scoutingagain

Well since this thread has wandered sufficiently and I'm too lazy to go back and find OGE's original thread on the cost of gasoline I'll post

this here. Bottom line is world wide energy demand is high and there are no short term ways to meet demand, so prices keep going up.

SA

From Business Week Online

Oil Prices Could Get Even Worse

Tuesday August 10, 8:12 am ET

When will the world get a break from oil prices that seemed unimaginable a few years ago? Not anytime soon, analysts believe. If anything, the upward march seems to be gaining momentum, with U.S. oil prices breaking through $44 a barrel on the New York Mercantile Exchange this week. Paul Horsnell, head of Energy Research at Barclays Capital in London, now says: "The question is not whether $50 (per barrel) will be breached," but whether there will be any pause before the half-century mark is topped.

While there are lots of conspiracy theories about $40-plus barrel prices, a look at the fundamentals goes a long way toward explaining the hike. Growth in demand this year has proved a lot stronger than anyone forecast. The International Energy Agency, the Paris-based consumer group, forecasts that demand will be increase by as much as 2.5 million barrels a day over last year -- about double the increase anticipated.

A WORLD OF WOE. Indeed, the spurt in demand from China, the U.S., India, and elsewhere has caught just about everyone unawares. Governments, most notably the U.S., have done little to encourage conservation.The entire industry -- from OPEC to the international oil companies -- have failed to invest sufficiently in production capacity. Such investments will gradually increase, but it will be years before the effect is felt. As a result, spare production capacity is only about 1 million barrels per day, vs. 6 million barrels per day two years ago, Horsnell reckons. That razor-thin margin has the markets worried about the possibility of a severe crunch, especially when seasonal demand picks up. With the system already under strain, a cold winter in North America could have severe consequences.

There are also geopolitical situations weighing on the markets. Saudi Arabia, the world's most important oil exporter, is fighting Islamic insurgents who have targeted oil workers. Venezuela, another key producer, is seething with political unrest in the leadup to the Aug. 15 recall referendum on President Hugo Chavez. Russia, which not long ago was the best hope for stable new supplies, is now also a question mark thanks to the Kremlin's decision to go after Yukos, one of the country's two biggest oil producers. Iraq, another potentially promising source, has seen its oil infrastructure come under almost daily attack from insurgents.

If the spare capacity were greater, none of these situations would seem so threatening. But a repeat of last year's oil workers' strike in Venezuela, for instance, would be a disaster. Even a relatively routine occurrence -- a quickly extinguished fire that shut down a BP (NYSE:BP - News) refinery in Texas -- helped send prices up more than $1 a barrel on Aug. 6.

MORE RESERVES. Another factor: Hedge funds have discovered the oil markets as a volatile asset class that isn't correlated with other securities markets. The presence of these financial investors may add to volatility and accelerate momentum in price runups (see BW Online, 8/6/04, "Hedge Funds Are Everyone's Problem").

Finally, it doesn't help that the Bush Administration lacks an energy policy worthy of the name. In fact, analysts question why the U.S. government will continue adding to the strategic petroleum reserve when the markets are so tight. The Interior Dept. announced on Aug. 6 that it will be adding 100,000 barrels a day for six months, starting Oct. 1.

What will it take to calm worries? A substantial buildup in inventories, which are now well below their 5-year averages. But with little sign of slowing demand, such a change doesn't look likely in the near term. Oil prices are notoriously volatile and unpredictable, but anyone betting on a quick return to cheap gasoline and other oil products is likely to be disappointed.

Yes this was not an easy badge to get. As I recall the prone and kneeling positions were not too bad, but the standing position was the tough one. It was also expensive, as we had to pay for the rounds we used in practice and the rounds we used to shoot for completion of the badge. When I took this badge at summer camp I can recall spending most of the week at the rifle range.

I did not know the requirements had changed that much. I tend to agree with FOG that overall there has been a deterioration in the level of expectations for some badges and requirements for advancement.

SA

Just food for thought within this thread.

I read this weekend about a website called Faith-o-matic or some such name. Apparently you can answer a questionnaire on your particular faith and values and the site with assign you to one of 2000 religions, including 500 different denominations of Christianity, based on your responses. I wish I could remember the name and pass it on, but I was struck by the number of different religions it claimed, although I believe atheism was included, so there may only really be 1999 religions if atheism is not really a religion.

SA

"So off to lunch. If I'm lucky, it being Friday and all, there will be a guy in a dark suit on the sidewalk near the place where I'll get a cinnamon you-know-what. And as usual, he'll be standing on a milk crate, waving his Bible and yelling at passersby. At midday...in a dark suit...in the summer...in the South. Not very smart. A few of the passersby will yell back at him.

As long as that guy doesn't harm anyone (the stores think he's hurting business) he's free to do this, or if he choses, kneel in silent prayer (better for business, I suppose). There is nothing stopping private or public prayer. "

Yes, but to follow up, FOG asks if he should be tolerant if someone yells pi equals six. Well the answer, in my opinion is yes, at least legally. If the fellow described above spent all day yelling pi equals six as a religious ritual he is free to do so, as long as he doesn't harm anyone else. Nothing says anyone must agree with him. What the fellow yelling pi equals six is not allowed to do is force everyone at the football game to stop what they are doing so they can hear him yell pi equals six, or force others to join him, or discriminate against those that don't join him in yelling pi equals six.

Now in scouting, he could say that Pi, (now with an uppercase) is an omnipotent diety, a power for good greater than himself, and he could even be considered as being reverent by yelling Pi equals six.

Pack, hope you had a nice lunch.

SA

Scoutldr, you are correct. It is the behavior, not the orientation that I believe the Catholic Church believes to be immoral.

OGE, I feel bad about your experiences and do not mean any disprespect to you or other Catholics.

FOG, while we don't live in a perfect world, I believe the principles outlined in the G2SS, and the training provided to leaders and youth dramatically minimize the potential for abuse and if applied outside of scouting, whether at church, sports, or in the neighborhood would go far to help protect children from sexual predators. In scouting I believe the typical approach to a case of confirmed abuse would be to be summarily removed from membership and reported to the legal authorities. Contrast this approach to what went on in the Catholic Church.

SA

It is amazing that this topic keeps comming up and the same arguments are presented over and over again.

But I can't help myself either...

For those that feel their sons are safer in an organization that does not allow "avowed homosexual" adults as members, I believe that none of the adult to child/juvenile sexual abuse cases that occurred in the Catholic Church system were committed by "avowed homosexuals". To my knowledge, Catholics believe homosexuality to be immoral and do not allow "avowed" homosexuals to be members of the clergy. A position similar to the BSA's on it's adult membership requirements.

The membership policies do not protect kids or adults. The G2SS does.

SA

Thanks for a great lesson guys.

Scouting Again

VentureScout,

Glad to hear you had a great time. Don't say I did't warn you about the climb though. Regarding the Old Man. A great quote attributed to Daniel Webster goes, "..."Men hang out their signs indicative of their respective trades; shoe makers hang out a gigantic shoe; jewelers a monster watch, and the dentist hangs out a gold tooth; but up in the Mountains of New Hampshire, God Almighty has hung out a sign to show that there He makes men."

SA

I can't say which knot is most useful.

As a sailor, I use the bowline and figure 8 knots most often. Sometimes a clovehitch.

As a camper, I most often use two half hitches or a clove hitch. With the prevalence of tent slides, I don't use a taut line hitch much anymore.

As far a references go I don't have much. If I have a question on one of the basic knots, I usually track down my son's BS Handbook.

SA

REAL ESTATE DEVELOPER! Give me a break.

Maybe this was the post Hops was refering to about name calling.

SA

We use the Myers-Briggs system in some management training classes.

I'm an INTP.

SA

One of my dad's first jobs he had after he came back from WWII and went to college on the GI Bill was at a Boy Scout Camp for the summer. He was never a scout. As his sons came of age in the 60's he made sure we all signed up as Cubs and then onto Boy Scouts. He participated as a Committee Member, Ass't SM and eventually did a couple of years as Scoutmaster.

Fast forward 30 years and my own sons become eligible for membership and I ask them if they are interested in Cubscouting. We had always done a lot of outdoor activities and both enjoyed the cub scout experience. My older son lost interest after he crossed over. My younger son has kept his interest and it has grown over the last several years. I started out as an Asst. Den leader, and became a Committee member when my younger son crossed over. Now I'm the Adv. Chair for the Troop and participate in as many camping trips as I can get to.

I don't know what recruiting lessons there are. Enthusiastic parental support never hurts though.

SA

You never heard of the 150 miler award on an overnighter?

I admitted they had some usefulness. I'm just one of those folks that don't get along well with the dang infernal things.

SA

I may be wrong on this, and maybe Bob White will chime in to correct me if we're lucky, but I don't think the ban extends to snowmobiles. I'm pretty sure I can recall recent Boy's Life articles about snowmobile camping. So if an ATV event potentially interested anyone and since it's a banned activity, they may want to look into a snowmobile event as an alternative, provided appropriate supervision, training etc. is included. But, please don't take my word on this, double check on the use of snowmobiles.

Personally, at this point, I'm not a big fan of these mechanized contraptions as recreational activities. I'm not a big fan of internal combustion engines period but recognize they have utlitarian value. For recreation I'm more of a hiker, biker, skier, sailor type. I also remember how intrigued I was as a young teen by go karts, snowmobiles, mini-bikes etc. and how much fun they were and could see how scout age kids would find interest in them.

SA

Boleta,

Thanks for the flashback. My last MB that I earned for Eagle was Lifesaving and it took me 12 months to do it. Just as in your case, as a 5 ft., 110 lb 14 year old, I just physically could not wrestle a 170 lb lifeguard in the water into a rescue hold and perform the in water save requirement at summer camp that year and finished with a partial. A year later, 4 inches taller, 15 lbs heavier and 12 monthes of distance running and weight training in JV Track and Field, it was no problem. Of course that was back in "Good Ole Days" of scouting when we stalked, signaled, made fires, had canvas tents, wrestled bears, yada, yada, yada.

Just to be relevant to the thread, I tend to agree with the age floors the new requirements have.

SA

I guess I'll jump in with my 2 cents.

Before I did anything I would want to make sure it was my son's decision. Eagle in KY had a lot of good questions to consider. I would ask my son if he is still having fun? Does he think he will continue to have fun? If he joined another troop with a different approach does he think he could have at least as much fun or more fun than he's having now?

Remember, fun with a purpose. Let's not mess up the fun, because we are totally focused the other reasons we want our sons to participate in scouting or because of how we're involved with scouting.

In the case of Goodkidsmom, from her description, it made it sound as if her son was not having much fun and was being unfairly limited in his advancement so it seemed to make sense for him to explore other options. The issues were focused on her son's situation in the troop.

At this point based on what you've posted so far, I don't see enough indication that your son feels strongly enough about the situation to make a move. However I will also say it is always worth it to stay aware of options. So it is worth while to explore other troops in the area and what kinds of things their doing. Given your involvement in the District I suspect you have a pretty good idea of what the other troops are doing.

I guess I can understand your frustration with the troop leadership but my short answer would be that troop membership is primarily for your son. If he is or can be happy where he is and doesn't see how a move could improve things for him, he should stay. If he is not happy and he believes a change in troops would benefit him, he should explore that option, with your help. The fact that you and the current leadership of the troop don't agree on things, should not enter into the decision. You can stay involved in scouting at the District Level or even get involved with another troop if you wish. If your son wants you involved in his troop then he may need to consider making a move, but that's something for him to consider.

Let me make it clear, I am not defending the troop leadership. I don't even know the issues. I just think the issue of troop membership should be focused on your son's situation and not how well you get along with the current leadership of the troop.

Either way. Best of luck.

SA

Just a note to add my Thumbs Up to the choice of moderators!

SA

"In light of the changes that have been made to the forum I have decided to return. "

YIPPEE!

SA

Our camp does not do Blue Cards either. They havn't used them apparently for years. Scouts do get a signed merit badge application form that includes the counselors signature and all the requirements for the merit badge listed.

In fact, except for last year, scouts actually recieved their MBs and signed MB cards on the last day of camp. At that point the signed MB cards are documentation that the scout has earned the badge and the forms or Blue cards are moot.

SA

Through the WHEELER fiasco I found myself being drawn in and posted a few items I later regretted. This time around I was more restrained in my participation but found myself strangely drawn to the ongoing train wreck in the True Religions thread. There were many very thoughtful posts and initially it was an interesting discussion of a sensitive subject that eventually deteriorated. While I did not participate that much directly I confess I found myself silently supporting certain posters versus others.

However, regarding the fact that Youth members are watching and what might they be learning I hope they have followed this episode through to it's conclusion. Once one has been shown to be untrustworthy, their honor is lost and it is nearly impossible to regain.

We have also lost the participation of two long time participants that have made a great contribution to the forum over the years I have monitored the forum. I hope they reconsider. I'm hoping after a break of a few weeks or maybe months they return to offer their insights. I don't agree with everyone on the board all the time but I have appreciated the thoughts and ideas of everyone.

SA

I confess I too have been following the recent activity on the forum with a mixture of amusement and dismay. I had nothing constructive to add so I havn't said much. What started out as a very thoughtful discussion of the role of religion in scouting turned rather nasty to say the least. For many of you who put thought into coherent posts, I enjoyed monitoring the discussion until things slowly slipped as one poster seem to drag the entire discussion down.

I also hope both BobW and Eamonn come back and continue to add their insight.

Have a good weekend all.

SA

Personally I like super crunchy with honey on just about anything.

Now I can remember being a freshman in college and my roomate and I purchased the largest tub of super crunchy generic brand PB we could find. It must have been at least a couple of gallons. Never refridgerated it and it lasted the better part of the semester. It was eventually consumed by the 20 guys housed on our wing.

SA

CaveEagle,

The schedule we did last year for a similar 4 day trip was:

Arrive Thursday Afternoon, Went to the visitor centor and electric map. This gave us all an overview of what we would see the next few days.

Did the Historic Town Walk Thursday Evening. (Note it's much more than a walk, we didn't finish until about 10:30pm)

Friday, we did the 10 mile trail and that evening the pool at the Y.

Saturday we did the Johnny Reb trail in the morning and the Cyclorama and Eisenhower Farm in the afternoon. (That night we were treated to a fireworks display over the Battlefield we didn't know was going to happen.) Some scouts & adults went into town to do one of the Haunted Gettysburg walks. (Chase ghosts at night, seems like every town has one of these now.)

Sunday, we relaxed. Some went back to the visitor's center in the morning. We had a short "generic" service reflecting on the events of history. (That debate goes on next door.) And went home.

It was hectic, but we were able to fit in all the elements required for the Heritage Trail Medal. It was tiring, and to do all the elements in three and half days was a challenge. All that went and earned the Heritage Trail medal wear it with pride though. I had one scout tell me it was the best outing he had been on in his 5 years with the troop.

Good Luck.

SA

In another thread we had a relatively in depth discussion on BSA governance and who has a say in what. From that discussion I got the impression that volunteers and scouts have very little say in what goes on beyond the unit level. If you want to influence the program beyond the unit level you need to involve the chartering organizations. Get Charter Organization Reps and the Charter Organization Institutional heads to speak up. My bet is they are more likely to be listened to at the council and national level.

Good luck.

SA

TP,

I have no recommendation on campgrounds but the local Y refered to in the camp literature for showers has an excellent swimming pool with a lifeguard available. When we went we rented the pool for an hour at $60.00 instead of paying $2.00 per scout for a shower. It was a little more $$$ but the pool was worth it. We still got showers.

They also have the largest hot tub spa I've ever seen, and it is restricted to adults. It felt like heaven after the 10 miler.

SA