Boring Eagle COH

[fgoodwin]

Last nite, my son and I attended our first Eagle COH. What should have been an exciting and inspiring evening for everyone was turned into a boring time because the speaker, the candidate's youth minister, decided to take 20 minutes to preach a sermon to his captive audience.

 

I don't know much about how Eagle COHs are arranged, but I assume the speaker was invited by the candidate, yes? How does one tactfully tell your speaker to limit his remarks to five minutes or less? How do you tell a preacher not to preach?

 

I realise that once the speaker is into his remarks, there is no tactful way to get him to speed-up; the request should be made up-front, but how?

 

If you could have seen the look on the boys' faces (and some of the adults) as the preacher droned on and on, it was actually painful to watch.

 

My son (a recent crossover from Webelos) still wants to get his Eagle, but its in spite of last nite's presentation, certainly not as a result of it.

[isvirtual]

In our unit, the Eagle Scout plans his own COH. He can write the script for every speaker, he can ask the speaker to spend 5 minutes, or he can ask them to speak their mind. My son's Eagle COH lasted about 35 minutes and was fantastic.

[Trevorum]

Some speakers are boring. Period. The most you can do is (1) provide scripts and/or (2) ask extemporaneous speakers to keep their remarks under 5 minutes.

 

The sermonizing part is another issue. I too have witnessed speakers taking the opportunity to lecture/preach religion to a captive audience. It's offensive to many and is completely inappropriate. Whenever guests are invited to give invocations at scout activities, and whenever religious leaders are asked to speak at scout functions, if the audience is multi-faith then the Master of Ceremonies should remind the speaker in advance that the invocation/comments should be non-sectarian. It's common courtesy.

 

 

[ManyIrons]

The following is offered with tongue somewhat planted in cheek:

 

Who is the chartered org? Where was the ceremony held? If the answer to either is the candidate's church, then I'd say you were on the minister's turf (home field advantage !).

 

What was the "sermon" about? Was it sectarian?

 

What was the minister asked to do as opposed to what was done?

 

How was the rest of the ceremony?

 

Perhaps more importantly, how did the candidate feel about it?

 

Was the minister's actions inappropriate? I think we need the answers to the questions above before that can be answered.

 

Without intending to sound flip:

 

Q. How does one tactfully tell your speaker to limit his remarks to five minutes or less?

A. "Mr./Mrs. Blank, here's a copy of the ceremony program, can you keep your remarks to about five minutes?"

 

Q. How do you tell a preacher not to preach?

A. I think the answer is you don't. If you've asked him/her to speak and you've left their remarks up to them what would you expect? What would you ask him to do?

 

fgoodwin, please pardon me, I suspect I've had some fun at your expense. When the time comes for your son's Eagle CoH, use this as a lesson and don't leave anything to chance (assuming it occurred in this situation). Script the entire ceremony yourself, or use one of the many available on-line, and be up front with anyone you ask to speak.

 

Case in point, my son and I wrote his entire CoH script and asked specific individuals to conduct portions of the ceremony. It was held in our church and the ministers were asked to deliver both the invocation and the benediction. We left the wording up to them (obviously) and both were very nice and very succinct. All in all, the entire ceremony took about 40 mins and we/he received a lot of great compliments (just ask purcelce!!).

[fgoodwin]

I appreciate your comments and am not the least bit offended. My son and I are both new at this so we weren't sure how these ceremonies are put together.

 

Trust me: when (not if!) my son makes Eagle, we will remember this COH and not repeat these mistakes. To answer your questions:

 

Yes, the CO is a church and the COH was held in the parish hall, but the candidate attends a different church. The speaker was from the other church.

 

The sermon wasn't sectarian; it was about boys growing up to be responsible men.

 

I don't know what the minister was asked to do; in fairness, its possible the candidate gave him a time limit of 20 minutes to speak.

 

The rest of the ceremony was very dignified, appropriate to the occasion. No other part took nearly as long as the preacher's sermon.

 

I couldn't tell how the candidate was reacting to the sermon, as I was sitting somewhat behind him. Its possible he was so into the moment, being in the spotlight and all, that he might not have had the same reaction to the sermon as the other boys did. But their reaction was very obvious.

 

I don't think the minister's actions were exactly inappropriate -- he just spent far too much time talking about a topic that was of almost no interest to the rest of the Troop.

 

Granted, he was there at the invitation of the candidate. But he was, after all, a youth minister. I'm surprised he didn't take into account their limited attention span, and their willingness to listen (or not listen) to a somewhat dry topic.

 

In any event, thanx again for your suggestions.

[Trevorum]

ManyIrons asks: "Q. How do you tell a preacher not to preach?"

 

You don't of course. He/she is probably there precisely because of his/her calling. However, you certainly can remind them, tactfully, that you have scouts from many different faiths in your troop and that references to specific articles of religious dogma might be inappropriate. Most people will be very considerate of a captive audience. It's just a matter of conciousness-raising

 

On another subject: Fred, have you gotten your transportation confirmation letter yet from the Jambo?

 

 

[ManyIrons]

fgoodwin, thanks for taking my remarks in the spirit that they were offered -- somewhat bemused.

 

I've attended many ceremonies since becoming a Scouter, only 1 or 2 could be considered boring. By far the worst one was a recent NESA Eagle Banquet -- the opening flag ceremony took 20 mins! This was on top of having the Eagles wait outside in the lobby for about 90 mins! Oh and the guest speaker -- he delivered a rambling, disjointed speech, but at least he kept it under 10 mins

 

ALways keep your positive attitude handy -- it'll get you through those occasional boring events!!

[ManyIrons]

ManyIrons not ask question; ManyIrons repeat question asked by fgoodwin.

 

fgoodwin says "The sermon wasn't sectarian; it was about boys growing up to be responsible men."

 

ManyIrons scratches head; ManyIrons confused

 

. . . but still bemused!!

 

[fgoodwin]

ManyIrons: the sermon was nonsectarian; in other words, he didn't push the views of any one faith over another. His sermon really wasn't very religious at all -- it was about boys and character development.

 

Like I said, stuff that wouldn't interest most 11-14 yo boys (which was the approx. range of the boys in attendance). There were very few Stars & Lifes, who might've been better equipped to understand the sermon.

 

Trev: I'm driving to the Jamboree; do I still need some sort of transportation confirmation letter?

[Trevorum]

Fred - you're driving? Darn, I'd offer to share gas expenses if I could get a refund on my ticket! My understanding is that everyone gets some sort of transportation letter, confirming their mode and date of arrival, for security reasons. I haven't seen naything yet (but then, I just got my patches yesterday!).

[ManyIrons]

fgoodwin, I understood your post. My response was for Trevorum.

 

Enjoy Jambo!!

[Trevorum]

ManyIrons, yes, sorry for the confusion!

[fgoodwin]

trev: I got my 2nd Jambo patch yesterday, which confirms I'm paid up -- I can't wait!

 

So, will I see you in Grapevine?

[Trevorum]

I hope so. I've got it marked on my calendar, but that can change fairly quickly for me!

[BSAChaplain]

Well, as a youth pastor, I am sorry to hear that this person did a poor job. Often times adults who are not familiar with Scouting don't know what to say, so they say what they know. I have been called into situations like that outside of Scouting and my own congregation, and it requires real prep work to know your audience.

 

Good ideas across the board.

Give clear parameters (topic and time limit) to your speakers.

Don't assume the message given wasn't the Eagle's choice (unless you are so bold as to ask)

Ask the members of the clergy unfamiliar with Scouting to provide an invocation.

Help all speakers to know their intended audience and what is appropriate in a Scout setting.

 

Oh and speaking of people using a platform for their own purposes rather than the one it was intended for, may I suggest the use of the Private Messages feature for personal matters in order to avoid confusion for readers as well as extraneous postings to wade through looking for material related to the thread. Wish I was going to Jamboree and I hope you have a great time. I'll see you at both of the 100th anniversaries 2007 & 2010!

 

I hope that was tactful enough, I don't mean in any way to offend. They are only a slightly annoying, because they are not a consistent problem by any means, but it seemed ironic to have this sub-thread interwoven here of all places.:-)