83Eagle

I keep tossing an idea around in my head but I can't seem to get it to crystalize into something that I can make work. Maybe someone out there has done something like this. I'd like to do a hands on camping demo for our first pack meeting of the year when we get all the new scouts in to generate a little excitement. So I'm thinking that we could set up a number of stations--one where the boys would set up a tent, another where they would do a quick cooking something-or-other, one where they would learn a campfire song or two, another where they would build different types of fire lay

Just to follow up on this. As usual the easiest way to do something is just to do it. So we divided up into 2 patrols and had them meet in different parts of our big meeting area. Different adults work with each group. Nothing really magical about making it happen. The boys liked choosing patrol names based on available BSA patrol patches. They are going to put their patrol patch on their red vest for now which they can move to their tan shirt when they become Webelos soon. (I'm sure there's something against the guidelines about that patch approach, but I don't care because they like it.

I think that discussion is great and criticism--that is, an argument based in critical thinking--is helpful. My point is that it's all too easy to get mired in the negative, and too quick for points of discussion to turn into giant B&M sessions. And I cant help but wonder, if some people have the time to write, quite literally, page after page of points and counterpoints to virtually every topic that comes up, couldnt those countless hours be better spent actually working to effect the change they're looking for? This is, after all, not some empowered councilits the electronic equiva

After a hiatus from Scouting, I returned to the BSA ranks, this time as an adult leader. A few years afterward, I found out about this site, and it looked to be a great source for sharing ideas about ways to make what I felt to be a great program even better. And I do believe that Scouting is a great program today. What I see today is at the Cub Scout level, it is certainly TONS more fun than when I was a Cub making macaroni crafts at the Den Mothers house. At the Boy Scout level, I see troops working where the boys were in charge and doing fun and adventurous stuff, completely unlike the

Yes Scouting is for the boys but there is nothing iherently wrong with scouting being (also) a program that is for adults. There is nothing inherently wrong with adults volunteers (also) being personally ambitious as it relates to the earning of knots and whatnot. We can't ask for, or bemoan the lack of, volunteers on one hand, and then begrudge those same volunteers for (also) claiming a personal stake in the program.

I've seen it first hand among The Chosen Ones in our council. They are BOY SCOUT volunteers here to deliver a BOY SCOUT program. The Cubbies are more than welcome to do their own thing, just don't ask them for anything. I've experienced this first hand at the Roundtables. Doesn't matter that I have an Eagle knot on my uniform, it's the blue shoulder tabs they focus on. Locally, I can't get a den chief either (we've never had one in our Dens, period) and although our "feeder troop" professes it wants to "increase interaction" between the CS and BS when I visit the Pack meetings, I ne

read my first post. I did (again), and it doesn't mention Tigers, so I'm not sure what you're referring to, so perhaps you could be more explicit. Unless you are saying to drop the Tiger program altogether as part of shortening the Cub Scout program? I'm not really gonna argue this any more because it's not germane to what I have to do to run our program. I'm just stating my experience with crestfallen Kindergarteners who pick up a join up flyer at the school presentation and then find out they can't join for another year. So I'm wondering why make it 2, particularly when it's been

Scoutfish, I think this is a great idea as long as you are respectful of their role, which it appears you are. When I became a Tiger Leader, I was told "just follow the book," except for the part about getting parents involved in running things because "that doesn't work." Needless to say that didn't work well and in hindsight I would have loved to have a coach with ideas for how to get things done and be fun. Now that I am CM and with DL experience behind me I have lots of ideas for activities and "what works" and I let the TDL know I'm available. Sometimes they take the help, somet

>>Girl Scouts handle this with no problem--Daisies are kindergarteners, and Service Unit activities combine all the ages. From what I've seen and been told, the older girls don't really get bothered by events that involve the "little kids" until about 6th grade,

The points about the program being repetitous are well taken. The food pyramid in both Tiger and Wolf...really? And like they didn't cover that in school well before you had to cover it in the badge book. You all know the many other examples out there. Having the same Den leader for 4-5 years can be a drawback. There are different skill sets needed for Tigers versus second year Webelos and not everyone is good at spanning that range. Not everyone is the outdoorsy type and that becomes increasingly important over time. Not to sound sexist, but if 2nd year Webelos have the same "Den Mother

We will have two Bear dens. Now, it so happens that these two Bear Dens will meet in the same location, at the same time. And sometimes, they will be working on the same project or activity. This just makes sense for sharing resources, facilities, expertise, planning, and to preserve the dynamics of the group that have caused the Den to grow from 5 to 9 to 13 boys since the Tiger year. So call it a matter of semantics then...My thinking is that boys will find the idea of having Patrols and Patrol names somewhat more interesting than being part of Bear Den 1 and Bear Den 2. I'm already env

Eagledad, I'm really inspired by the level of responsibility your Webelos have taken on. Honestly, sometimes our current 2nd year Webelos are worse behaved and less responsible than the Tiger den. This is really a result of a combination of the W2 nanny-style den leadership along with what had traditionally been a top-down controlled Pack program. I have already changed the latter but, as to the former...well, they're crossing over in two months so it's time to begin setting expectations with the W1 Den (and Bears, etc.) I have always found that boys will live up or down to your expe

Eagledad, I really like your ideas when it comes to planning. Since we have very active parents in the den I think that would work well. Could be a hybrid parents/scout/family planning. Definitely something to think about because a lot of our parents are at the meetings anyway. (Oh, the last time I brought this up I was admonished here that that one of the purposes of Cub Scouting is to "wean" the boys from parents to transition into Boy Scouts, so let me say that I understand this, and I consider parental involvement a blessing!) I'd like to stress that the DL and ADL get along very

Well, I just bit the bullet and built this in to the December Pack meeting. I decided to "blame" it on the Den Leaders who said their scouts were "disappointed" that we didn't sing more, since it's part of the Tiger and Wolf book to sing at pack meetings, and Webelos could use if for their showman pin, so who was I to argue! Cub Scout Spirit, some Christmas songs sprinkled thru the meeting, Oh Tannenbaum and Vespers. Worked very well and being the Christmas party helped as well. Sometimes you just gotta do it.(This message has been edited by 83eagle)

Thanks for the advice based on experience of handling larger dens. Regarding the advice to split into two bona fide dens, that is not an option that we are going to pursue. Or, fine, call them two dens if you will--we are going to have two Bear Dens, with two different Den Leaders. It just so happens that these two dens will meet in the same place, at the same time, and will probably be working on the same activity in their own part of the room. And the two dens will get together as a big group on occasion for various activities (snow tubing with 13 works just as well as with 6 or 7).

Our Bear den has grown to be somewhat unweildly at 13 scouts. It works, but it was easier to get things done when the group was smaller. So after talking about it, the DL and ADL are going to form 2 "patrols." The den still meets together (the time works for everyone and the space is plenty big), it's just a way to make things managable and also hopefully move the boys toward more self-organization/direction. So don't read this as bona fide Boy Scout Patrols--maybe "dens within a den." I'm wondering if others out there have done this and, if so, I'm looking for helpful suggestions as to

I love the foam finger idea and tying it to a correctly uniformed incentive! Always better to incent through rewards than punishment if you can. The tutu idea is awesome and your kids will love it. Good idea setting a managable goal, which you are sure to exceed. (Don't listen to any detractors--some people can find the cloud in any silver lining and just can't wait to give you unsolicited advice based on half-informed assumptions!)

Do you have a problem with equality? Absolutely not! If society thinks the death tax is a great idea as a means to take what people have earned after they die, that practice should be applied equally, rather than after some arbitrary limit that taxes descendents unequally. Tax 'em all the same percentage from dollar one. That would be completely equal. Likewise for income taxes. If we are to have income taxes, everyone should pay the same, equal percentage of their income as taxes, rather than the current inequal system that discourages productivity. If everyone were taxed the same

-sigh- If you'll read my earlier response, I said: "He should be told to do so by the CM, or the CM or the advancement coordinator should do it." I don't know how this equates to being relieved of his position, but if you want to read it that way just to argue I'm not going to play along.(This message has been edited by 83eagle)

This is not that hard. The book says the scout will get the totem and beads, period.

When grandma goes toes up and leaves something of sentimental value, it usually is not of siginifcant monitary value. Tax it as such. If its a $3Mil diamond necklace, you better be able to afford keeping it. If you can't afford the taxes on that, you'd be better off selling it anyways. You're dancing along the extremes again...millions of dollars on one end, versus no significant monitary value on the other. If the death tax is good for large estates, it's good for everyone, right? If not, why not? And if not, what should the arbitrary threshhold be? Face it, the death tax w

According to the Tiger Handbook, after a boy learns the motto, sign, and salute, "he is awarded the Tiger Cub Immediate Recognition Emblem," not "he may be." It also lumps the recognition emblem and track beads among the "recognition items" that "will be presented to them at a simple ceremony at a pack or den meeting." It goes on to say that "A boy receives totem beads as he completes each part." Sounds pretty clear to me, so if the TDL is not doing this he is not following the program and is cheating the boys. He should be told to do so by the CM, or the CM or the advancement coor

And as a relative newbie around here myself, I hate to say that seems to happen to a lot of newbies. @clemlaw--I completely agree with you; this can be a vicious forum where assumptions are made and judgments quickly cast. But I find the "ignore user" function works pretty well.

I would not give awards that have not been earned, period. This sets a bad precedent to the boys who did not complete the rank badge activity, and it minimizes the work of the boys who did complete the badge. Believe me, the boys know who has done what! Our den had the issue of a boy joining very recently, after many boys are 3/4 thru the Bear Badge. I explained to the scout and parents that he was "behind" the other boys in terms of badge progress, but that was OK because scouting was not just about the badges, and that he could work on anything at home that he missed. Regarding aw

As a relative newcomer to these forums I have been amazed by the level of personal insults and general lack of decorum here. What shocks me is that this is supposed to be a Scouting forum were people who believe in a common set of values come together to discuss things of mutual interest. Obviously an "Issues and Politics" thread is going to generate debate. However, going through the Scouting-topic threads shows plenty of evidence of people who seemingly wait at their keyboards for the next opportunity to whip out the rule books or generally make people feel stupid with "I can't believe