SueM

I agree that there isn't the expectation of kids helping as much as there was in the past..and I'm as guilty as anyone. I have tried things like putting up a list of things that I'd like done, with a small stipend amount that I would pay for each item. It works great most of the time, but then it also kind of defeats the purpose of teaching the kids that they have a responsibility to help around the house WITHOUT the expectation of being paid for everything that they do.

One of the other issues that I think that we face today that we didn't as much in the past is Child Welfare issues...if we send our 8 year olds out there to learn how to mow the lawn and he gets hurt with the mower, there is the threat of being charged with child endangerment! I grew up on an old fashioned family farm and we did everything from an early age...and much of the stuff was working around dangerous machinery!! My dad also had laying hens and we did home egg delivery. Before I was in elementary school, I used to go with Dad to help when he did deliveries and I would be walking around various neighborhoods delivering eggs to houses on my own..I knew how to make change for a dollar when I was 5!! In the summer, we went door to door selling sweet corn..how many parents can risk allowing kids to go door to door to do ANYTHING these days, with the risks that there are now? We babysat our younger siblings while they were out doing field work..I started cooking the family meals when I was 10! We were not the "exception" either...this was how most people around us lived..I KNOW that today if we'd do those same things and the kids would get hurt..we'd be in jail in many cases!!

Gee..I'm beginning to sound like an old foggie!!

Sue M.

I've been jokingly called Scoutmistress on an occasion or two...might be interested in a badge someday too...right now though I'd settle for I'd settle for the SM Award of Merit!!

sue

We selected a permanent patrol leader at our course..and that was just 2 years ago.

Sue M.

Question #1..Is this a Boy Led troop or an Adult led troop? It sounds like if the boys are unprepared, etc. that they are expecting the adults to do the work and hand everything to them without earning it.

Question #2..is the Leadership trained? It sounds to me like there is something wrong if boys are acting rude to the leaders and other adults and they are not being called on it. What part of the Scout law does that follow??

What should YOU do???...go to training yourself!! It'll at least give you more perspective on what SHOULD be happening within the troop and perhaps some ideas about what you can do to quietly affect change within the troop.

Good Luck!!

sue M.

Mark Ray's book "The Scoutmasters OTHER Handbook" is a good resource to start with. It gives you a lot of ideas for questions not only for an Eagle BOR, but for all ranks.

Other wise, I generally ask a lot of questions about their journey to Eagle...their overall scouting experience..how scouting has affected their lives, their plans for the future, etc. Then also lots of talk about their Eagle project and leadership.

Sue M.(This message has been edited by SueM)(This message has been edited by SueM)

Brian,

Like the others have said, each ticket is individual to each person..and very dependant on your OWN vision for how you see the future of your pack. You may also find that you work personal growth into many of your ticket items in one way or another too...at least I did. Most of my ticket items addressed me facing my own personal fears and weaknesses as -part- of the process...a side benefit, if you will and working through them to the benefit the troop for the long term. Taking over as SM for a year was NOT an easy thing for me to do, but it was in the best interest of the troop for me to do it at that time. I am a naturally shy person who hates being front and center..but this has allowed me to build the self-confidence I needed, as well as starting to get the troop back on track to being a Boy Led Troop. It's carried over into other areas of my life! And this is the real benefit IMO of going to Wood Badge...while you do make a difference in your program, the training also spills over into all areas of your life!

There is a real need to get cub scouters into Wood Badge early enough that they can have an impact on Packs. Too often Cub leaders take it when they are Webelos den leaders and then they cross over to troops all to quickly afterwards.

sue M.

I know a few troops who do not allow parents at meetings at all unless they put on the shirt and go to training! (i.e. there is then a purpose for them to be there other than being a distraction!) Yes, you definitely need them for resources sometimes and you don't want to alienate them but they need to also understand that this is not a social hour for either them or the boys. I had one parent who would continually come and criticize me because some patrols had nothing to do during meetings and ask me why they weren't working on a merit badge or something (this was back when we were just starting to transition into a more boy led troop) and continually try to tell me how to run the troop.

That said..I like the idea of having the SPL ask the adults to be quieter...though I'm sure that some adults would not appreciate being asked to do so by a boy!!

sue m

While they're not small cards..our trading post has recently gotten in something similar..it's a sturdier version of the requirement section from the handbook that the boys can easily carry with them. They're a whole lot easier to bring with them when it comes time for a SM conference and it saves the SM time in searching through the book for the requirement section too!

Sue M.

Eamonn,

What about a Ship Website?? I don't usually give plugs for any particular site but try looking at www.freewebs.com It's totally free if you allow popups..but for a reasonable $10 a year, you can avoid those. They have easy to use templates and it's extremely easy to use...We built our troop site there almost 3 years ago and have used it since then. You can post pictures and any kind of info you want and everyone can access it any time for updates, etc.

Sue m.

It is springtime..I guess all the bobwhite have gone to the ground and are nesting!! Where's Lisabob??? Have any of you circling raptors spotted any bobwhite yet??

sue m.

Trevorum,

I assume that your troop is not using TroopMaster or some other record keeping software to fall back on...what about a Troop record book?? Do you use one of those? Or a wall advancement chart? As far as the other ranks go, can you go to your council office and have them print out what they have for him?? It should give you the dates that he achieved his Scout, Tenderfoot and Second Class ranks at least..if they have those dates then he has achieved the rank! (If he still has the rank cards you could use them too...we always make a point to tell our boys to keep those in a safe place just in case we need them for verification purposes later) Then if any of your adult leaders can verify the missing info that might help too. We just had a boy transfer into my troop who was in a similar situation. Before he did it though he got a new book and sat down with the adults and they signed off on those requirements that they KNEW that he had done and left open any that they had doubts about.

Sue m.

Seeing the hungry Eagle soaring around looking for food must have sent the Bobwhites scurrying for cover!!

sue

I don't think that it's true that you can only staff the course once...many of the people that are on our staff for the next course were on the last course. The rule as I have been told only says that 30% of the staff must be new staffers.

We were sent out an invitation to be on staff with the schedule of training dates, etc. listed and a post card to return if we would like to be considered...I'm not sure how other CD'ers handle the selection though.

sue m.

Vicki,

The Uniform is one of the subjects that I handle at BLT too and one of the things that I spend part of the time doing is giving them alternative ideas or suggestions of how they or the parents can provide boys with free or low cost uniforms, such as having a troop uniform closet or finding them at yard sales or even on ebay. So many times parents and boys use the "high expense" of uniforms as an excuse as to why they don't wear them so this gives the leaders more ideas of how to address those concerns.

As our patrol project for Wood Badge we also researched the history of Uniforms in all the areas of Scouting and I have our project board and I take it with me for an exhibit to use too. It's really a pretty neat exhibit..we made the background of each section look like an official uniform and then collected pictures of various styles that were used over the years and pasted them on top with raised "bullet" explanations.

Sue M.

Barry,

Thanks! I'm not on an ego trip with things..I fully understand that it needs to be a team effort with the other adults. However, there are times when I have adults just step in and tell the boys things that are both contrary to troop progress AND possibly go against BSA policy, so I do need to watch things. When I get a new adult into the Troop, I kind of let them hang back for a while to see what area interests them the most and then put them into the position of where they can best follow that interest and make an impact in the troop. Most of them have now been through training but we all know well that sometimes that does not exactly mean that they are fully on board with understanding what a BLT really is. For example, we are just to the point of where the boys are starting to be able to plan meetings..and we had just held a PLC for the first time in several years and I brought in the Troop Program Resources book to the boys to try to explain to them how if they just came up with the themes, that the whole months' meetings were already planned out for them easily, etc. So at this same time, one of my ASM's was also coming into the idea of lack of planning so we also planned an adult meeting a couple of weeks later. As he started to discuss this, I tried to show him where I was headed with the boys and using the Troop Program Feature books, etc...though he is trained, he had never SEEN it! Many times we are more on the same brainwave then they THINK we are and I accept that I am partially to blame with that as sometimes I am not able to explain things as clearly as I'd like. There are times though when I feel like there is an undertone that they are not quite sure that I know what I'm talking about. As a female SM it's sometimes hard to feel like I get the same respect that a man might get in the position...especially if there are adults who undermine that respect with the boys.

sue

I am currently -trying- to use the ticket "idea" with my other adult leaders in the troop who have not been through WB. They are telling me that they want "more say" in how the troop is run, but at this moment in time I still need to control the reins because they're not quite onboard with the vision I have to get the troop back to a BLT. I listen to their ideas but sometimes they run counter to where we need to go...other times they don't though so I do try to incorporate them. So what I have asked them is to look at the troop and pick one area where they think we need to improve things and develop a personal goal to work toward in that area. So far though, no one has come up with anything. I realize though that as a team, we're just in the Forming stage so it will take time for them to see where I'm going.

sue m.

I used to be a BEAVER

and a good ole' BEAVER too

But now I'm finished BEAVERING

I don't know what to do

I'm growing old and feeble

and I can BEAVER no more

So I'm going to work my ticket if I can

Back to Gilwell, Happy land

I'm going to work my ticket if I can

Sue M.

Are you thinking about a troop operations type handbook?? A friend of mind did something similar for a ticket item for his troop and it's very nice. What he did was to take each "event" that might happen in a troop (camping trip, fundraiser, summer camp, etc.) and made a binder showing the boys -exactly- what needed to be done by printing out the forms, giving instructions on what needed to be done when etc. It actually came out very nice...Is This what you have in mind??

sue m.

I never set out to become a female Scoutmaster, but I think that my reasons for taking on the responsibility was pretty much the same as most mens' reasons are...I did it for the boys! My consideration was that it was in the troops' best interest..and therefore all the boys IN the troops' best interest that I step up and take the job. I was not only the only one willing but also the only one who at the time understood that what we were doing in the troop was not real scouting and that if I did not do this, that we would continue to be handing out Eagles to boys who I felt did not deserve them!! One of the Aims of Scouting is healthy assciation with adults..it doesn't say it needs to ONLY be Male adults, although I do agree and appreciate that the majority of the boys contact with adults SHOULD be with other adult males..this is why I keep my own son involved!! However I also do not think that it does boys any harm to get used to the idea of a woman in a position of authority! When I was discussing stepping up into the SM role, one of the committee members asked the questions "How do you think the boys will feel about a female SM??" and one of the ASM's said "If they cannot handle a woman in the position of authority at age 12..13..14..15..HOW are they going to survive in the world when they go out to get a real job?? They need to get used to working with everyone, no matter if they are men or women!!"

Anyway...any time I start to wonder WHY in the WORLD I agreed to do this..a good friend reminds me 'Remember..it's FOR THE BOYS!!"

sue m.

The copyright fee currently is $400 for the course. It used to be $15 per participant so if you had a full course of 40 that would have been $600..

Hey gwd-scouter..if the timing of your course is bad, you can always come up here for our course, which runs the Sept 8-10th and Sept30-Oct 2nd and the cost is $190!! I still think it would help you in your quest to reach the BLT quick, but then that's JMO!!

Sue M.

Novice Cubmaster,

Nope..it's run by the local council and staff is all local. They do have to pay a copyright fee to BSA etc. but it's a BSA program.

sue m.

Bob,

Welcome to the forum! Like gwd-scouter, I am also a female SM who had to step up to takeover what was basically an adult led troop when none of the men would do it and have also faced (and am still facing!) many of the same issues that she has. I am 18 months into the SM job (though I also did it unoffically for several months prior to that) and we are just getting to the point of trying to do patrol camping..and regular PLC's and boys starting to run meetings. Your situation is somewhat more challenging though since you still have a SM with a set idea to contend with and that poses a real obstacle for you to get around. Perhaps you should sit down with your CO, CC and COR and even your Unit Commissioner and discuss the situation with them and seek their advice on how to procede. Make sure that the other adults are -really- with you on things because it is also a major problem if you have one (or more) adults who sabotage your efforts because they don't have a total understanding of what you are aiming for and go off in their own direction and sometimes undermine the progress in the process.

Otherwise..what if you started to take a particular patrol and begin to mentor them..help them start to come up with ideas for meetings, etc., have them start teaching skills to the younger scouts in their patrol who may need help and see how that works. Good luck..it is a long, hard fight...two steps backward for each step forward, but it'll be worth it.

Sue M.

In our district, we do the BLT & IOLS in March so that we can get the new leaders in as soon as possible after crossover and we do them 2 weeks apart and we can weave the 2 together a little better and things are still fresh in their mind. We form them into their patrols at the end of BLT and then they have the week inbetween to have a Patrol meeting and get their camping things together and plan their outdoor experience. It's ALWAYS cold for the IOLS weekend too..

sue m.

At our course we got t-shirts & baseball cap. On the last day then the local guy who sells WB memorabilia came in with the cups and other things and you could buy them if you wanted..which I did. Then it was up to the individual to do their own adornment...the "contest" was more of who could come up with a quick macrame belt hanger for it before we left the course site! At home then I hand drew my totem then used the dremel and colored it with a sharpie! Occasionally I'll go over it again when it wears off a bit.

Speaking of memorabilia...has anyone else seen or gotten the new WB critter stave/staff toppers??? They just came in locally the first of March. They're resin and you attach them by means of a double sided screw. Anyway..they're $10 here and available at our local trading post!!

sue m.

Our next course (which will be in Sept) has at least 2 on staff who are involved in Venturing...there actually may be more, but these are the 2 that I'm most familiar with. One is going to be the Scribe and the other a Troop Guide, but I don't remember any specific Venturing Advisor for the youth at my course..

Sue M