Onslow

16 hours ago, fred8033 said:

If a person is not willing to follow the GTSS, then that person should not be a scout leader and should not supervise scouts.  Period.  As part of becoming a leader, we explicitly sign that we will follow these rules.  It's a promise and an expectation.

Floats ... What is "unsupported" ?    When water is involved, absolutely follow G2SS, Safe Swim Defense and Safety Afloat.  Anything less puts scouts in danger and puts your troop and yourself at risk.  That means qualified supervision. 

 

Unsupported as in camping in spots where during the course of a float trip wherein external support is not feasible, or purposefully avoided.

I've seen my fair share of shenanigans.  My own son was awarded a 50 miler award when he only completed 1 hour of service work instead of 10.  I've been pressured to sign off on on awards and have refused.  I witnessed an adult leader be awarded a 5 year veteran award who had only been a leader for 38 months at the last district banquet.  This stuff unfortunately happens all the time.  Good ole boy nepotism ......

There was also a point in time in my early scouting career I did not have a complete handle on all the processes, such as  differentiating in any meaningful the difference between discuss and demonstrate.  I later learned the my errors and made necessary corrections.  Some "shenanigans" are mistakes due to inexperience , and some are boorish purposeful fudging, while other incidents may be just plain laziness.

Advancement is only one of eight methods of scouting.  Personal growth is also a method, and I think most would agree it is much more meaningful.  About 30 percent of our Troop is either ADHD, OCD, or ASD.  It has always been this way, and it takes a caring, consideration, and time, to move a Troop forward in this situation, and still have the unit program to be youth led.

I smell a little fudge.

14 hours ago, tnmule20 said:

I just read an article about a 16 year old Boy Scout losing his life due to dehydration on a hike in the Arizona desert.  https://www.foxnews.com/us/boy-scout-dies-arizona-desert

First, let me express my deepest condolences to his Family, Friends, and Troop.

I would like to hear the forum's opinions on the liability of being a Boy Scout leader.  Not just about this terrible tragedy but across the board.  There are so many different things happening within the BSA right now.  Personal responsibility and personal liability are always in the mix regardless of whether the BSA insurance covers you.

Just an open ended question that can go in many different directions.

Thank you for your responses.

 

These should be areas of focus for relatively new leaders (3 years or less experience):

1. Understand the BSA parameters. Constantly study the Guide to Safe Scouting, acquaint one's self  with the Troop Leader Guidebook.  Understanding what the is permissible or not is key.  There is no help for an adult leader that haplessly blunders into forbidden territory.

2.  Learn to use resources that measure conditions.  For example, many flat foots head out Grayson Highlands & Mt. Rogers VA in the Spring for backpacking not understanding the relationship between altitude (4500-5500') and weather vs 400'.  Many find themselves nearly freezing to death.  There are resources that can help figure things out, such as Wunderground which used to have historic data on private weather stations in some places that are relevant to hikers.  This may not be the case anymore, but the point being, be diligent.

Comprehending river flow data is another skill.  Use resources such as this https://waterdata.usgs.gov/mo/nwis/rt to stay on top of conditions leading up to a trip.  Have parameters (max safe flows for any given outing) in cfs flow established well ahead of the trip.

3.  Take the time to enroll in First Aid, and more importantly Wilderness First Aid.  Make sure the WFA class is legit.  Our local council just had a fella offer an 8 hour WFA.  Those who are in the know understand this is not legit. 

WFA can/should inform folks how to run a tight ship, such as release form/health form management.  Yes, I carry 4 pounds of health forms when backpacking.

There are a multitude of other online classes that are helpful provided BSA.  If your unit love rivers, take some ACA classes.

An umbrella insurance policy won't bring someone back from the dead, or out of a wheelchair due to spinal injury.  It is all about discipline, discipline, and discipline. 

Thus far in 6 years, our Troop has had more issues with adult crisis than issues with the youth.  Heart attacks, and diabetes related issues loom large on the adult side.  On the youth side, a youth experienced moderate secondary complications stemming from a tick bit, and one incident due to not using water purification equipment properly....GI issues.  My biggest fear is an adult leader dying of cardiac arrest in the woods.

My Troop occasionally perform uniform inspections for an arbitrary period, and recognizes the scout who best meets all the criterias. This exercise has improved the appearance of the scouts well past the exercise.  I suggest doing this type of exercise in the Winter for 8 weeks.  There isn't much going on outdoors this time of year.

So older scouts want to get their game on with backpacking and unsupported overnight floats, but there is a strong presence of 10-12 year old scouts.  There is never enough time, or committed adults to enable a satisfactory situation for all.  No backpack trip in two years...Let's have a discussion about Outdoor Program management and fairness.  I seeking examples of good activity management and Outdoor Program management.

Also do you adhere to the age recommendations for backpacking...13 and up? 

On 3/3/2019 at 1:31 PM, David CO said:

It's always a possibility, when you expose your children to other religions and cultures, that they will choose a different path from your own. It is the risk you take by raising confident, intelligent children.

Despite their Catholic school education, about 1/3 of my family has chosen a different religion. It was their choice. They will believe what they believe. I'm a little disappointed by it, but it's not the end of the world.

 

 

 

 

 

I feel you're completely missing the point.  Sectarian preaching is wholly inappropriate in the world of scouting imo.  Whatever happened to "A Scout is Kind"?

I once witnessed a hell fire sermon being preached at a camporee.  I'm a Baptist, and I regret not reporting this to the council as an inappropriate incident.

The patrol method is covered in considerable detail in the Troop Leader Guidebook Vol. I.  Unfortunately, very few adult leaders read the Troop Leader Guidebook.

The Troop I currently participate in recently has recently experienced a succession.  The former SM valued the youth led concept, but failed to facilitate the fruition of a youth led Troop because of the following processes were not practiced.

• No ILST training for 6 years
• No annual or semi annual planning conference with the PLC ever.
• No ASMs assigned as patrol advisors to hold youth leadership accountable, e.g., making sure DRs and menu plans are made, executed properly, and notes taken as to who ducked assigned tasks.  This causes headaches on the advancement side.

The new SM seems to be intent on spoon feeding the youth content and completely dismantling any meaningful youth leadership opportunities.  This is partly due to the fact he has a scout son that is TF rank.  Parents/adult leaders of younger scouts tend to care very little about the needs of Scouts Star rank and up, and seem to be more fixated on their own child's advancement and experience over the needs of the unit, or the overarching goal, personal growth.

I suspect less than 50 percent of the unit/adult leaders in my district know what the stated aims of scouting are.  Almost as many probably do not know there are even stated aims.  

Quote

" My district team has a hard enough time communicating with the unit leaders in our district.  I can only imagine how hard it is for national people to communicate with unit leaders.  It shouldn't be that way, but it is."

National communicates via online training and various publications.  The most substantial of which is the Troop Leader Guidebook Vol. I -III imo.  However, few make an effort to immerse themselves in the TLG and other publications.  District training focuses only on compliance such as "make sure your YP is up-to-date", but not so much on program comprehension, or even discussions about teaching tools.

@qwazse, I want to learn more about the wild ride you speak of.

13 hours ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

Another ECC Scouter?

WELCOME!

OHC

2 hours ago, SSScout said:

Onslow?  Is that "Bookay" or "Bucket"?  😎

Bookay, but I'm keeping the tank top!

Stopping by to learn a few things, and to blow off some steam.  Hopefully I won't degrade this fine resource in any manner.

Ran the Outdoor program for the Troop for several years, served a CC, and now serving as ASM.  Looking to start of a Venturing unit in the near future.

Cheers Y'all