SM406

I was a dining assistant at SubCamp 3 in the Northeast region at the 2001 Jamboree. We were up early, went to bed late. Our job was to feed the Staff at the SubCamp; our group clicked right away and had a great time. We had enough staff that we rotated time off so that we could experience the activities during the day and the arena shows. The Action Areas look pretty cool. I am trying to staff the Council contingent this time, however if I am not selected I will for sure sign on for national staff.

SM406

Dsteele,

Our troop was originally charted in 1915 as Troop1, and with all of the merging of districts and Councils over the years our troop number has been changed to 406. My question is can a troops number be changed at the request of the chartering organization?

And can there be a Troop 1 anymore? (Understanding that Woodbadge likes to use troop one in its courses).

Of course I welcome anyones input.

SM406

At least the cub was there at the meeting. Sometimes that is half the battle just getting them to want to go. I agree about speaking quietly at this age group, to the Dad first about setting the example and then build on the positive of what the boy had right with his uniform.

With my sense of style (orange sleeves, way cool), if it wasn't for my wife to keep me straight, who knows what I would be wearing.

SM406

We saw the lights here west of Pittsburgh. The family was out Trick-or-Treating, when we saw them. It was my first time to see them and it was really cool.

SM406

I agree with Fat Old Guy. Should we be concerned with todays values? If values are based on some strong foundation (like the Bible), what were once good values should remain good values no matter how society has changed its perception of good or which generation it is. I would rather see the BSA fold and go away before it changes its value system.

SM406

I believe there is a by the book answer, actually it is a book. My definition has changed over time and as my Scouting positions have changed.

As a CM A SM is the Guy who has all the fun.

As a Troop MC A SM is a pain in the butt.

As a Troop MC after Woodbadge A SM is the trainer of boy leaders.

As a SM A SM is the Guy who has the privilege to train boys to be leaders and has most of the fun.

Ooops, Sorry, I read description and my mind registered definition. Oh well!

SM406

I have also experienced frustration at trying to reach our DE's through Council. Finally cornering them at a Roundtable one night and discussing with them my frustration about communications, I found out one DE prefers email and the other DE likes the cell phone. Ever since then I have received better service from the DE's. Maybe it is just finding out their preferred method of contact.

SM406

The gathering of patrols for which I am SM recently did just what BW proposed. We had the district trainer for YP give a presentation to the Committee. The Committee then informed the parents that the troop was going to be covering this subject and the parents were invited in to preview the tapes. Most parents spoke favorably about being consulted first and being allowed to decide about the level of exposure of their sons. The entire event went smoothly. Having experienced first hand what BW posted above, I fully recommend the process.

SM406

Our District Camporee Committee recently started something along the same lines of a Cracker Barrel. The Committee has a Friday night leaders meeting. They call this meeting a mug-up. Those that are invited to the meeting are encouraged to bring a mug up to the shelter for coffee, hot chocolate or sometimes even soup. This meeting is something of a toned down Cracker Barrel.

SM406

My thoughts are: if I am not following the program as designed, then I am misusing the program as it was intended to be. For better or for worse.

SM406

GeBlack,

In as much as I believe all adults (leaders or not) should refrain from smoking (drinking, and chasing women also) at Scout events, I also believe you should have been treated with more respect from the Scouter that brought this issue to your attention. To be so discourteous to you is also not setting the proper example for the Scouts (much less to you). Scouts learn a lot about the Scout Law and Oath not only from what they are taught but also from the visual cues sent by all the adults around them. Sometimes, Dads that are not Scouters, that attend Scout events with their sons have bigger impacts on other Scouts than the leaders do. This could be from the notion that as leaders the Scouts know us and come to expect a certain example (comes with the uniform) and the Scouts are looking for re-inforcment of the Oath and Law from non-Scouters. After all we are trying to teach a way of life to these young lads. I am sorry that you had to experience this behavior from a Scouter that should have known better.

SM406

I remember very vividly when my mother said ...You MAY Not do that! I understood very well that I was prohibited from doing it.

SM406

Adrianvs,

I tend to agree with your thoughts about the patrol and the troop. Which came first the patrol or the troop (chicken or egg thing)? I personally use the term reality as opposed to factual. In other words I believe (I have seen this in Troops I have been exposed to) the reality of the Boy Scout program today is it is Troop focused as opposed to Patrol focused. I have been to a lot of Boy Scout Training (I have my Woodbadge beads), but it was not until this forum, and the insights of several posters (positive or negative), that I realized somewhere overtime the emphasis has been flipped from what BP, Bill Hillcourt and others have wanted. In the gathering of patrols for which I am SM for, we are slowly switching back to a Patrol focus. It is a matter of a mind set to me that has been lost over time.

Along another line of thought, I have seen several times, this forum get into great flurry of postings over semantics. Semantics are important in a forum such as this, where our written word is instantly available to the world. It becomes even more important in the frame of this forum where we are all around a campfire having conversations, but without the benefit of other forms of human communications like facial expressions (smiley faces help but are weak), voice inflections, body posture, etc., that aid in making a point without being adversarial. I also believe that as a culture we have become lazy in our speech (written or spoken) and that we use terms interchangeably where we probably should not. Adrianvs, I hope you do not take this as a tirade towards you, it is not. I am just sharing some observations and thoughts.

SM406

My experience has been that the local council will have mistakes. Whither their information is wrong when they get it from local units or from when they input the information into their system. I would start by requesting a computer print out of your troop's advancement records from Council. From there you can begin checking against the information you have. Then if you have any boys that are approaching Eagle, I would start with their information, gather any supporting documents "pink sheets", blue cards and scout handbooks to make your case with council. Going forward, keep copies of the "pink sheets" in a binder in chronological order. Start a file on each boy, and keep their copy of the blue card for any merit badges. They fit perfectly in the plastic baseball card sheets. Then when the boy turns 18 give him the sheets. It pays to be organized in this area of advancements since there can be so much at stake.

Good Luck!

SM406

I do not know who snubbed who first, BSA or Clinton. One thing I do know is that Clintons signature is not on my sons Eagle certificate and I am glad.

SM406

Scary thoughts

I am just curious. Has anybody come across an adult Eagle Scout that laments that his parents pushed him to get his Eagle?

SM406

Fat Old Guy,

I do not remember, exactly, but were not all the boys wearing the neckerchief the same way? If they were all the same way would that be "uniform" uniforming?

SM406

packsaddle,

It sounds like you take the same care we do,and things still happen. I believe our Council's records come from the advancement form that is submitted. What happened to us once was on an Eagle appilication, Council had record of this Scout having earned First Aid after earning life. We were giving him credit for having earned it prior to and counting towards his Life. When we checked the pink sheet with this merit badge on it, the date Council had was the same as the date stamped on the pink sheet. We took the pink sheet and the blue card to Council and showed that the date on the blue card was before his Life rank. No problem, we got it all staighten out. Happy ending. It sure pays to go through these hoops prior to submitting the Eagle application doesn't it?

SM406

Fat Old Guy,

I noticed how the neckerchief was not being worn properly, I chuckled to myself and got out my whistle.

SM406

The person in charge of the Eagle applications at our Council Service center at first blush appears to be pretty anal about the precision of the advancement and merit badge dates and names on the application. But then consider the importance of the rank and award, every thing should be correct. I got to thinking about if our Council uses the Blue cards (we only turn in the third section Application for. The MB counselor should keep their third and we keep the applicants record in a file for the Scout. This part of the Blue card fits nicely in those plastic sleeves made for baseball cards.) I am not sure, however I have experienced Council using the date of when the advancement sheet was turned in to Council as the date for when the merit badges were earned as opposed to correctly use the date on the MB card or as listed on the Advancement sheet.

SM 406

I am curious. Pretty often you will hear adults who did not finish their Eagle express the wish that they had. And sometimes those same adults will say they wished their parents had encouraged or pushed them more. Has any one experienced an adult saying they regret their parents pushing them to obtain their Eagle and thus think less of it?

I do not believe that earning an Eagle automatically makes you a better citizen or person just as not earning an Eagle makes you any less a person. Sometimes even as adults we need to be encouraged or pushed to reach a goal. For what ever reason, we may not see the immediate value in reaching that goal, but someone comes along that has been there done that and has the clear picture for accomplishing the goal. They share their knowledge and insight to help us move along towards the goal.

SM406

Fat Old Guy

Our advancement chairman and I get a copy of the scouts advancement record from the Coucil before we submit the scouts Eagle application to council. We compare the scouts blue cards, etc to what the coucil says. If there are any differences, we try to come up with back up for our case either from the "pink sheets" or the blue cards (in most cases we are right). More often than not the problem is in the Scout not using the name he has been registered with. I try to catch it on the blue cards before they go in. So in essence we watch it close, but I have never seen a scout denied a merit badge for using the wrong first name.

SM406

Rooster7,

Great job Rooster7! Thank you!

SM406

Our troop has been wearing the red beret for as long as I can remember. We never dropped it. Since we ask the boys to recycle the hats once they turn 18, some of the hats go way back.

SM406