Woodbadge as Cult

[Scoutfish 16]

Are you sure you're not talking about the IRS?

 

Well, even though I haven't taken WB, I do know some Wood Badgers who are the coolest people I know. But I also know some who are jerks.

 

The "elitist" mentality can strike anybody..including Wood Badgers.

 

As a former Firefighter, I helped teach a few classes, taught some on my own, and observed some other teaching.

 

Some instructors come off as arrognat "you are so lucky to have me as an imnstructor" snobs. Others are almost like your best friend.

 

Can be any group of people anywere.

 

My ACM took Wood Badge , years ago. He knows most every person in the surrounding 3 councils. He does not have a high opinion of Wood Badge because ( to loosely qoute him) "The high society scout leaders are drawn like moths to flames to Wood Badge. Only one worthwhile Wood Badger out of 10 in it".

 

My ACm is 100 percent for the boys - will sing or dance in a moment kind of guy, most charasmatic fun loving guy I ever met.

[ScoutBox 11]

Thank goodness I've not encountered anyone through WB like this in my Council. Sure there might be some, but I've never met any.. Sure there were Staff with the Stuffed Critters, and Staves, but not in any elitist mind set. I've served in the US Military for years, and years, and met more Elitist types there. But so far only on this board have I've heard about it. Never seeing it. Most people I know take Scouting serious because they want to help the kids. I did hear a joke once when someone said that if it weren't for the Kids Scouting would be fun. I don't and could never agree with that. I got back into Scouting to give back . I was a young soldier back in the 90s the first time, and now I was talked back into getting involved when my son joined. I take Scouting serious, but I too want to have fun. And seeing those boys having fun, and growing is great! Again, this list above means nothing too me. Just another list that has nothing too do with Scouting..

[jhankins 10]

I'm sorry your experience with Wood Badge was not up to par with what it should be. It gives the course a bad reputation when course directors don't follow the pledge they take in front of their counterparts.

 

Wood Badge is open to all in my council. We hold two courses a year -- one Thursday-Saturday, and one Friday-Sunday. The staffs are always diverse racially and with mixed genders. Last year, we had over 45% Cub Scout leaders attend Wood badge, and 33% of each patrol (2) were women. The variety was wonderful, and enhanced the course so much, having such varied life experiences, opinions and places to have fun!

 

Any Scouter even close to #5 has a short career in Wood Badge. The very core of the message of the course is that being a servant leader is the way we all should go! If you're not at Wood Badge to be a team player, to focus on the maximum impact the material can make on the lives of every boy each participant touches, you're shown the door.

 

We do question National and Regional quite often, especially at our annual training meetings. Why is Trainer's Edge now mandatory every 3 years if I'm staffing Wood Badge and presenting material with platform skills ten times a year?? Why was the 30 day meeting removed from the syllabus? Why do I have to wait for my Scout Executive to send my list of staff to National before I can ask someone to serve on staff?? This things are healthy questions and we should ask -- it's our program.

 

Wood Badge for me as a Den Leader with one year under my belt helped me understand the relationship between all 4 programs. I was led on a journey through Scouting and provided tools to help me bridge the generation gaps between me and the youth. I was given the opportunity to network and meet other like minded Scouters who want to have the most impact on the boys as possible. I got to test myself personally with a contract between me and my own goals, and I learned a lot about myself because my course directors showed me the door to that journey.

 

Any deviations, personal flair, traditions from council to council all create not only an aire of a cult, but also destroy the chances to have these encounters.

 

[oldisnewagain1 42]

hmmm....it seems my college was a cult too

[Basementdweller 608]

OH I could go on and on.

 

The Council has a number of competing IOLS programs, of course the CD for each of

these is on Woodbadge staff mostly as TG's. It appears that they loaded their patrol's with members of staff from their IOLS staffs. The IOLS Patrols came in completely practiced and schooled in the games.

 

I was in one of the outcast patrols. Our troop guide was good, but we were pretty clueless as to what was going on.

 

the stuffed animal kidnapping???? Please I am 40 years old. I didn't take days off work and spend time away from my family for this crap.

[ScoutBox 11]

The law was laid down to us the first day. No BSing around with dolls etc.. no arguing no games no BS. Time was short and people were there to learn..

 

I liked that..

[qwazse 4347]

Just a suggestion: don't judge a woodbadger by how pompous he/she may be to you. Judge by how much the boys love him/her.

 

Since WB doesn't fit all categories, and we have testimony that it doesn't fit many of them in most councils, we can conclude "not cult." Although the lack of real wood was a bit of a disappointment.

 

GR: I gotta say "all the stuffed animals and irrelevant crap" compensated for the fact I had no time to get a pumpkin for this weekend. Crow ornaments were all over the porch. Not sure if they'll be allowed on the tree in December though.

 

Although my experience was largely positive, I'm glad I waited a few years to take the course. It gave me a backdrop to adjust expectations.

 

BD: The prisoner's dilema is intended to strip down to "bare bones" the shame that could be induced in society -- cult or otherwise. I had studied game theory as a hobby years before, so it wasn't as emotionally charged for me. However, it did give me pause.

 

Regarding stealing totems, our SM actually made it clear in not so many words that he would frown upon it. I can see how that one behavior would sour me on the course ... Lesson to WB'ers: how you comport yourselves while on staff or as a student will help a scouter answer the question "Will I really want to volunteer with these folks for the next __ years?" Do your best to make that answer be affirmative.

 

On the other hand, I now have five goals and a deadline to complete them. Being a guy who kinda "goes with the flow", it's nice to have some concrete benchmarks. Also, when I do make goals, they tend to be a little "high minded" so it was nice to have someone help me hone them down to things that could be achieved in my position as Crew Advisor in the next 18 months.

[moosetracker 132]

BasementDweller - Question for you.. Did you take WB in your own council, or go out of council? I just remember other comments by you that lead me to believe your council was a bunch of egotistical jerks.. (Pinewood derby they will not run, but when you offered they killed any attempt by you), comments about the way they hand out adult awards etc. That lead me to believe you already feel your council is not for the boys and is sort of corrupt, where money is not seeming to go into the camps, but into the execs pockets etc. Bearing this in mind, if you wanted to take Woodbadge, I would hope that you went to a different council, because if your woodbadge was run by the same jerks in your own council, I am not surprised you had no enjoyment. I would think you would not have been surprised by that either..

 

 

[Basementdweller 608]

Took it in my own council. In the book. Trying to decide on whether to finish my ticket. I could care less about the beads, the cronies at district already have told me my woodbadge isn't worth the price of admission. So my entire reason for taking it is moot.

 

don't get me wrong, I meet a few outstanding individuals at the course, but they were the exception.

 

 

Gotta laugh, got an email from the district, it is time to submit for our District Awards dinner. Another two hours of District commissioners awarding each other.(This message has been edited by Basementdweller)

[moosetracker 132]

the cronies at district already have told me my woodbadge isn't worth the price of admission. So my entire reason for taking it is moot.

 

What were you hoping to gain from WB? For me it was ways to communicate better with people. No one can tell me if it was worth the cost but me... Others may do it for the boys, then it would again be their own opinion if it made a difference, maybe the boys (if you chose to ask them)...

 

You weren't looking into getting into the "good ol boys" league? You don't like them, they seem not to like you in turn.. You wouldn't want to hang with them anyways.

[Stosh 3452]

While it's not really a hot button in our council, the lines in the sand are drawn. There are those who are in and those that aren't. It's not really a mean thing, or an arrogant thing, just a thing that is tolerated. There's even a line drawn between the WB's before 2000 and those afterwards..... I'm pre-2000 WB so I'm on the outs there too. They told me that if I ever wanted to be on WB staff I would have to take the course over again. Kinda like going back to high school and doing it again, yeah, right, like that's ever going to happen.

 

I just focus on my boys, do my own thing and mind my own business. After 30 years of being registered in BSA, they asked me to be a unit commissioner because no one else was stepping up. Makes it look like a really fun job. Well, I was one of those not stepping up. Normally I just plod it out in the trenches and don't aspire to greatness in the council. It took me 28 years to get the District Award of Merit, while many of my counterparts got Silver Beaver, for doing a year's worth of FOS kinds of things. For many years I got passed over by the in-crowd of those that hosted a Camporee and got DAM. Maybe they organized some Webelos outing so they got the DAM. Me, I just work with my boys in my unit and so I never qualified for it. However, they gave me one anyway.

 

While it is easy to feel bad about getting shuffled off to Buffalo all the time, it really doesn't bother me at all. I am doing it for the boys and when my boys show up, the other troops notice and some even copy the standards we set. How many troops show up at camporee flags in the morning in full uniform, carrying the troop flag and patrol flags? They stand in formation and do not stand in single file line and salute to the back other their buddy's head. The other troops do cobblers for the DO competition, my boys do cheese cakes. They win every time they enter.

 

I like what I do and I don't worry about the accolades that others get for their participation in the program. I just do it for the boys, they thank me for it and life goes on. I guess that means more to me than the patches the council hands out with the little certificates with my name misspelled.

 

With the number of posts on this thread in just a few hours, it obviously a hot button elsewhere too.

 

Stosh

[Basementdweller 608]

Lack of wood badge was the excuse for telling me no for a lot of things I would have like to have done in the district at the cub level. I was not qualified.

 

I jumped thru their hoop and I am still not qualified.

 

My son crossed over in the mean time so he will not partake in my efforts.

 

[moosetracker 132]

Yep, you are in the out-crowd.. You got alot of great company though. I always thought the out-crowd had some of the better people anyways.

 

Doing your tickets - Can't help you, since I have 2 thoughts.

 

1) With your tickets, did you choose anything that would help your Pack?.. If you did, then do it. If it was just some stuff that gave you something to do, but not that important to your Pack, then don't.

 

2) Do it and since they had the comment that your WB status was why you couldn't do things, see what they come up with next.

 

Honestly, many people without WB help out in our district. I have never known any one turned down to help out due to not have silly little beads. Nor do I think they turn people down due to disliking them. Maybe in my area of training if they want to pass on negative attitudes or no one likes them so no one will respect them enough to pay attention to them.. (Luckily I have yet to deal with that.).. But, I don't know of other places a helping hand would be refused.

[CalicoPenn 729]

My definition of Cult: A group or organization that some people don't like.

 

Based on the criteria of a cult that was posted, and furthering BDPT's posting, the following non-exhaustive list of groups and organizations could be cults:

 

Catholic Church

Various sects of most of the Protestant denominations, including Lutheran, Methodist, Baptist, Southern Baptist, etc. (If I didn't name it, don't worry, it probably still qualifies).

LDS, Jewish, Hindu, Islam and Buddhist sects.

(Oh let's simplify it - ANY group of an organized religious or spiritual bent).

 

Republican Party

Democratic Party

Libertarian Party

Green Party

Socialist Party

(Oh let's simplify it - ANY organized political party).

 

National Rifle Association

League of Women Voters

ACLU

Concerned Women of America

National Audubon Society

Sierra Club

"Tea Party"

(Oh, let's simplify it - ANY NGO or "Grassroots" organization).

 

Boy Scouts of America

Girl Scouts

Campfire

Indian Guides

Awana Club

Pop Warner Football

Little League

(Oh, let's simplify it - ANY organized youth group).

 

Coca Cola

Exxon

Halliburton

Citibank

McDonalds

Boeing

(Oh let's simplify it - ANY corporate behemoth).

 

And on and on and on...

 

I think the point is made.

 

 

 

 

 

[Eagle92 110]

Base,

If you haven't already, please read my response inone of the other threads to you on your situation, which to quote an old commercial " Just do it."

 

I understand being on the 'out crowd," especially as a DE But if you focus on the important things, providing the best possible program to the youth, no matter what others say, you re doing your job, and the kids will appreciate that.