Show Pity on your Advancement Chairs!

[Engineer61 19]

So, another FoH has nearly come and gone.

 

After tonight's CoH, I'll get my wife back for a couple of months before the next FoH and Summer Camp scheduling begins.

 

Never ceases to amaze me the number of pushy parents and snotty emails she has to put up with during the MBR.

 

One emailed her last night, an irate EQ, complaining the her son was not going to be able to apply to work as Summer Camp staff because some MB wasn't going to go through this round... Why? Because the boy was too busy with other stuff to go to the BoR and he scheduled three times ... wanted to know if they could do the BoR before tonight's CoH.

 

It would be nice if the SM would kindly instruct the parents how this all works. Guess that won't happen.

 

At least TroopMaster didn't dump all over her head this time.

 

Since you've all been scratching your heads... here's my mnemonic list:

 

FoH = Fortnight of Hell - the two weeks prior to any CoH or Summer Camp where hundreds of insidious blue cards and other superfluous documents litter my dining room table, kitchen counter and my wife's desk.

 

MBR = Merit Badge Rut - analogous to FoH but applies specifically to all the parents who come out of the woodwork demanding MB's. Usually makes grunting sounds on the answering machine, similar to the bull Elk in the rut season.

 

EQ = Eagle Quester - Usually an obnoxious parent; but sometimes a snot-nosed Scout enabled by an obnoxious parent; who thinks the AC is their personal doormat.

 

Yeeeee haaaaa!

[emb021 16]

Some confusion.

 

What do BoR have to do with merit badges? They are only needed for ranks.

 

We have a concept in scouting of 'instant recognition'. As part of this, we should be submitting advancement as soon as possible, not sitting on them. While we might publicly acknowledge the advancement at the CoH, the only think we should be "holding back" for that event would be the pocket card.

 

Once a blue card for the merit badge is submitted, it should go on an advancement form. At least once a month, these should be submitted to the council office, and awards obtained. The patches (merit badges, rank, etc) should be given out to the boys once they are obtained, just holding the cards for CoH.

 

Sounds to me like your troop has a system that probably should be re-examined and changed.

 

Why is anyone 'demanding merit badges'? what do you mean merit badges are 'going thru this round'. That's not how it should work.

 

[moosetracker 132]

I would imagine the MB is the last needed for a Rank advancement.. Or Engineer slipped up and just the BoR was not done, so the scout couldn't get to the next rank before the COH..

 

You do need a BoR before you can get the next rank. Sounds like this kid missed 3 chances to do a BoR..

 

Our troop was similar, maybe they could reach a rank before a CoH, but all the kids procrastinated and then were zooming to get everything done just befor the CoH.. Didn't matter that they could earn the rank earlier.. The scheduled CoH was like the dinner bell..

[Venividi 35]

Engineer,

 

Suggest to your Advancement Chair that she meet with the CC to discuss this issue.

Then review with committee and request committee support for established cutoff dates prior to COH's.

 

CC should then run interference with any and all pushy parents. In the future when parents approach the advancement chair, whether by phone, email, text or in person, the response is "I am following the process as approved by the troop committee. If you have issue with that, please take it to the committee."

 

Troop leaders need to have each other's backs; clearly communicating with each other their needs, communicating them to parents. It is likely that your advancement chair experiences a FOH because a) parents haven't been told that their son should be doing this, not them, and therefore the requests are inconsistent with the aims of scouting, b) parents and scouts aren't aware that there is a deadline, c)everyone is aware that there are deadlines, but as they have not been enforced in the past, people know that they don't matter, so ignore them.

 

Lastly, one can wish all they want that the someone else should be taking action, but in situations like this, it is the person that is feeling the pain (i.e., the advancement chair), that should take the necessary steps to 1) stop entertaining late requests, and 2) asking the CC to add this item to the next committee meeting or raise it during the "new business" portion of the next committee meeting.

 

Nancy Reagan's "Just say NO" is a great piece of advice to follow here.

[Venividi 35]

 

One additional thing:

 

Consider BOR's availability and ability to conduct BOR's. What ever cutoff date prior to COH that you and your committee determine for recognition at the next COH, look at how many BOR's that you can support in a night. If it typically takes 1/2 hour per, then the board might provide a sign up list with 4 slots, starting 1/2 hr prior to the troop meeting start time. Scouts sign up on a first come basis; when all the slots are gone, they can sign up for a slot at the next opportunity.

 

Implicit in this is that BOR's will be scheduled on a timely basis, but perhaps not on the night desired by the scout, due to supply and demand constraints.

 

Be sure to separate the awarding and recognition of rank from the recognition at the COH.

 

 

(note: I'm confused too about a MB not going through - perhaps you could elaborate)

[qwazse 4344]

E61, excellent application of acronyms. Doubt any'll stick, but I'm at my coffee break chuckling subtly.

 

That said, our advancement chairs probably do deserve a regular dose of flowers and chocolate!

 

Ours tries to make it to every troop meeting so boys can register their progress with her. We do advancement-as-you-go, and that spreads most of the traffic over the year (think of that fortnight spread over one evening a week for 14 weeks). The CoH is basically a handshake for patches that should already be sewed on the uniform. There is a little pile up the week or to before CoH, but that is usually trail to 1st Class kids who we nudged two weeks earlier to wrap up those last couple of requirements to make mamma proud.

 

Unless the boy is special needs, he does the showing PL's or MBC's signatures. No parents involved. Event if the boy has special needs, usually an ASM (not the kid's parent) will do the mediating.

 

IMHO your Mrs. is within her rights to demand the SM's and ASM's run a little more interference for her. Parents need to see her as a resource for their boys, not a back-door to go around whatever they don't like about how the troop operates.

[Buffalo Skipper 13]

If a parent came up to me (or emailed, or phoned, or texted....), I would kindly remind them that it is the scout's responsibility to handle their advancement. If a scout needs a SM conference, I remind them that it is the scout who should approach me to see that it is done. Then I advise them that I always arrive at the scout hut 45 to 60 minutes early EVERY week, so that any scout can meet with me to discuss anything they wish.

 

Once the scout has completed the SMC, they are handed a piece of paper (and an explanation is given) advising them that it is their responsiblity to contact the Advancement Coordinator (our committee has no sub-committees, so there is only one "Chair") to schedule a BoR. This is generally done the same or the following week.

 

We recognize immediately after they have completed their BoR, most often at the meeting the same night. This includes a rank badge, and moving their "chit" on the board from one rank to the next. CoH is usually reserved for presentation of cards and a recognition in front of parents. I once tried to see that a scout had the opportunity to have his BoR right before a CoH. He ended up with an "unscheduled" football practice, and no-showed. I won't put myself out on a limb for a CoH again. We do 4 a year; there is plent of opportunity for recognition.

 

Here's a question. For those of you who present rank patches at meetings (most of us, I presume), is the rank presented by the SM or the SPL?

[Engineer61 19]

I expect that while rank changes are "in the system" on the BoR dates.

 

Actual rank "awards" for rank and MB's are given out only at the CoH's.

 

This keeps the number of trips to the Scoutshop down to a minimum...my wife's other job. A lot of times, the local Scoutshop will only stock the fringe badges one the need is shown in the system.

 

I actually don't know who the CC is...she's never mentioned him/her/they.

 

If the SPL is "capable", he gives them the awards at the CoH. But is usually requires the SM to do the speaking.

 

The flag ceremony usually infuriates me...since no one seems to be able to train these boys how to bark the orders out. I figure if you going to play military color guard...then do it right, otherwise...leave the flags in the dang closet.

 

(This message has been edited by Engineer61)

[ScoutNut 147]

"Actual rank "awards" for rank and MB's are given out only at the CoH's. This keeps the number of trips to the Scoutshop down to a minimum...my wife's other job. A lot of times, the local Scoutshop will only stock the fringe badges one the need is shown in the system."

 

 

If no one wants to go to the Scout Shop more than two to four times per year (for COHs) stock up on the recognition cards. These can be given out to the Scouts at the meeting directly after they are earned. Your wife should be entering all information on completed requirements/awards/merit badges/etc in Troopmaster on an ongoing basis (weekly). Then when COH time rolls around there is no question about what who is getting what badges.

 

"Fringe" merit badges can be ordered with a simple phone call to your Scout Shop, or a visit to a National owned Shop which will usually stock some of all of the merit badges.

 

As for BOR information. Only turning in Advancement forms to your council for completed BOR rank advancement 2-4 times per year is just asking for complications in council record keeping. Not to mention that it is really unfair to the boys who might actually like to wear one rank badge before it is replaced by the next.

[Engineer61 19]

While reinventing the flow might be a nice thing to do...not sure I'd try it with this crowd.

 

We've tried the "call the Scoutshop" routine several times...they'll look up on the computer...say, "Yeah we have 10 of those ..." you get there the next hour and they are out.

 

The wife does enter stuff as it is turned in...and produces the necessary reports....blah blah blah... The problem is that everyone seems to hold on to the blue cards and other details until the CoH is around the corner...and she ends up scrambling....that's when the EQ's show up. I've told her to drop and anchor with a cutoff date...but she's too nice.

 

I think she's dropping the AC position this summer ... she's been "training a replacement" ...

[momof2cubs 10]

I haven't been an advancement chair (yet!) for a troop. But I have been one for a pack for 2 years now. The best advice that my predecessor gave me is this: "Never talk to parents directly". And it has served me well.

 

As an AC I can only go with what is in packmaster. It is your leaders responsibility to make sure all awards are entered into PM. If they are not, that is not my fault. I clutch the PM award report like it is my life line at every pack meeting, because invariably some parent will come up to me and say, "why didn't Johnny get his (whatever award)?" I look at my report, show it to them, show them it isn't there and tell them to check with their leader. It has saved my sanity.

 

I don't know how it works at the boy scout level. Is the AC responsible for making sure stuff is entered into whatever software? Who tells him/her who earned what? Surely not the boy scout himself or the parents right?

[Eagle92 110]

A few comments.

 

1) LOVE THE ACRONYMS AND GOTTA USE THEM IN THE FUTURE! (And yes Eng I'm screaming at ya, but in a good sort of way )

 

2) I remember the days when units only gave awards only at COHs. I know things have changed, but if this is an older unit, traditions die hard.

 

3) Wife should not deal with parents, only other leaders and Scouts. Advice given on this is spot on.

 

4)Please tell me your store is a local one and not a national one. When I worked for national, we could usually pull a few items an place them on reserve right away. For larger orders there may be some time delay, but the low inventory items would be pulled ASAP. And if you didn't' want to pick it up, and we did have a few units that either didn't or couldn't, we shipped. And one time I delivered the order personally.

 

We had one unit in Prague that used our shop to get the ranks. Got a nice thank patch for filling their orders. And one person was visiting and was willing to trade patches for deliver to the hotel. Have patches will deliver

 

 

[ScoutNut 147]

Get to know the folks in your Scout Shop so that they will know that you follow thru.

 

When you call, don't just ask "how many". Ask if they can hold the specific number of badges that you need on the side for Mrs Engineer from Troop 1234 for the next two hours until you can get there.

 

I never had a problem when doing this with either a council, or National, owned Scout Shop.

[Eagle92 110]

One more thing, while not encouraged to be done by national, I know it happens and recommend it as a volunteer. Suggest to your wife to build up a "war chest" of extra advancement items, i.e a few extra rank patches, MBs, etc. This is especially a BIG DEAL on the CS level and around Blue and Golds time. I know when I worked for supply, we sometimes ran out of awards in the Feb/March Time frame because we were inudated with packs buying advancement for BnG. Trust me, I saw a few $300+ orders.

 

My troop growing had a "war chest" would use stuff out of it and replace it with the advancement we purchased with the advancement report. We had a minimum invenroty requirement, and if we fell below that point a few "replacements" would be ordered.

 

My pack also has one, but most of it is from council sending us stuff after we had already purchased it from another council, despite markign on the report that it was already bought and not to send.

[emb021 16]

"2) I remember the days when units only gave awards only at COHs. I know things have changed, but if this is an older unit, traditions die hard."

 

That tradition/idea should have died a long time ago.

 

When I went thru adult training in the early 80s, 'immediate recognition' was emphasised (and has been to this day). IE, you do NOT hold off on awards until COH (of which most troops had 3-4 a year). You were to AS SOON A POSSIBLE get the award in the youth's hands. At the time, my troop kept a stock of skill awards to immediately give them out the night the scout earned them, and kept a small stock of Scout thru First Class ranks to do the same. (we ALWAYS turned in advancement forms). Our scout shop was in the major town to the north, an hour drive away.