Tiger Den shared leadership..How do I get them to volunteer?

[TigerDen2]

I volunteered to be the den leader. Our den is new (10/06) and small in number...8. Den meetings/go-see-its/pack meetings have all been great. We've gotten our Bobcat badge and we're full steam ahead towards the Tiger!

 

So far, I have had ZERO help from the parents. I ask for volunteers, pass around sign-up sheets to no avail. Everyone is busy...soccer, basketball, siblings activities and the likes.

 

Make no mistake, I ENJOY conducting the meetings and planning etc.;we always have fun. The boys are great and eager to give their best at anything we go for.

 

I am not upset by the lack of help...only that I figured there would be at least a little.

 

Has anyone ever had this issue? Any suggestions?

[jr56]

Welcome to the forum. Yes this is an old problem. Your best bet is to ask specific parents to do specific things. Something simple, that won't take alot of time. There will always be a few that will not help, no matter what you do. If you need something really bad, just say that the activity will be cancelled if you cannot get the help you need to carry it out.

[SWScouter]

TigerDen2, welcome to the forum and thank you for volunteering your time and talents to the Cub Scout program.

 

You don't get them to volunteer. Tigers is shared leadership, that means that they are responsible for some of the Tiger program they have signed their sons and themselves up for.

 

Bring in a sheet of paper with the months written on it. Have each of them sign up to organize one of the months. This isn't an option, it's something they must do to be a part of the Tiger program.

 

Remind them that they always have to attend the activities with their son and that it really doesn't take that much time to do beyond being at the activities anyway. Also, it's only for a couple of meetings and one go see it.

 

Your job, as a Tiger Den Leader, mostly is to ensure that the Tiger partners do their part in planning and running the den activities, not to do that yourself. You are also the administrator for the Tiger den, submitting den advancement forms, dues, etc. Finally, you are the liason between the den and other Pack leadership.

 

Have fun!

SWScouter

[eagle-pete]

TigerDen2

 

You've taken the lead as a volunteer Den Leader (2 Thumbs Up). You're a great example to all the parents! Hopefully they will follow your lead some day.

 

Over the years I have had various levels of support from parents and I have come to a few conclusions...

 

Parents (as a rule) don't just volunteer

For many reasons, including unfamiliarity with the program, uncertainty where to help, not wanting to jump right into scouting, time constraints, etc., parents do not readily volunteer to help out.

 

Ask for small, specific tasks

I have found it is much more effective, and easier for parents to swallow if you ask them if they can do one specific task, rather than asking for help with a meeting or event in general. Also, I was much more successful meeting with them one-on-one, asking them personally. I get a lot more 'yes' responses this way.

 

Recognize your parents

When you do get some parents to help out, make sure they are immediately recognized. Make sure you thank them for their help. They need to feel appreciated, as we all do. Use awards, 'thank you' cards, special attention, etc. You will find that, just like the boys, parents love recognition. They will be more willing to help in the future as well if they feel you appreciate their efforts.

 

Be Patient

Keep in mind this will take time. You will want to build relationships with the parents and that doesn't happen over night. You will notice that as your relationship grows with the parents, their willingness to help will grow with it.

 

Also, I would do a little informal parent training especially for new parents in the den. Many parents who are not familiar with the Tiger Cub program do not realize there is a partnership relationship between you, the parents, and the boys. They may need to be educated about this. Parents need to know what their role is in the Tiger Den. For new parents, I would have an orientation which they would go through that outlines what they can expect from the Den and what you expect from the parents.

 

Good Luck, and if you haven't already, be sure to get Trained (Fast Start, New Leader Essentials, Position Specific Training). Keep up the good work. It will pay off!

 

Eagle Pete

[Sprocket]

I echo Eagle-Pete's comments.

 

From my experience as a Tiger Den Leader so far this year, many parents are reluctant to volunteer. They don't want to put in the time, they feel/say they don't know enough to do it, and they're more than happy to let the DL do the work. Plus, they may see the other dens run without the degree of parent involvement, and not understand why Tigers has to be different. Tigers wear the same uniforms, they're a den in the pack, why does Tigers run differnt?

 

My pack is one where Tiger dens in previous years were run like Wolf & Bear dens. No shared leadership, and parents didn't have to attend meetings and activities with their Tigers. That's made for an uphill battle for me. I didn't want to scare families away by requiring too much more than prior tiger leaders have required, so I've been requiring parents to attend meetings (I've been flexible about it, though) and have been gradually getting parents more involved.

 

I've had some luck with creating a sign-up sheet where I've listed what I'd like to see the den do for den meetings and Go-See-Its for the next few months, and the parents sign up for which things they want to organize and run. I haven't had enough opportunities for all families to sign up yet (my den has 13 Tigers), but I'll get to them, and after the reluctant parents see the example from the more willing parents, it should help.

 

I also have trouble from some parents who were told by the CM at School Night for Scouting that I'm an Eagle scout, and they make a big deal out of it, and use it as an excuse not to sign up for things.

[TigerDen2]

I appreciate the help folks. It's been 30 years since I wore a Scouting uniform...as a Webelo..a LOT has changed.

 

We have a den meeting this Thursday and I'm going to apply the suggestions from the replies.

 

I will be bugging everyone here for suggestions/help...I'm glad I found the forum!

[ScoutNut]

According to BSA rules Tiger Cub Scouts HAVE to have a Tiger Adult Partner with them at ALL TIMES! On the BSA application, when the Tigers sign up with the Pack, there is a spot to signify who the Adult Partner is. This goes into Scoutnet & is a part of the Tigers registration. Without it a boy CAN NOT sign up as a Tiger!

 

PLEASE - Do NOT comprimise the BSA Tiger Program. IT is there for a reason!

 

As to how to get the families to buy into Shared Leadership - HEY - HELLO - They HAVE to be there anyway! They just want to get around doing any actual work.

 

Don't make it optional. Let your families know that they are REQUIRED to run a week/month/whatever of meetings (depending on the number of families). The den & go-see-it requirements are pretty much laid out for them. If they need more help, YOU, the DEN LEADER, should be available to give them assistance. BSA National provides the current & next month's Program Helps online -

 

http://www.scouting.org/cubscouts/resources/34304/index.jsp

 

This should give them some help. You could also copy the entire years worth of Cub Scout Program Helps. You can purchase them yourself from your local Scout Shop.

 

PS - Actually 8 Tiger Cubs is NOT a small den. It is average to large as den numbers go. BTW, Are you fully trained? It might help you if you were.

 

 

[Beagle Scout]

My Tiger den is just finishing up our first month of shared leadership. I did the first couple of months to get everyone used to things, then I approached my most excited parent and asked for help with this month. I provided her with a printed copy of the Program Helps and this month's Baloo's Bugle (see below) and told her to look through them for ideas, then we met for an hour and planned out the month's activities together. Other than providing some support and starting and closing the meetings, she did everything, and she did a great job! She's already "volunteered" one of the other parents for next month, and I fully expect that parent to do just as well. Of course, I'll do whatever I can to help the parents be successful, but the important thing is to get them to take some ownership of the program. After all, I hope that most of these parents will take on roles in other areas of the pack sooner or later.

 

Program Helps

http://www.scouting.org/cubscouts/resources/34304/index.html

 

Baloo's Bugle

http://usscouts.org/usscouts/bbugle.asp

 

[TigerDen2]

"PLEASE - Do NOT comprimise the BSA Tiger Program. IT is there for a reason!"

First, no boy is EVER "dropped off". The parents MUST attend & they know it. I had two drop out immediatley after the first meeting when they found out it wasn't a baby sitting service.

It's been kind of a social get together for the parents. That's going to change Thursday night. If they won't lead, they will be involved in the den meetings. Now that we have our Bobcat we're going all out for the Tiger and the parents will particpate in some form. It's not rocket science.

And yes, I'm trained.

[Sprocket]

Scoutnut,

I understand the message you're trying to convey, and I agree with you that parents should attend everything with their Tiger cubs, but I question that BSA rules *REQUIRE* that adult partner must be in attendance for the Tiger cub to be able to be at a den meeting. It is not stated anywhere in the G2SS, and the Den Leader Handbook does not go so far as to mandate it.

 

Now the literature states that adult partners should attend, and I take that approach as well, but I don't think it's right to keep a boy from a den meeting or pack meeting if his parents have work conflicts, or one parent is taking a class on our den meeting night and the other parent can't get a sitter for the three younger siblings, or the scout whose mother has to be late to the meeting because a sister has an activity at the same time and his dad is serving in Iraq, etc.

 

The intent of the program is good, and I agree with it. But we also need to have a little flexibility, too.

[OneHour]

This year will be my 3rd tour as Tiger Den Leader. This recipe has worked so far:

- I sat down and created a whole year worth of activities including den meetings and go & see it.

 

for examples:

Wednesday 10/11/06 - Den meeting - scrapbook

Saturday 10/21/06 - we visit the police station.

 

etc.

- After rally night and all roster is finalized, I assigned family names to den meetings and outings. Since there are ten in our den, each family gets 1 month worth of activities. I would do 1 den meeting and the parent would be responsible for 1 den meeting and arrange for an outing. The cub whose family run the activities for the month becomes our Denner! He is the boss! When that is recognized, the family stepped up to bat!

 

- At the very first den meeting, I would explain how it will work and gave them phone numbers of each other. I asked that if they have a conflict, it is up to them to exchange with another family.

 

So far ... it works out fine this year and everyone is enjoying it especially the parents. My first two tries with our two older sons, one to two families did drop out after they realized that it is not a drop and leave service. I do provide tips and hints on what they need to do and the resources that they will need. Now having said that, I always have plan B readied, but I do not announce it!

 

Ah ... BSA volunteers ... the hardest creatures to capture and tame!

 

Good luck

[ScoutNut]

"I question that BSA rules *REQUIRE* that adult partner must be in attendance for the Tiger cub to be able to be at a den meeting."

 

 

From BSA National website -

 

"Adult Partners

The basic element of Tiger Cubs is the Tiger Cub-adult partner team. The adult may be a parent, brother, sister, aunt, uncle, or even a neighbor. The requirements are that the adult partner be 18 years of age or older, care about the boy, and be strongly committed to his well-being. The boy and his adult partner join Tiger Cubs together. They do all the family, den, and Go See It activities together. The adult partner is responsible for seeing that the boy is successful with his advancement in Tiger Cubs.

 

Each boy-adult partner team assumes the responsibility of hosting one or more months of den meetings with the den leader. The host team and the den leader plan the meeting program and the location. Tiger Cub adult partners who wish to become registered leaders must complete an Adult Application and pay the appropriate adult fee prorated to the pack's charter renewal date."

 

From the Tiger Cub Handbook, 2006 printing, page 5 -

 

"The adult partner attends all den meetings, pack meetings, outings, and activities with the Tiger Cub,"

 

 

What more would you like to see in writing from the BSA? How much CLEARER would you like it?

 

No, it is NOT spelled out in the Guide to Safe Scouting because it is NOT a SAFETY issue. It is a PROGRAM issue. I do not have a current issue of the Cub Scout Leader Book handy, but I would bet that it says pretty much the same thing that the other BSA sources do - a Tiger Adult Partner should attend all activities WITH his Tiger. They are a TEAM!! A TIGER TEAM! That is the way the PROGRAM is written!

 

Yes, you CAN be flexible, but it should be the EXCEPTION not the rule. And, if you are making a one time exception for the Adult Partner, then you STILL need to have the Tiger responsible to some adult. Another Tiger Partner will do, but then you are reducing the experience for that Partner's Tiger son. That is why the EXCEPTIONS should be few & far between.

 

And yes, you can be flexible with the leadership too, but if you let the families off the hook to much you are undermining the whole purpose of the Tiger Program.

 

TigerDen2 - If the Adult Partners are there anyway, then HOW can they fairly say they have no time to run a meeting? How hard is it to call up the local fire dept & set up a tour? How hard is it to play "Tell It Like It Isn't" with the den? How hard is it to have the whole den say the Pledge of Allegiance? How hard is it to go outside, gather some leaves & make leaf rubbing's? How hard is it to get all of the Tigers to attend one of those soccer or basketball games that they are spending all of their spare time on?

 

You know better than that.

 

Also, you stated - "It's been kind of a social get together for the parents. That's going to change Thursday night. If they won't lead, they will be involved in the den meetings."

 

They should have been involved in the den meetings all along! Every game, Promise, song, Law, craft, Sign, Handshake, whatever, should include the Adult Partners too. The Tiger & his Partner are a TEAM. They are BOTH experiencing Cub Scouts & Tiger Cubs, for the most part, for the first time, TOGETHER.

 

Get everyone off their tukas & involved in the meeting activities. Make up a spreadsheet with the Tiger requirements & your den meeting dates listed. Require every TEAM to sign up for ONE meeting. They can decide if it is a "in the den" meeting or a "go-see-it" meeting, but it should cover 1 of the Tiger requirements. After they have all successfully completed ONE meeting - have them sign up for another.

 

Before you know it all of the Tiger Rank requirements will be finished & you will be into electives.

 

After 9 years of leading our Tiger Den, I must say, it ain't rocket science, it's FUN! Get those Teams involved & start having some FUN!!

 

 

[Jeffrey H]

"Don't make it optional. Let your families know that they are REQUIRED to run a week/month/whatever of meetings (depending on the number of families). The den & go-see-it requirements are pretty much laid out for them. If they need more help, YOU, the DEN LEADER, should be available to give them assistance..."

The problem with shared adult-partner leadership is that is does not always work. That's why we have "Tiger Den Leaders" to make sure the Dens do not fall apart.  It's best not to force an adult partner to run a meeting or an activity when their "heart" is not in it.  For some parents, just registering with the BSA is traumatic enough.  You have to be flexible or you could lose them and their boys for good.  Give these parents "little" jobs, but no more.

As a Tiger Den Leader, identify those adult partners that are enthusiastic to be your "assistants" and work with them.  Don't hand over the Tiger Den to a grumpy mom or dad that will not follow through when it's their turn to run a meeting or an activity. 

[eagle-pete]

Correct me if I am wrong, but based on what TigerDen2 has posted, I believe that the original issue, "How do I get them to volunteer?", is referring more to help with the various den projects, activities, and tasks associated with running a successful den, and not so much how to get parents to be Tiger Partners.

 

TigerDen2 stated: "The parents MUST attend & they know it. I had two drop out immediatley after the first meeting when they found out it wasn't a baby sitting service."

 

It appears that TigerDen2 has already made it clear to the parents that there needs to be Tiger Partners. I got the sense from the posts that TigerDen2 would simply like some ideas and direction on how to approach parents for help with the den, beyond the Tiger Partner responsibility.

 

This is not an uncommon issue which all Den Leaders face, and it is a good topic to bring up.

 

TigerDen2 -

I am not a forum moderator or anything, but I would like to say that it appears you may have been unjustly flamed here. If you feel that someone's reply (not to name names - ScoutNut) was a bit harsh, don't take it personally or assume that this is how your comments are normally going to be treated on this forum. The past 2 years I have been a member, I have only been flamed..... 50 or 60 times (kidding). Actually, the forum is fairly reasonable and allows for many opinions to be expressed, for the most part. A word of caution, however.. the Scout Motto applies here - Be Prepared to back up policy statements with official sources. You will be challenged on these from time to time.

 

ScoutNut -

Ease up a little, eh? My Gosh! TigerDen2 just joined... At least let them move out of "New Forum Member" status before firing up the Flame Thrower... Policy speaking, you are absolutely correct, however I don't believe that Tiger Partners was the original issue to be addressed. All TigerDen2 wanted was advice on how to get parents to volunteer (read the subject). That is an issue which applies to Tigers, Wolves, Bears, and Webelos. And if they can pick up some good parent/den relationship building skills now, it may be useful for positions they may hold in the future as well. Let's cut 'em a little slack, whadda ya say?

 

Eagle Pete

[Eagledad]

>>For some parents, just registering with the BSA is traumatic enough. You have to be flexible or you could lose them and their boys for good. Give these parents "little" jobs, but no more.