpose, such as a school's operation of a factoryRenting out your building is something that churches do all the time. Any WV legal scholars out there?


              • #9
                Hal - A business can discriminate at that level however it likes, generally speaking. Choosing who you want to engage in commerce with is a private decision. The Summit would not be turned into a publicly-owned operation.

                To put it another way - if the Human Rights Campaign, a leading GLBT group, is seeking to buy meals for a convention, it can choose to not purchase from Chick-Fil-A. There's no grounds for a lawsuit.


                • #10
                  You can freely choose whom to do business with, except for a few specific instances. You are not allowed to discriminate on certain criteria, race being the primary example. If you are turning your facility into a 'public accommodation' then you have to abide by your state's rules on that. If you were in NJ, that would include not discriminating based on sexual preference.

                  Here's a quote on the tax-exempt thing...the State Supreme Court has ruled that nonprofit organizations can forfeit their tax-exempt status for property taxes if they lease out their facilities to noncharitable organizations for even a single day (Kabler 2010).


                  • #11

                    This review of what non-profit property is taxable provides what I would consider a bizarre result. They asked all of the county assessors about nine different scenarios and whether the building would be taxable. In no case did all of the assessors agree, and they were frequently very split on the topics.

                    For example, a church rents spaces in its parking lot during the week to workers at nearby jobs. On Sunday it's used for worship. Is the parking lot tax-exempt? 55% Yes, 45% No.


                    • #12
                      I can't get over the fact that BSA wants me to give them Friends of Scouting money while they simultaneously built this monstrosity to avoid paying rent to someone for their farmland. This seems to be a recurring theme with BSA. Build a gigantic unneeded structure, beg families and corporations to help them make budget, build more unneeded facilities.

                      There's no way you could run business like this in a for-profit environment. Makes my head hurt to imagine it.


                      • #13
                        Maybe this kind of idea comes from our current national government. I'd prefer not to donate to that, but don't have much choice (but to vote).


                        • #14
                          Following from

                          "The Summit Bechtel Family National Scout Reserve cannot lease its facilities to anyone but charities without jeopardizing its tax-exempt status."

                          "The proposed amendment would open the Summit to some of its corporate sponsors, McGowan (BSA lawyer) said. AT&T, for instance, has pledged $50 million and will put its name on a grass amphitheater that will accommodate up to 80,000 people, he said. That company wishes to host events there, McGowan told lawmakers."

                          "McGowan said these facilities can draw both from the area community and beyond the state's borders, for anything from a music concert or a board of directors' meeting to a wedding."

                          "We have the dilemma of not being able to allow other organizations to use it," McGowan said.

                          Maybe change the name as well - The Resort at Summit. Who would they book for music concerts - John Tesch?

                          A fine kettle of fish.

                          My $0.02,


                          • #15
                            In a way, I think it would be ok if the BSA had to pay property taxes on the stadium. I would guess the rent would more than cover the taxes. I would think that most venues like this do in fact pay property taxes.