John-in-KC 311 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 There's a commissioner's college study out in the interwebs. While I generally believe what Beavah said (the unit will size itself to the SM's comfort level), the optimum size for a Troop is about 48 youth: 9 patrols of 9, 1 of 8. Chap Aide Scribe Librarian TG while all Troop warrant offices, lived within Patrols when not directly doing Troop duties. SPL ASPL x 2 QM were general support of the Troop. In this model, I was led to understand that Instructors and Den Chiefs were still organic to their home Patrols. Link to post Share on other sites
resqman 108 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Not arguing the optium size of 48 but I a little curious how you get 9 patrols of 9 boys with only 48 scouts? 9 patrols of 9 scouts is 81 plus one patrol of 8 is 90 scouts. Recommend you check your math again. Link to post Share on other sites
Beavah 205 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Yah, John-in-KC, never heard of that, but agree da math is a bit off. If that's the case, I reckon we're in trouble. Accordin' to the new Journey to Excellence materials, the current average troop size in the country is 14 boys. B Link to post Share on other sites
Stosh 3452 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 If the average size of a troop in the US is 14... Do the math 6-8 boys to a patrol... okay 2 small patrols of 7 SPL/ASPL take out okay now 2 very small patrols of 6 Any other troop officers need to be in a patrol or have a patrol of their own. Okay... 1 older boy patrol 1 younger boy patrol. Older boy patrol has PL APL Scribe QM Chaplain Aide Historian Younger Boy patrol has PL APL TG Instructor DC Scout with no POR.... By the time the smoke settles everyone pretty much has a POR. All chiefs and no Indians.... Looks good on paper, but has to be a real mess trying to get enough work for each of the boys to really earn the POR. Maybe just wearing the patch should be enough for the average sized troop. Otherwise... One patrol of 14 (troop method) SPL - really runs the patrol/troop ASPL - helps as needed PL - Wears the patch defers everything to SPL APL - Wears the patch defers everything to ASPL Scribe QM TG Instructor Historian Chaplain Aide DC 3 boys with no POR (no need for a second PL/APL)... Well, there's really no need for a PL/APL if the SPL/ASPL are really running the show anyway. Even more boys wearing patches without any functionality Is it any wonder then why most boys really don't actually do anything to fulfill their POR's other than wearing the patch for 6 months? Your mileage may vary, Stosh Link to post Share on other sites
gsdad 59 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Is your scout one of the boys waiting in the wings while "the golden children" are given leadership positions? Link to post Share on other sites
acco40 95 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 If adults are assigning ANY roles then you have a much bigger problem. Once again, another myth. First of all, for all youth positions, the Scoutmaster first grants approval for the Scout to be eligible. This should be done before elections, not after. Furthermore, 1) Jr. Assistant Scoutmaster is appointed by the Scoutmaster. 2) Den Chief is appointed by the Scoutmaster (in concert with Cubmaster & Den Leader). 3) Instructor is appointed by the Scoutmaster. 4) Troop Guide is appointed by the Scoutmaster. Link to post Share on other sites
CalicoPenn 729 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 "Furthermore: 1) Jr. Assistant Scoutmaster is appointed by the Scoutmaster. 2) Den Chief is appointed by the Scoutmaster (in concert with Cubmaster & Den Leader). 3) Instructor is appointed by the Scoutmaster. 4) Troop Guide is appointed by the Scoutmaster." Umm, not to split hairs but that's not what I've understood from the BSA literature. Of the youth leadership positions, only the Troop Guide is appointed by the Scoutmaster. The rest are appointed by the SPL - some with the advise/consent of the Scoutmaster. 1) Jr. Assistant Scoutmaster - appointed by SPL with the advice and consent of the Scoutmaster. (reality - most of the time, a Scoutmaster will "appoint" a JASM on their own or a Troop has a tradition that all 17 year old Eagles are appointed as JASM's. It's probably pretty rare for an SPL to suggest to a SM that such-and-such be appointed to JASM). 2) Den Chief - appointed by the SPL with the advice/consent of the Scoutmaster and acceptance of the Cubmaster and Den Leader. 3) Instructor - appointed by the SPL - no advice or consent needed (though the reality is most SPL's check in with the SM on their appointments first anyway). 4) Troop Guide - appointed by the Scoutmaster. Link to post Share on other sites
John-in-KC 311 Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Yeah, I goofed. 4 of 9 kids 1 of 8 4 leadership outside patrols. Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle732 27 Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Had a Scout who "needed" a position for advancement. We had elections and he didn't win a PL job. SPL didn't appoint him to a job so he came to me (SM) and asked for a job. My reply "well there's a Cub Pack down the road and Den Chief counts as a POR, it either that or learn to bugle". Scout is now a DC, one of the most important jobs for maintaining troop membership. And I'm happy that he took the initiative, he could have sat it out and waited until next election. Brownie points for this next SMC!(This message has been edited by Eagle732) Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now